Car Amps and Speakers

[obeseotron]

I ask these questions here a lot, if anyone knows a good car audio help forum, i would be very interested.

I have a Pioneer DEH 3300 head unit that puts out 22Wx4 RMS and 50Wx4 Max. This is plenty for my 4" front speakers, but I need some advice as to powering the big 6x9" speakers I'm getting soon. These speakers will probably be rated around 100W RMS, and I'm pretty sure that I'll need an amp. My questions are:

1. Do I need an amp?

2. Should I get an amp with slightly less, exactly the same, or slightly more power than my new speakers?

3. Any good recomendations for a 2 chanel amp in that power range (cheapness very important) and perhaps where to get one.

4. How are the Infinity 6953i or 693.3i speakers? If they aren't good or if there is something better for a similar price, I'm interested.

5. Any recomendations as to where to go to get my amp installed, I can do the speakers myself, but not an amp.


Thanks a lot, I know its a lot of questions, and any input would be appriciated.

 

[Pyxis]

Here is a forum. I only asked a couple of questions there but I did get some great help.

Hope this helps

 

[Ns1]

Yes you need an amp

IF your 6x9's are 100watts rms, you SHOULD feed them 150-200 watts

So, I assume the speakers are 4ohms, so you'll need an amp that can do 200x2 or 150x2 @2ohms at the least

If you want a real recommendation, go to a real audio shop to get your stuff installed (al n ed's is not a real audio shop)

It'll be ~60 bucks to install an amp and stuff

May I suggest a jbl 300.1 amp, it'll give you 150 watts x2, which should suffice for your needs.

 

[techweenie]

Found this with a search on google.
Link

 

[lsd]

<< IF your 6x9's are 100watts rms, you SHOULD feed them 150-200 watts >>


You're kidding right?

 

[minendo]

<<

<< IF your 6x9's are 100watts rms, you SHOULD feed them 150-200 watts >>


You're kidding right? >>



i sure hope so

 

[minendo]

ok i use a 250 watt amp to power my sub (350 bridged). i sure would not use it to power my speakers. i use a rockford fosgate 100a2 to power my cerwin vega 6.5

 

[ckkoba]

1. Do I need an amp?

Welll~ It's up to you because with the amp, the sound will be cleaner and have more oomph to it. The head units although rated at 22w, usually don't sound as good as an amp that puts out 22w. This is b/c the head unit uses a chip to get the 22w, while the amp uses all those doodads to get the same power.


2. Should I get an amp with slightly less, exactly the same, or slightly more power than my new speakers?

For an amp, if you buy a major brand you should be fine. The power rating doesn't matter as much unless your going for maximum decibels. I would say like a Fosgate amp or simliar with about 60wx4 should be more than enough. I have a 40wx4 amp that I use to drive 5'1/4 components and 6x9s. They sound fine unless I turn the sound up really high at which point I get distortion (by then my ears hurt).


3. Any good recomendations for a 2 chanel amp in that power range (cheapness very important) and perhaps where to get one.

Fosgate is good with good power. Research prices on Crutchfield, then go to a local mom and pop store. Bargain them down (cause they make money off of installation). Install for an amp should cost about 40-60 depending on where you want it installed.
I would definitely recommend running all your speakers off an amp. And 4 channel amps are not that expensive.

4. How are the Infinity 6953i or 693.3i speakers? If they aren't good or if there is something better for a similar price, I'm interested.

Yum yum, Infinities are very cool speakers! Those are good, and so are Polks db series.

5. Any recomendations as to where to go to get my amp installed, I can do the speakers myself, but not an amp.

Small mom and pop shop.

 

[lsd]

Seriously you don't want more than 50w RMS going to the 6x9's. Reason being your the 6x9's will drown out the 4" front speakers.
Ideally you should change the front spkrs along with the rear spkers and power the new ones with a 4channel amp. But since it looks like your going the budget route don't buy an amp to power the 6x9's. Just use the head unit to power all the speakers.

 

[ckkoba]

<< Seriously you don't want more than 50w RMS going to the 6x9's. Reason being your the 6x9's will drown out the 4" front speakers.
Ideally you should change the front spkrs along with the rear spkers and power the new ones with a 4channel amp. But since it looks like your going the budget route don't buy an amp to power the 6x9's. Just use the head unit to power all the speakers. >>



But isn't the sound quality using an amp noticeably better than running off the headamp?

 

[minendo]

<< But isn't the sound quality using an amp noticeably better than running off the headamp? >>



yes it is.

in my setup i have a Pioneer head unit that does 40x4 powering the front Cerwin Vega 6.5 and a Rockford Fosgate 100a2 powering the rear Cerwin Vega 6.5. Then I have a Rockford Fosgate 250a2 powering a single Pioneer IMPP 10. I have to use the settings in my head unit to fade the sound more to the front so that I dont drown out my non amp powered fronts.

 

[lsd]

<< But isn't the sound quality using an amp noticeably better than running off the headamp? >>


Yep it is. But... When you turn up the volume high you're going to see that the rear is going to sound clear while the fronts are going to distort.

 

[Ns1]

No I'm not kidding. If you have 100watt rms 6x9's, what's the max? 170 watts? If your amp is only producing 100watts, what do you do when the speaker needs 130watts? <--- Not like it'll ever go that high, just saying

You feed the speaker more than it needs, not less

Go ask caraudioforum if you don't believe me.

Let's see what happens when you feed them 50 watts.

If they require more power, power which isn't there, guess what happens? Clipping, not your friend.

Clipping -> Damage -> Go buy new speakers

 

[ckkoba]

<< Clipping -> Damage -> Go buy new speakers >>



Feeding the speakers more than they need is fine, but i'd rather have a high quality 60x2 amp rather than a mediocre 120x2 amp. I really doubt that a regular person will use 120 watts of power when driving your fronts or rears. Now if we talk subs, that's a different matter cause more power really is nicer.

And anyhow, it seemed like the guy who posted was on a budget.

 

[ckkoba]

<< Clipping -> Damage -> Go buy new speakers >>



Oh, I didn't say what I was going to say. To clip speakers when yoru running 60 watts, you'd probably need to turn it up to more than a comfortable volume.

 

[obeseotron]

Thanks for the advice, I would like to add something. I don't know much about this but from what I do know there is the RMS or sustained wattage of the speakers and amp, and there is the max wattage that cannot be maintained. The Infinity 693.3i speakers I think I'll buy are 110W RMS, 330W Max. Amps also have ratings like this. One amp i was looking at was 100W RMS and 200W RMS. Another was 125W RMS and 250W Max. I think NeuroSynapsis is suggesting that I get an amp with a max rating far above the RMS rating my speakers (I might be wrong). I'm not sure that he was saying I should get an amp that puts out 150W RMS for speakers that do 100W RMS, but I could be wrong.

 

[Ns1]

I wasn't suggesting he get a cruddy amp. JBL might make crappy car subs, but they make good amps.

I really was suggesting 150watts rms amp for the 100 watts rms speakers. You'll never use that power, but it's nice to have just in case.

If you're looking for cheap gear, try TheZeb, great customer service and cheap as dirt.

 

[lsd]

<< You feed the speaker more than it needs, not less >>


You have it the other way around.
I'm speaking from experience, not by what joe shmoe says on some forum. I had a pair of alpine spr-175a components which are rated at 50w rms hooked up to an older 4ch 35w rmsx4 alpine amp. I bridged the channels to get 70x2 and hooked it up to the components. Needless to say I almost blew the speakers with just 20w more.


<< Let's see what happens when you feed them 50 watts. >>


These are 6x9's we're talking about here, not 12" subs. Those spkers he mentioned have a recommended power range 2-100 watts RMS. Any aftrmkt HU will have no problem powering it.

 

[ckkoba]

<< I wasn't suggesting he get a cruddy amp. JBL might make crappy car subs, but they make good amps.

I really was suggesting 150watts rms amp for the 100 watts rms speakers. You'll never use that power, but it's nice to have just in case.

If you're looking for cheap gear, try TheZeb, great customer service and cheap as dirt. >>



Nah, I wasn't saying he should get a bad amp either, just that on a budget, would rather get a lil less power and more quality.

 

[teriba]

Alright. Major overhaul here. Don't question it, just go along with it.

1) 6x9's are garbage. Are you putting them in the back of the car? Don't.

2) 4" up front. Are those coax or just woofers?

3) The guy saying that you want to feed them 150W because what happens when they want 130W, that's garbage. Amps have a maximum rating as well. But, it is much better to overpower a speaker with CLEAN (read expensive) power than underpower it.

You want 6.5" components up front, lower powered woofers in the back, and subs in the trunk. That's it, simple.

 

[ckkoba]

<< You want 6.5" components up front, lower powered woofers in the back, and subs in the trunk. That's it, simple. >>



That's great for the people up front, but what about those people who sit in the back?

 

[Ns1]

Where did I say anything about maximum ampage power? And we're not talking about a major system overhaul, and I never said anything about crappy power.

If you want to start factoring in crappy power, let's start with the basics. What if the ground isn't done properly? What if there's static(for lack of a better word, sorry, brain fart) along the line? MANY things can lead to dirty(once again, lack of a better word) power.

What do you expect a person on a low budget to do, go out and buy a PPI tube driven amp? I recommended a good amp for the price.

You must also factor in the GAINS on an amp here. How does 1 set the gains on the amp? If you're putting the gains on +10 well then no $hit you're gonna blow some speakers.

Oh yea, if somebody gives me good reasoning on why I'm wrong, I'll glady stand corrected =)

 

[obeseotron]

To clarify, the reason I'm setting my system up this way is not because I just randomly decided to do it this way. I have a crappy 90 toyota corolla that didn't even come with rear speaker cutouts. I have a pair of cutouts for 4" speakers in the front, and that's it. I'm getting a pair of boxes that crutchfield sells to fit 6x9" speakers in any car because I don't have any other choice.

 

[teriba]

Don't worry about it then. Get a new car.

 

[obeseotron]

You ever been 17 before? I get about $100 a week from work, that barely sustains me for consumable things (cigarettes, food, beer, etc) I'm not about to go get a new car.