and what do you base your statement on? What some stupid assfvcks want you to think it says?
Have you ever sat down with any books to compliment your Bible?
You shouldn't really be saying whether the Bible contradicts itself or not if you don't understand the simple concept of imaculate conception, one of the key points of the message of Christ. Read the Bible (focus on the new testament) extensively, do some research, then come back and post in this thread
Originally posted by: Nik
You shouldn't really be saying whether the Bible contradicts itself or not if you don't understand the simple concept of imaculate conception, one of the key points of the message of Christ. Read the Bible (focus on the new testament) extensively, do some research, then come back and post in this thread
I have to ask. Would it really make a difference to you if Mary were not a 'virgin'? Suppose it was a mistranslation? Suppose they found a dead sea scroll which supported such a claim. What if she was simply a 'young girl'?
Does your belief in Jesus being 'the way' ride on imaculate conception or just your religion?
Originally posted by: Nik
You shouldn't really be saying whether the Bible contradicts itself or not if you don't understand the simple concept of imaculate conception, one of the key points of the message of Christ. Read the Bible (focus on the new testament) extensively, do some research, then come back and post in this thread
It is my understanding that Christian theology teaches that Mary was a virgin when she gave birth to Jesus. This is not possible because a women must have intercourse in order to get pregnant. This has been very well established in medical science.
If this is not a fallacy then nothing is.
Well I hate to tell you this but there are quite a few scholars that believe it to be a mistranslation and there is in fact a scroll supporting this.
Anyway.....I'm curious as to why you equate divinity with a virgin birth?
Also does the divinity of Jesus really matter. Could he not be 'the way' without being divine? Could not the God that is capable of all things which is the basis for you bashing eilute not simply work through Jesus?
Perhaps. I suppose that the scope of the question is such that it could permit things such as devine intervention. I must stop to ask though; What is to be considered a falsehood?
I'm not saying that virgin birth is a requirement or prerequisite for divinity, but if mary was a virgin when Christ was conceived, the only way she could have become pregnant was through divine intervention.
If Christ wasn't divine, his death on the cross couldn't absolve sins and the Bible repeatedly saying that Christ was divine would be a complete lie. Does it really matter?
Of course it matters. Christ's divinity is the crux of the gospel. If Christ wasn't divine, show me supporting passages from the Bible that says so. If Jesus was just "some guy" that God chose to work through, again, show me supporting passages. I don't really care if a handful of "scholars" believe something other than what it says between the covers of the Bible. I want supporting documentation for any claims, ya know?Originally posted by: Nik
I'm not saying that virgin birth is a requirement or prerequisite for divinity, but if mary was a virgin when Christ was conceived, the only way she could have become pregnant was through divine intervention.
If Christ wasn't divine, his death on the cross couldn't absolve sins and the Bible repeatedly saying that Christ was divine would be a complete lie. Does it really matter?
Nik I don't want to bash you or even question your beliefs. Mainly cause I have better sh!t to do but I think maybe you should do it on your own.....
Yes .....the Bible says (it really doesn't) that christ was divine. You say it matters. What of the sects that didn't believe Jesus was divine (ebionites) but felt he was the way?
I asked before.....would such knowledge destroy your belief in Jesus or your religion?
You will have to give me a second on the passages ......I have to piss. And why do you think such things are only contained in the Bible as you know it? Why do you think divinity matters?
Ever try looking at the NT from a.....lets say bhuddist like pov?
Oh and who says Mary was a virgin?
I'm not a bhuddist and have no intentions of ever being such, so it's kind of hard to know what a bhuddist POV would be, so no I can't say that I have. How can you say that the Bible doesn't say that Christ is divine? The concept that someone would even consider questioning Christ's divinity with everything they can read in the NT is so . What about those sects? They don't believe that Christ was divine? Cool. Their belief doesn't effect mine because I'd rather believe what I can read for myself instead of what someone else tells me that the words mean. If they read the NT and still don't get that Christ was divine, that's their reading comprehension problem, not mine If Christ was not divine, there is no reason for me to consider Christianity for one second more. I'd walk away and completely renounce Christ if someone could show that the Bible says that Christ wasn'tn divine. I'd still keep the moral/ethical guidelines because they're a great way to live, regardless, but that would be it.
I'm getting pretty tired. I keep re-reading "And why do you think such things are only contained in the Bible as you know it?" and my brain just isn't putting together what you're trying to ask. Are you referring to writings that some "scholars" believe to be divinely inspired, but have been widely rejected by well-established theologians as such? If so, I haven't read the dead sea scrolls yet. I probably should. However, remember that some of those scrolls are found horribly incomplete and have been "completed" by linguists trying to fill in the blanks with what words best fits in their opinion, but can greatly change the meaning. There's some passages about Mary Magdaline getting kissed often and being loved more than all the apostles. We can go over those later, but the original passage had more words missing than were found and words were injected to create a meaning which I don't believe to be true. More on that at some other time.
. What about those sects? They don't believe that Christ was divine? Cool. Their belief doesn't effect mine because I'd rather believe what I can read for myself instead of what someone else tells me that the words mean. If they read the NT and still don't get that Christ was divine, that's their reading comprehension problem, not mine If Christ was not divine, there is no reason for me to consider Christianity for one second more. I'd walk away and completely renounce Christ if someone could show that the Bible says that Christ wasn'tn divine. I'd still keep the moral/ethical guidelines because they're a great way to live, regardless, but that would be it.I'm getting pretty tired. I keep re-reading "And why do you think such things are only contained in the Bible as you know it?" and my brain just isn't putting together what you're trying to ask. Are you referring to writings that some "scholars" believe to be divinely inspired, but have been widely rejected by well-established theologians as such? If so, I haven't read the dead sea scrolls yet. I probably should. However, remember that some of those scrolls are found horribly incomplete and have been "completed" by linguists trying to fill in the blanks with what words best fits in their opinion, but can greatly change the meaning. There's some passages about Mary Magdaline getting kissed often and being loved more than all the apostles. We can go over those later, but the original passage had more words missing than were found and words were injected to create a meaning which I don't believe to be true. More on that at some other time.
Originally posted by: Nik
I'm not a bhuddist and have no intentions of ever being such, so it's kind of hard to know what a bhuddist POV would be, so no I can't say that I have. How can you say that the Bible doesn't say that Christ is divine? The concept that someone would even consider questioning Christ's divinity with everything they can read in the NT is so
I'm getting pretty tired. I keep re-reading "And why do you think such things are only contained in the Bible as you know it?" and my brain just isn't putting together what you're trying to ask. Are you referring to writings that some "scholars" believe to be divinely inspired, but have been widely rejected by well-established theologians as such? If so, I haven't read the dead sea scrolls yet. I probably should. However, remember that some of those scrolls are found horribly incomplete and have been "completed" by linguists trying to fill in the blanks with what words best fits in their opinion, but can greatly change the meaning. There's some passages about Mary Magdaline getting kissed often and being loved more than all the apostles. We can go over those later, but the original passage had more words missing than were found and words were injected to create a meaning which I don't believe to be true. More on that at some other time.
I'll stop here:
The ebionites didn't have your book.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebionites
I think you should question why you believe such thing more.......................as for me I'm off to gamble..................oh nooooeeesss I'm going to hell...
Jews != Christians
That being said, I'm way to damn tired for my brain to process that info. I'm hardly awake as it is. I'll read it later, but thanks for the link. It's pretty common knowledge that Jews don't accept Christ as their Messiah, if that's all you're trying to say. Still doesn't change my beliefs, but I'll read the link later.
That being said, I'm way to damn tired for my brain to process that info. I'm hardly awake as it is. I'll read it later, but thanks for the link. It's pretty common knowledge that Jews don't accept Christ as their Messiah, if that's all you're trying to say.
Still doesn't change my beliefs, but I'll read the link later.Nah, I already have. Same reasons I believe Catholics/mormons != Christians
They have really messed up beliefs and some beliefs that directly contradict the teachings of Christ.
Okay I'm going to bed. Really. I need sleep or I'm going to fvcking die.
They have really messed up beliefs and some beliefs that directly contradict the teachings of Christ.
Okay I'm going to bed. Really. I need sleep or I'm going to fvcking die.
?
Christians are called 'Christians' because they believe Jesus Christ is the prophesized messiah, the Christ, foretold in the Old Testament.
Jews do not believe Jesus is the Christ foretold in the Old Testament. Jews are still waiting for the prophesized Christ.
Hence, Jews != Christians.
Did you even bother to read the link that started this?
By your logic Christ didn't believe in himself nor do readers/ believers of the OT or Jewish Christians:
0roo0roo
No Lifer
- Sep 21, 2002
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http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/006073.../104-0223256-4003131?v=glance&n=283155
Misquoting Jesus : The Story Behind Who Changed the Bible and Why (Hardcover)
Fixed. Evolution is part of science anyway. can you disprove science? Science proves everyday that the bible is a lie. Yes i am jewish but more of an aethian. i believe in science and not in the bible. here is a quote from a good book i have.
or this better one:
Anyway, i don't mean to sound rude, but as the quote said, you don't have any evidence that the bible is correct and yet science disproves everything that the bible says everyday. so there's your evidence.
Look I dislike the blind faith in the bible as much as the next guy but.............
Science does not set out to nor does it ever 'prove' anything. You have a fundamental misunderstanding of science.
I hate to jump the fence but what about the Bible does science disprove?
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