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Can the US do anything about domestic propaganda/misinformation?

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vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
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It starts with a population that is willing if not wanting to be sensationalized and radicalized. You try and ban/block one avenue of "information" (note intentionally not using word news) but they will just seek out even more fringe and radical outlets.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
104,853
19,537
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This is basically /thread. An educated populace is inoculated to falsehoods, and a happy, healthy (read: not indentured servants) populace is inoculated to extremism and pandering.
It's why there has been a long, directed assault against things like "a liberal education." It's a word that absolutely does not mean what the conservative derposphere has long convinced their zealots it means. It does mean democrat. It does not mean leftists, but this is the definition that has been plugged in to their brains for so long, that you see this nonsense repeated ad nauseum here, without a single attempt by any of these people to ever question what that actually means. They "know," because all they "know" is whatever truths they need to tell themselves.

Classically, and fundamentally to this day--a liberal education simply means a diverse, well-rounded exposure to all forms of knowledge--It's not just science and math, but the pillars of knowledge that have existed just as long, and are still just as fundamentally important: the classics, philosophy, art...all of those things. They are fundamental for critical thinking, and for creating actual functioning adults.

This is why, while there is this directed assault on what that means, you now have people that seem to believe that the only purpose of education is STEM, because that is all society needs...this is observably, disastrously false, and it isn't any other way. At the same time, you have the same type of morons that claim these things, bitching and moaning that China and Japan are destroying us in education! We can't compete? Uh...why? It's because you dillholes have been systematically trying to dismantle what we have always done best with education--real critical thinking. Real creative, highly educated adults. STEM is only half, maybe less of any kind of real education. If you think rote memorization of fundamental laws is all there is to life, then you probably deserve the misery that you have absolutely brought upon yourself.

...and of course, this all plays into the same assault on education, explicitly by the GOP over the last several decades: convince the rubes that they just need to be unquestioning, functioning automatons that are highly-functional tech wizzes, they will never challenge what is going on around them. They won't care to observe, won't care to think for themselves, because they will be fat and happy in what is, fundamentally, a mediocre life compared to the trajectory that it was on 4 decades ago--when we decided to take all of their wealth from them, and give it to their bosses. They will be "happy enough," never accepting or ever believing that they are fundamentally valued at 60-70% less than what they were worth in the mid-70s. ...We took that from them, but they will never care, because they no longer trust "the elites," they are incapable of critical thinking and thus forming any kind of rational argument when challenged by the actual smart people that point out these fundamental facts to them--but it doesn't matter, because they don't care. They don't know what they don't know, so while they will continue to fail in defending what is their actual mediocrity, it won't matter because they don't believe. Truth is belief, and that is all they care about. Their brains are our prisoners, and that is all we ever wanted of them. Keep them fat and content, they will never know the theft that we have been funneling from them for decades. This, quite plainly, is modern conservatism. It is the plain truth, and best explained the then-scion of conservatism in his time, Barry Goldwater, and what he predicted is exactly what is, today, the modern conservative: ignorant to the core because they fundamentally lack the tools to know what they don't know--because faith is truth. Facts aren't facts when faith is all that matters. These are dangerous people, to any democracy. It simply can not work with them participating.



You can't talk to these people. You can't rationalize with them, because they have been conditioned from childhood to invent their own truths, and so they only find comfort in a political party that allows this expressly, and simply demands of them that they never question, never challenge. Remain fat and happy, distrust and smear those "elites" that mock your ignorance, that challenge your belief...oh but trust us. because we are the best!
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,178
4,069
146
It's why there has been a long, directed assault against things like "a liberal education." It's a word that absolutely does not mean what the conservative derposphere has long convinced their zealots it means. It does mean democrat. It does not mean leftists, but this is the definition that has been plugged in to their brains for so long, that you see this nonsense repeated ad nauseum here, without a single attempt by any of these people to ever question what that actually means. They "know," because all they "know" is whatever truths they need to tell themselves.

Classically, and fundamentally to this day--a liberal education simply means a diverse, well-rounded exposure to all forms of knowledge--It's not just science and math, but the pillars of knowledge that have existed just as long, and are still just as fundamentally important: the classics, philosophy, art...all of those things. They are fundamental for critical thinking, and for creating actual functioning adults.

This is why, while there is this directed assault on what that means, you now have people that seem to believe that the only purpose of education is STEM, because that is all society needs...this is observably, disastrously false, and it isn't any other way. At the same time, you have the same type of morons that claim these things, bitching and moaning that China and Japan are destroying us in education! We can't compete? Uh...why? It's because you dillholes have been systematically trying to dismantle what we have always done best with education--real critical thinking. Real creative, highly educated adults. STEM is only half, maybe less of any kind of real education. If you think rote memorization of fundamental laws is all there is to life, then you probably deserve the misery that you have absolutely brought upon yourself.

...and of course, this all plays into the same assault on education, explicitly by the GOP over the last several decades: convince the rubes that they just need to be unquestioning, functioning automatons that are highly-functional tech wizzes, they will never challenge what is going on around them. They won't care to observe, won't care to think for themselves, because they will be fat and happy in what is, fundamentally, a mediocre life compared to the trajectory that it was on 4 decades ago--when we decided to take all of their wealth from them, and give it to their bosses. They will be "happy enough," never accepting or ever believing that they are fundamentally valued at 60-70% less than what they were worth in the mid-70s. ...We took that from them, but they will never care, because they no longer trust "the elites," they are incapable of critical thinking and thus forming any kind of rational argument when challenged by the actual smart people that point out these fundamental facts to them--but it doesn't matter, because they don't care. They don't know what they don't know, so while they will continue to fail in defending what is their actual mediocrity, it won't matter because they don't believe. Truth is belief, and that is all they care about. Their brains are our prisoners, and that is all we ever wanted of them. Keep them fat and content, they will never know the theft that we have been funneling from them for decades. This, quite plainly, is modern conservatism. It is the plain truth, and best explained the then-scion of conservatism in his time, Barry Goldwater, and what he predicted is exactly what is, today, the modern conservative: ignorant to the core because they fundamentally lack the tools to know what they don't know--because faith is truth. Facts aren't facts when faith is all that matters. These are dangerous people, to any democracy. It simply can not work with them participating.



You can't talk to these people. You can't rationalize with them, because they have been conditioned from childhood to invent their own truths, and so they only find comfort in a political party that allows this expressly, and simply demands of them that they never question, never challenge. Remain fat and happy, distrust and smear those "elites" that mock your ignorance, that challenge your belief...oh but trust us. because we are the best!
Great write-up, and good summary.
Elitism is actually Intellectualism. Anti-intellectualism is actually pro-ignorance and pro-stupidity. The Republican party, for the last 50-odd years, has benefited directly from pro-ignorance propaganda, and pro-stupidity constituents.

Weak men who have forgotten the faces of their fathers.
 
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VRAMdemon

Diamond Member
Aug 16, 2012
4,913
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No simple answers for this complex problem. Low and no information voters are still going to be low and no information. They adore a President who is personally eroding trust in true journalism, telling the low/no info voters it is okay to disregard news that is inconvenient. It's barely a band-aid trying to cover a 12" long gash.

"The problem," said the theater manager gravely, "is not the people who keep screaming 'FIRE!!!' It's the gullible idiots who believe it, and trample each other to death trying to escape."
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
104,853
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136
should have mentioned all the tax money spent on trumps golf trips which far exceeds Obamas and the impeachment.

send her this link to really piss her off
Also remind her that Mueller's investigation turned up a net profit of something like $15 million, iirc, after reclaiming all that stolen money from all those witches that were convicted (especially Manafort)
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
104,853
19,537
136
Great write-up, and good summary.
Elitism is actually Intellectualism. Anti-intellectualism is actually pro-ignorance and pro-stupidity. The Republican party, for the last 50-odd years, has benefited directly from pro-ignorance propaganda, and pro-stupidity constituents.

Weak men who have forgotten the faces of their fathers.
I think the worst thing that has happened to this country was when the last living conservative (of his time or our time), George HW Bush was defeated in the primaries by Reagan. Conservatism died in that moment. Bush is the guy that coined "voodoo economics," and I am certain that not one single, living conservative remembers, or even knows this. He knew that Reagan was full of horseshit. He knew that supply-side economics was nothing but grifting the middle-class to forever trap wealth into the hands of the already-preposterously-and-undeserved wealthy.

He knew it. And of course it was the post-Reagan republican mindfuck on the people, to create this absolute myth that Reagan was some kind of "saint" of conservatism, when every single observable economic and policy metric that you can pin on Reagan tells a completely, inarguably, different story. Conservatives today are completely mindfucked.

They simply do not know what they do not know.
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,178
4,069
146
I think the worst thing that has happened to this country was when the last living conservative (of his time or our time), George HW Bush was defeated in the primaries by Reagan. Conservatism died in that moment. Bush is the guy that coined "voodoo economics," and I am certain that not one single, living conservative remembers, or even knows this. He knew that Reagan was full of horseshit. He knew that supply-side economics was nothing but grifting the middle-class to forever trap wealth into the hands of the already-preposterously-and-undeserved wealthy.

He knew it. And of course it was the post-Reagan republican mindfuck on the people, to create this absolute myth that Reagan was some kind of "saint" of conservatism, when every single observable economic and policy metric that you can pin on Reagan tells a completely, inarguably, different story. Conservatives today are completely mindfucked.

They simply do not know what they do not know.
I keep hoping one day someone will open a doomsday vault to find a family of conservatives living inside, including a 90-yo 'old world' father, with his 70-something son (hopefully with a gal that came in with them) and their 50-something grandson who's this pinnacle of true Republicanism from when they actually had legs to stand on. That kid then runs for president under the R ticket.

That's about the only thing that would recover the Republican party at this point.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
61,020
4,584
126
I keep hoping one day someone will open a doomsday vault to find a family of conservatives living inside, including a 90-yo 'old world' father, with his 70-something son (hopefully with a gal that came in with them) and their 50-something grandson who's this pinnacle of true Republicanism from when they actually had legs to stand on. That kid then runs for president under the R ticket.

That's about the only thing that would recover the Republican party at this point.
When Mitt Romney is being tore down by his own party for being a "RINO", good luck with that. There is no saving the Republican party. Its new inhabitants don't want to be saved.
 

[DHT]Osiris

Diamond Member
Dec 15, 2015
8,178
4,069
146
When Mitt Romney is being tore down by his own party for being a "RINO", good luck with that. There is no saving the Republican party. Its new inhabitants don't want to be saved.
They'd have to ride in on a golden chariot and slay all the existing members of the party, like some resurrection of Alexander the Great or something.
 

ivwshane

Lifer
May 15, 2000
28,623
8,748
136
It starts with a population that is willing if not wanting to be sensationalized and radicalized. You try and ban/block one avenue of "information" (note intentionally not using word news) but they will just seek out even more fringe and radical outlets.

I don't think you can block what people want to look at but I think you may be able to block what businesses are able to disseminate.
 

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