Can your credit score be ruined if the collector does not have your SSN

imthebadguy

Platinum Member
Aug 14, 2004
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I have an agency trying to collect back frat dues from me (which i refuse to pay, bc i no longer participate in the frat), but anywho if i dont pay can this affect my credit rating? I know for a fact that this agency does not have my SSN on file, and they have a ficticous address/ph num.

edit: to the people asking if the chages are legitimate or not here is the stort: i joined the frat my freshman yr in school, was a member for two years, and paid in full for those two years, and in the beginning of this year (jr) i decided its not my thing anymore and decided to quit, they tell me you "cant quit" and thus keep billing my through a billing company. now... i never signed a contract or anything of that nature, so i feel that i should be able to quit when ever i want, i never show up there anymore, or anything like that, but they still bill me and thus i refuse to pay
 

leftyman

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2000
7,073
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81
your destined for a life of rent-a-center, 24% used car loan interest, prepaid cell phones and blue hippo computers
 

OrByte

Diamond Member
Jul 21, 2000
9,303
144
106
once you have been referred to a credit agency it affects your credit score. The agency can also affect your score by documenting how late you are on payments, among other things.

pay the bill man, it isnt worth the damage that will happen if you don't.
 

Dulanic

Diamond Member
Oct 27, 2000
9,969
592
136
Originally posted by: imthebadguy
I have an agency trying to collect back frat dues from me (which i refuse to pay, bc i no longer participate in the frat), but anywho if i dont pay can this affect my credit rating? I know for a fact that this agency does not have my SSN on file, and they have a ficticous address/ph num.

If they dont have your SSN or your real phone # and address they have no way of finding out who you are to report you.
 

Pantoot

Golden Member
Jun 6, 2002
1,764
30
91
Originally posted by: imthebadguy
I have an agency trying to collect back frat dues from me (which i refuse to pay, bc i no longer participate in the frat), but anywho if i dont pay can this affect my credit rating? I know for a fact that this agency does not have my SSN on file, and they have a ficticous address/ph num.

If they don't know your address or phone number, how are they contacting you to try and get the money?
 

spacejamz

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
10,981
1,701
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Originally posted by: imthebadguy
I have an agency trying to collect back frat dues from me (which i refuse to pay, bc i no longer participate in the frat)

so the dues were legitimately assessed when you were participating, but since now that you are no longer participating, you are refusing to pay???? nice...

If i misunderstood that, i apologize....

 

TallBill

Lifer
Apr 29, 2001
46,017
62
91
Originally posted by: Pantoot

If they don't know your address or phone number, how are they contacting you to try and get the money?

lol, i was wondering that too
 

YoshiSato

Banned
Jul 31, 2005
1,012
0
0
I don't see how they can touch your credit report because it is tied to your barcode.

All anyone would need to do is look up your name in the phone book, get your address and report some false debts to a collections agency to destory your credit. It's very doubtful they can touch it.

 

imthebadguy

Platinum Member
Aug 14, 2004
2,703
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Originally posted by: Pantoot
Originally posted by: imthebadguy
I have an agency trying to collect back frat dues from me (which i refuse to pay, bc i no longer participate in the frat), but anywho if i dont pay can this affect my credit rating? I know for a fact that this agency does not have my SSN on file, and they have a ficticous address/ph num.

If they don't know your address or phone number, how are they contacting you to try and get the money?


they havent been able to contact me, but i suspect that they are trying, how, i have no idea
 

rahvin

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,475
1
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They need the SSN otherwise they could be reporting against the wrong person, people have the same names.
 

Pantoot

Golden Member
Jun 6, 2002
1,764
30
91
Originally posted by: rahvin
They need the SSN otherwise they could be reporting against the wrong person, people have the same names.

If your name and address match what the reporting agency has on file it can show up on your credit report. They can do this without ever knowing your SSN.

It is then up to the consumer to dispute items that are not theirs. This is common for people who have the same name as their father.
 

Future Shock

Senior member
Aug 28, 2005
968
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There is a company in Arkansas, Mr. Anderson. What takes place in that company is the following - in a deep dark level, that is not reachable by any elevator, nor reachable by any staircase, sits a giant computer. This computer is a 4000 node blade server with 8000 Xeon processors, each of which has 8Gigs of memory. It runs tens of terabytes of Storage Area Networks running a parallel virtual filesystem. It is running one of the largest data processing centers in the world, Mr. Anderson, and it KNOWS who you are, and the choices you have made - and can predict the choices you will make. It keeps a record of EVERY place your name and address surface in any credit record in the US, including all the linking information that it uses to figure out that it really is you (SS#, phone numbers, employer name, age, etc.).

This computer is updated weekly with all of the credit records that can be had in the US, Mr. Anderson - including your bank records, your phone records, your morgage records...all of them that they can buy. But it does not provide a credit score - it's only PURPOSE is to match who you are, with where you have lived, and how to identify you. It does that because that is what it does - takes an input of query for who you are, and spits back if it really is a match. It doesn't NEED a SS# number Mr. Anderson - because it knows. That is it's purpose - to know who you are. And that data is available to anyone, for a price. And it is purchased by Visa, MasterCard, your bank, and anywhere you may apply for a morgage. Even me, Mr. Anderson.

Mr. Anderson - pay the bill.

Future Shock
 

Eeezee

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2005
9,922
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76
Originally posted by: Future Shock
There is a company in Arkansas, Mr. Anderson. What takes place in that company is the following - in a deep dark level, that is not reachable by any elevator, nor reachable by any staircase, sits a giant computer. This computer is a 4000 node blade server with 8000 Xeon processors, each of which has 8Gigs of memory. It runs tens of terabytes of Storage Area Networks running a parallel virtual filesystem. It is running one of the largest data processing centers in the world, Mr. Anderson, and it KNOWS who you are, and the choices you have made - and can predict the choices you will make. It keeps a record of EVERY place your name and address surface in any credit record in the US, including all the linking information that it uses to figure out that it really is you (SS#, phone numbers, employer name, age, etc.).

This computer is updated weekly with all of the credit records that can be had in the US, Mr. Anderson - including your bank records, your phone records, your morgage records...all of them that they can buy. But it does not provide a credit score - it's only PURPOSE is to match who you are, with where you have lived, and how to identify you. It does that because that is what it does - takes an input of query for who you are, and spits back if it really is a match. It doesn't NEED a SS# number Mr. Anderson - because it knows. That is it's purpose - to know who you are. And that data is available to anyone, for a price. And it is purchased by Visa, MasterCard, your bank, and anywhere you may apply for a morgage. Even me, Mr. Anderson.

Mr. Anderson - pay the bill.

Future Shock

:thumbsdown:
 

Future Shock

Senior member
Aug 28, 2005
968
0
0
Originally posted by: Eeezee
Originally posted by: Future Shock
...

Mr. Anderson - pay the bill.

Future Shock

:thumbsdown:

Thumbsdown it all you wish - however be sure it's my joke telling, not the story itself. The company is Acxiom (google is your friend), the software that runs on said computer system is called Abili-Tec, which is itself an amalgamation of an Oracle database, some commercially available data hygiene tools, PVFS, and a lot of custom code. That computer description above is entirely accurate, and does not count the additional 2000 nodes that they have in the UK to process data for the EU. The nodes are a mix of Dells, IBMs, and HP - vendor neutrality. But they all run Red Hat 32-bit rel. 3 and are configured nearly identically.

And that's about as far as my corporate NDA allows me to go...I think everything I have said is public domain or at least non-proprietary. I have actually seen this system with my own eyes (part of it - it's distributed), and so can vouch that it is more than a marketing speil...

I guess my point is that anyone who is asking if they can find you without a SS# just has no idea how much is known about you, or how connected that knowledge is. And many of the followup answers also seemed to lack that understanding...so here it is, in about as much detail as I can spell it out and not get in trouble.

Be worried - privacy and anonynimity are things of the past.

FS
 

spacejamz

Lifer
Mar 31, 2003
10,981
1,701
126
did the OP ever post if these were legimate charges that he should pay or if they were bogus charges that he doesn't want to deal with?
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,337
136
Originally posted by: OrByte
once you have been referred to a credit agency it affects your credit score. The agency can also affect your score by documenting how late you are on payments, among other things.

pay the bill man, it isnt worth the damage that will happen if you don't.
Actually, you are wrong here, in a way that could mean a lot to the OP.

Your credit score is not affect immediately an account is referred to a 3rd-party collection agency. By law, there is a 30 day window period in which the possible debtor is allowed to dispute the legitimacy of the collection attempt. Most valid in this case would for the OP to claim that they have the wrong person or that he never authorized the charges. Without a valid SSN, address, or phone #, the collector is going to have a rather difficult time, and the collection should be dropped. This dispute process occurs in the first 30 days though, so moving quickly is important.

Consumers have a lot of protection against collectors, and for good reason. A few months ago, a major nationwide publicly-traded collection agency tried to come after me for a debt simply because the actual debtor had the same last name as I and lived in the same zip code. They told me that, because we had the same last name and lived nearby, we were likely relatives, and that "relatives can legally be held responsible for debts." Of course, that is a complete lie, and an attempt at fraud by the collection agency (even though this person was not even my relative). Needless to say, I successfully disputed the collection action, and filed a state AG complaint against the collection agency. Apparently, this tactic is becoming common.
The point here is that your credit score is not affected immediately after an account has been referred to a collector. You have the right to dispute the collection, and the burden of proof is on the collector. They must prove that the debt is valid, that you are actually the person responsible for the debt, and that the debt was originally incurred with your knowledge and consent.
Another example... some years ago the WSJ started delivering to my porch each morning. I called them up and told them that I had not subscribed and did not at that time wish to. The CSR told me that I was the lucky winner of 6 weeks of free subscription. Great, I said, as long as its free. 4 weeks later, I get a bill in the mail (and the WSJ ain't cheap btw). I called up again and was told a totally different story, that I hadn't won anything and that now I owned them for the 6 weeks. Of course, I cancelled on the spot, and told them they would never see a dime from me. Some months later, they sent me to collections. I disputed it and won on the basis that WSJ was never able to document a single instance where I had actually agreed to the subscription. I also filed a federal complaint against them for violation of mail-order laws. Funny thing is that I work in finance, so I might have otherwise subscribed to the WSJ, but now never will because they are clearly an unethical company.
My credit score btw was 789 mid-score using the real FICO model last I checked it (2 months ago), and lending people money is my business. Just FYI.


The OP may be responsible for the frat fees if he signed for them in the past, and then for up to the contractual period that he may have signed for, or until quit participating in the frat (read fine print). So they debt may be actual and it could affect his credit. With the missing and fictitious information however, he may be able to dispute on the basis that the collector will not be able to prove that he is the actual debtor.


edit: Future Shock, FACTA prevents companies from obtaining and/or reporting credit information without social security #'s and a verifiable home address. Just because something is possible doesn't mean it's legal.
 

LikeLinus

Lifer
Jul 25, 2001
11,518
670
126
Originally posted by: Future Shock
Originally posted by: Eeezee
Originally posted by: Future Shock
...

Mr. Anderson - pay the bill.

Future Shock

:thumbsdown:

Thumbsdown it all you wish - however be sure it's my joke telling, not the story itself. The company is Acxiom (google is your friend), the software that runs on said computer system is called Abili-Tec, which is itself an amalgamation of an Oracle database, some commercially available data hygiene tools, PVFS, and a lot of custom code. That computer description above is entirely accurate, and does not count the additional 2000 nodes that they have in the UK to process data for the EU. The nodes are a mix of Dells, IBMs, and HP - vendor neutrality. But they all run Red Hat 32-bit rel. 3 and are configured nearly identically.

And that's about as far as my corporate NDA allows me to go...I think everything I have said is public domain or at least non-proprietary. I have actually seen this system with my own eyes (part of it - it's distributed), and so can vouch that it is more than a marketing speil...

I guess my point is that anyone who is asking if they can find you without a SS# just has no idea how much is known about you, or how connected that knowledge is. And many of the followup answers also seemed to lack that understanding...so here it is, in about as much detail as I can spell it out and not get in trouble.

Be worried - privacy and anonynimity are things of the past.

FS

Do you use Aluminum Foil or store brand?
 

imthebadguy

Platinum Member
Aug 14, 2004
2,703
0
0
Originally posted by: spacejamz
did the OP ever post if these were legimate charges that he should pay or if they were bogus charges that he doesn't want to deal with?

updated :)
 

Future Shock

Senior member
Aug 28, 2005
968
0
0
Originally posted by: Vic
[
edit: Future Shock, FACTA prevents companies from obtaining and/or reporting credit information without social security #'s and a verifiable home address. Just because something is possible doesn't mean it's legal.

And Vic, if you look at most bank and credit card consumer credit agreements (and even many utility agreements!), you will notice that they EXPLICITLY assign away that permission to report and to recieve reports. So to get much credit, you have to agree to those terms...

FS
 

Future Shock

Senior member
Aug 28, 2005
968
0
0
Originally posted by: LikeLinus

Do you use Aluminum Foil or store brand?

I try to stock up on bulk items at Costco, so it's generic, but catering quality.

BTW - I have been building large scale customer databases as my line of work for Fortune 100 companies for about 12+ years...this is what I deal in day to day. My company is one of the largest clients of this technology in the world, and I represent my company on a fairly large geographical area, including managing our relationship with Acxiom.

Do you have something factual you wish to dispute?

Future Shock
 

rahvin

Elite Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,475
1
0
Originally posted by: Future Shock
Originally posted by: Vic
[
edit: Future Shock, FACTA prevents companies from obtaining and/or reporting credit information without social security #'s and a verifiable home address. Just because something is possible doesn't mean it's legal.

And Vic, if you look at most bank and credit card consumer credit agreements (and even many utility agreements!), you will notice that they EXPLICITLY assign away that permission to report and to recieve reports. So to get much credit, you have to agree to those terms...

FS

So supposing he had an agreement like that with a credit card company how exactly is the frat going to use that permission. Filing against him without having his number is fradulent, not saying they won't try but it's not legal and can get them in big trouble.