Can you spare a nano of your expertise, please.

[Goalie 31]

Hello there;

Warning? This will be the most boring request you have read in a long time but it will probably mean the most.

I'm sorry for the long thread but wanted you to know where I'm coming from. I?ve been reading some of these video threads and l must say I am very impressed at the level of expertise some of you fellows provide. This assured me that this was the right place to come for advice. I am very green in the video card and gaming world, as well as this forum stuff so PLEASE have patience with me.

I have been helping out a family who is on a very tight budget, just coming off a bankruptcy. They needed a computer to help with their small business and for the kids (10 & 8yrs) to do school work. I built them a budget machine Oct. /05 that I felt would suit their needs for a few years. Sure I could have gone cheaper but I tried to provide some quality to spare them some grief later (they have seen enough of that lately). I got a lot of stuff on sale and gave them my monitor and 3pc speaker set (I had to convince them that I was going to upgrade anyway). They don't know much about computers so I was able to pay for some of the stuff inside (memory, drives, PSU) myself but they wanted to see all the receipts for what they could see. Gaming was not in the picture but I made sure there was at least an AGP slot.

P4 2.4C skt478 800MHz 512L2 Northwood
Asus P4R800-VM Ati 9100 IGP 128MB (9200 GPU) & AGP 8X slot
512MB (2x256) PC3200 dual channel (max. or use 2700 or lower up to 4.0GB)
Antech 350w PSU
17" CRT (600x480@120Hz to 1280x1024@66Hz, recommended 1024x768 @ 87Hz)
XP pro

Here is my dilemma. Last week, the kids received the game "Roller Coaster Tycoon 3", as well as an add-on called "Wild", as a gift from an older, well meaning, aunt. Well you can imagine they're reaction. So now I need your advice on an AGP video card.

By the nature of the game I am assuming this is fairly graphically demanding. Am I right? The system requirements don't look too bad (I know they're bare minimum).

Roller Coaster Tycoon 3
Windows 98/ME/2000/XP
Pentium 3 733 MHz or faster (Pentium 4 1.3 GHz recommended)
128 MB RAM, 256 MB RAM for XP (256 MB, or 384 MB for XP recommended)
600 MB free space
4X CD-ROM (8X CD-ROM recommended)
32 MB ATI Radeon or GeForce 2 video card * (64 MB Radeon recommended)
16-bit Windows-compatible sound card*
Multi-player: No
Controllers: Mouse & keyboard only
DirectX Version: 9.0
*indicates that device must be compatible with DirectX 9.0

With the "Wild" add-on
Windows XP recommended
Intel Pentium III 1.0 GHz or compatible (1.3 GHz or faster recommended)
256 MB RAM; 512 MB for XP (512 recommended)
1.2 GB free space
64 MB or greater Hardware T&L capable video card, including ATI Radeon or nVidia GeForce 2 or higher.

I think this is probably the most demanding game they will be playing on the PC for a few years given the financial situation. They can't spend much but I want to recommend something they can use for a few years. I don't want cheap crap brand, too hot, noisy, unstable, just a decent card at a decent price that would play most kids games of similar requirements. The kids are young and set up as "Limited" users so something that I can basically set once and leave it.

I thought it would be wise to go to a 128MB card. Could they get away with the bottom end nVidia FX5200, or the ATI 9250 ($46)?????

This just in? Future Shop sale.
BFG GeForce 6200 OC (375/400) 256MB $112
BFG GeForce 6600GT OC (525/1050) 128MB $146 (Out of budget but seems good deal)

I know I can get used but don't want to spend weeks at this. I know this is so below your caliber but any insight would be so greatly appreciated. Remember, I am not trying to build a Gamer machine.

Thanks so much.

 

[xtknight]

I don't believe those games are too demanding. :Q I'm not sure you can find benchmarks on them. To be safe I'd go with the 6600GT but there may be someone here with a much better idea of how intensive (or unintensive) those games are. It certainly isn't one of the most intensive though. Besides, if you go with the 6600GT you'll have some more room to play other games later. That GeForce FX6200, is that supposed to be GeForce FX5200 or is it supposed to be GeForce 6200? And, BFG is a great brand by the way.

 

[unfalliblekrutch]

retail stores like to call them FX6xxx cards for some reason, but it should be a 6200. however, those future shop deals aren't the greatest. i've seen 6600gt's run for $100...although that one might have been PCI-e

Anyway, regarding your original question, have you tried running it on the 9100 integrated? It's a decent integrated graphics chip, and you should have no problem running rollercoaster tycoon on low/medium settings. In fact, i'd be willing to bet it could even run HL2 at medium settings.

 

[sisq0kidd]

That game shouldn't be too demanding, not even for the onboard ATI graphics you have integrated. I guess what I'm asking is, what's wrong with the game when they play it? And, have you tried lowering the settings to make it more playable? Also, do you have the correct drivers installed? (sorry if you checked all of these, I don't mean to come off arrogant)

Those are ok prices for the fx5200 and ati 9250, but those cards, in my opinion, are marginally better than your integrated solution you already have.

Also, do not touch that FX6200OC. I assume you are in Canada and the $112 is in Canadian dollars, but that is still awefully expensive for a card of that caliber. If you can, find someone in the For Sale/For Trade forum nice enough to sell you their old 9800 for less than $90 USD or a 9600 series for about $60 USD who is also willing to ship to Canada.

If you plan on buying a card not form the forum, then I suggest looking for the following cards:

ATI: 9800 series, 9600 series <-- These cards seem to suite the gaming needs of your family, but at the same time meet your budget.

 

[Goalie 31]

So far I can't believe the speedy responses you fellows have given. Thak you. I am converting $Cad to $US. As far as the integrated, I knew they were good but I assummed by the T & L requirement that not good enough. I installed and the kids tried to run when I was'nt there. They said it froze when trying to run the coaster part but I did not get into any graphics settings as yet. I will definetly check this stuff out. If I remember correctly I think the BIOS may be at default 64MB. I think drivers are up to date as I haven't seen any new ones lately.

 

[imported_Sincity]

You can find 6600GT on Ebay at a reasonable price. There was also this vendor that sold Refurbished ones for $99 + shipping. That should hold them off for a while. They could probably play some FPS (first person shooters) at a lower resolution (800 x 600). Good luck!

 

[xtknight]

Originally posted by: Goalie 31
So far I can't believe the speedy responses you fellows have given. Thak you. I am converting $Cad to $US. As far as the integrated, I knew they were good but I assummed by the T & L requirement that not good enough. I installed and the kids tried to run when I was'nt there. They said it froze when trying to run the coaster part but I did not get into any graphics settings as yet.

Froze as in system crashed or it was a slide show (just going realllly slowly)?

I'm not sure if the onboard ones have T&L (transform and lighting) or not. Some may, some don't.

Edit: a quick search on Google shows that the 9100 IGP does have a 'hardware T&L engine'.

 

[Crescent13]

Welcome to the Anandtech Forums.

I believe the 6600GT you listed is the PCI-E version, the AGP version doesn't have the 525/1050 clockspeed. I would highly reccomend an AGP 6600 or 6600GT though for your purposes.

I hope to see you posting around here some more

 

[Goalie 31]

Froze as in system crashed or it was a slide show (just going realllly slowly)?

Screen only, froze then they abandoned, hope they waited long enough!

OOPS! Didn't get the Quote right.

Must leave for now, I expected to leave POST and come back in morning to see what I find. Thanks so far.

 

[Goalie 31]

Originally posted by: Crescent13
Welcome to the Anandtech Forums.

I believe the 6600GT you listed is the PCI-E version, the AGP version doesn't have the 525/1050 clockspeed. I would highly reccomend an AGP 6600 or 6600GT though for your purposes.

I believe the 6600GT you listed is the PCI-E version, the AGP version doesn't have the 525/1050 clockspeed.


The ad does say AGP?

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Goalie 31
Froze as in system crashed or it was a slide show (just going realllly slowly)?

Screen only, froze then they abandoned, hope they waited long enough!

OOPS! Didn't get the Quote right.

Must leave for now, I expected to leave POST and come back in morning to see what I find. Thanks so far.

you might be able to get by with the onboard graphics .. . but you need to go into the game's "options" to set the resolution and details low enough for their rig to run them.

Also, check out Hot Deals forum . . . a 6600GT has been as low as ~$100 . . . there are great deals very often in your range.

 

[v8envy]

Seconded, the onboard graphcis should be capable of handling the older, undemanding game. P733 and gf2 requirements put this game circa 1999-2000, an integrated chipset from 2003 should be more than enough to play the game even at the highest settings.

Did you run memtest86 to make sure the ram was happy with that motherboard and current BIOS settings? Did you install the OS clean, or is the disk salvaged from an older machine? Did you install catalyst or omega drivers, or is it using standard drivers which came with the OS? Ditto ATI chipset drivers.

Sorry to imply that you're new at this sort of thing, but sometimes it's very easy to overlook the basics.

 

[Pete]

sisq0's got the right idea.

I'd probably try to find a used Radeon 9600 Pro or XT for around $50. IIRC, I tried the demo with my Athlon 2400+ and Radeon 9800P and I thought my CPU was holding me back. Their P4 2.4C should be at least as fast as my 2400+, so I wouldn't recommend buying more than a used 9800P or 6600GT for one game (especially considering their tight financing). $50 for a 9600P/XT sounds reasonable, IMO, and should do fine--not great, but fine. If noise is a concern, well, the tiny fans on those cards probably won't be music to anyone's ears, but it sounds like budget comes first. You could drop as low as a passively-cooled (no fan, just a heatsink) 9600 (not Pro or XT or the crippled SE/LE versions, just plain) and probably still get acceptable frame rates if you aim for 800x600 and medium to low details.

The nice thing is that it won't draw much power, gaming or not, whereas something like a 9800P draws quite a bit of power all the time (a 6600GT is closer to the 9600 when not gaming but the 9800 when gaming). If the PC is on quite often, there's no need to add (however little) to the power bill, as well, or maybe stress the rest of the system in summer heat (although that might not be an issue in their neck of Canada ).

A 6600GT or 9800P would be the minimum card for most of us "hard-core" gamers who prefer high resolutions and framerates in fast-paced games, but you really don't need to aim that high, considering the game in question and the budgetary concerns. A GF 6200 would be equivalent to a 9600, but I doubt you'd find one of the former used, so it wouldn't be as good of a deal.

 

[Goalie 31]

To all those who replied, I thank you.
The onboard graphics worked well enough from the start. So far, the game freeze was just in one scenario. Found there was a patch for the game, haven't tried same scenario yet. Also Installed latest ATI drivers and software (Catalyst 6.1 suite for motherboards with 9100 integrated graphics). These were 2 1/2 yrs and 15 updates newer. I have to hand it to ATI, they installed flawlessly. Left set to defaults for "Application Preference". Left game to configure best settings. No time to tweak and experiment. Kids are happy so far.

 

[n7]

That 6600GT was actually a rather good deal from FutureShop, but the sale is over now, so doesn't really matter.

On a very tight budget, the Radeon 9550s can be found for around $90 CND, & the eVGA 6600GT is about $170-180 CND.

 

[tuteja1986]

your a good man do you want a free ATI 9200 se 128MB free :?

I got one and its not going to use it anymore :! i can mail it for free, i do have other parts i don't use

PM ME I could always ask my friend and they should have a better free card :!