Another doozy from an old friend ---- TEXT WALL!!!!!!!
Them: Well, Canada isn’t the bastion of freedom that it claims to be. You can get charged with hate speech for posting a Bible verse.
Me: https://christiannews.net/.../canadian-supreme-court.../
You know what, after all the times I have been called a pervert, a pedophile, and condemned to hell, all in the name of certain scripture verses from a religion I may or may not follow, I'm OK with this (I do believe BTW)
When myself and others get hate email and letters of ill repute or forced to move from states they feel threatened, I am more than happy to seek refuge in places that are willing to accept me for a reality that I was born with.
Them: Wow, that’s kind of shocking. Free speech is the cornerstone to a free society. I’m really surprised that you are ok with that. We live in a country where no one has to be ok with how anyone lives. Violence is obviously wrong, discrimination is wrong but I agree with Ben Franklin on this one. If you are willing to give up essential liberties for temporary safety, you deserve neither liberty or safety.
Another modern quote from someone I know “Quick message for the oppressed people groups of America: When you have every facet of society pandering, bowing, and conforming to your particular lifestyle and preferences you are no longer the oppressed. You are the oppressors.”
Me: free speech doesnt mean unlimited speech. Defamation and crying fire in a crowded theater are already SC proven reasons that free speech is not unlimited. Hate speech is another. Bullying is another. Free speech has inherent limits. We need to find the balance of allowing appropriate speech and avoiding harm caused by speech.
Them: yelling fire in a movie theater is illegal because of the direct danger it can cause not because the words are offensive. If speech can lead directly, not indirectly, to violence, I agree it should be stopped but not because of the actual words but because of the violence that it may cause. If someone says something that is offensive but doesn’t incite violence, then that speech is protected from the government. Obviously, there are instances where private entities can limit speech more in their spaces or on their platforms as long as they are still obeying all the laws that apply to their type of business or organization. If what someone says makes a person feel bad about his/her self, it shouldn’t matter. Again, I’m speaking about the government punishing someone for an opinion they may express, not that a person should be able to say outlandish things anytime or anyplace they wish without being asked to leave or whatever is appropriate. You exist, no law can take that away from you. Everyone else also has the right to their feelings as well. I guess it boils down to what you consider “harm” to be. Posting opinions that we don’t like or even make us angry is not harm.
Me: I really don't want to carry on the conversation. You are missing libel and defamation laws and really should take a look at the historical record of Ben Franklin's quote. There is context missing that needs to be accounted for.
Bullies are facing jail time as many have been directly linked to the suicide of individuals. Harassment can lead to restraining orders which then lead to jail time or suits depending on the jurisdiction.
I can get a very interesting visit from the FBI of I threaten the life of the president. Even though violence was not instigated.
As a physician, I have the legal right to detain someone for homicidal or suicidal behavior or statements for up to 72hrs and they must be seen by the state to continue these holds.
We detained the Japanese during WW2 because of their heritage. Their free speech was removed. Right now, there are several don't say gay bills in various states and books being removed from libraries. We restrict access to pornography or billboards around schools promoting alcohol or tobacco use. We have "decency" laws. Noise ordinances. HOAs that restrict flags flown on homes. You can't say you have a bomb in an airport or on an airplane. We censor politicians. Indicted individuals are directed by judges to keep their mouth shut about cases which carry potential consequences.
These are just a few I thought of off the top of my head where free speech is restricted with various consequences. Obviously some of them make sense, but regardless speech has been limited.
Yelling bomb in an airport can get you in jail for 5 years BTW. In this case, it's just words.
Verbal and sexual harassment can also carry fines or jail time.
There are currently several states I can be arrested in for going into the "wrong" bathroom. Florida is one of them. This is for government buildings but last I checked the airport is a FL government building.
I hope your day goes well.
Them: Yeah, we should stop this convo. These “don’t say gay” bills, as you say do not do what you want everyone to think they do. Also, using the bathroom you feel fits you is not a constitutional right. These laws are meant to protect people, particularly children. It’s weird that you only speak of limiting other people’s freedoms. Last thing I’ll say is causing a panic whether in a theater or plane is not about the speech itself but the intent. I don’t mean to sound brash but way too many people have died for our rights for me to not at least stand up for those rights.
