Can someone be smart and stupid at the same time?

[Duckers]

In my case, some people think that I have mental problems and that I don't act normal sometimes.
However, academically I have always been 'a smart guy'.

Is this contradiction possible?

 

[Viper GTS]

Many of the "brilliant" scientists of the past were also known for their eccentric, & sometimes downright anti-social behavior. Social skills & academic capability don't seem to co-habitate well.

Viper GTS

 

[ArkAoss]

yup, im an example of such, i taught myself calculus, but can act like a mental patient too,

 

[nateholtrop]

I know computers very good but sometimes i am immature...

nate

 

[Hoeboy]

i was in a magnet program at my high school and needless to say the "really" smart kids tend to have social problems. i consider them academic smart but life stupid. now i dont want to generalize or anything but from my personal experience i believe that if you are REALLY academic smart, something has to give and most of the time its your social behavior. these smart kids tend to mumble and do really weird things in class. i'd rather have a good balance between academic and social.

 

[Looney]

Not a contradiction, because you're describing different things. The way you think is mental, the way you act is behaviorial. Academically, you might be intelligent, but behavorially, you're probably a freak.

 

[Looney]

i was in a magnet program at my high school and needless to say the "really" smart kids tend to have social problems

Show me the research on this... because from the research i've seen, there is no correlation. There may appear to be a correlation, because when smart people do stupid things, it's more shocking, so you remember it more often. But if a dumb person does the same thing, you just equate it with his dumbness. But demographically, there are no difference. Your high school program was just passing on more false stereotypes.



<< i believe that if you are REALLY academic smart, something has to give and most of the time its your social behavior >>



If you think that the 'something has to give' is biological in nature, that when you get a certain intelligence, that takes 'energy' away from the behaviorial part of the brain, then you're completely wrong. Although our brain has a finite number of neurons, it's got an infinite number of connections (for all practical purposes... so don't start quoting me mathematics), so learning one thing doesn't take away from learning something else.

Biology may play a part though, it's jsut not how you think it does. ADD kids, when put in the right direction, will become so absorb in their study that they may neglect or are not interested in anything else, including their social life. So they fail to learn the correct social skills.

So biology may affect behavior. Biology may make the kid small, and he'll get picked and tease on. He'll retreat socially, and if he's directed right, will use that extra time and energy to study.

 

[Mucman]

This is totally true! In fact I have had 3 people say this to me &quot;For such a smart person you can be really dumb!&quot;. I know that for a fact. I don't consider myself smart though. My brother is a automotive mechanic for 10 years with no post-secondary education yet he knows far more than some people in 2nd year physics... he has taught himself through experience how things work. People think I am the smarter one because I know a lot about computers and my general interests in life are mathematics and the sciences. It's weird what people perceive as intelligence.

I have thought about this and I have narrowed it down to 3 different categories. Labelling someone as smart is entirely wrong. I believe people have 3 levels of &quot;smartness&quot; : Intellect, Knowledge, and Wisdom.

Intellect - This is your level of problem solving ability and being able to solve things with the knowledge you have. People who I consider intellectual are the great scientists like Newton, and Einstein. These are who I believe are &quot;smart&quot; people.

Knowledge - These are the people who kickass in Jeapordy (sp?). These people might not know how to comprehend calculus or simple physics, but the read a lot and absorb a lot of information. Many people think these people are &quot;smart&quot;. (btw - this all depends on your defn of smart, this is just my opinion).

Wisdom - This is being able to learn from experience. Since I got got shafted on the speaker scam last week, I have become a little bit wiser. Some people can be wise beyond their years because they can actually learn from other peoples mistakes.

I think people have a little from each of these... I know that my Mom has a lot from the Knowledge and Wisdom categories. I think that I have some from Intellect and Knowledge, but little from Wisdom.

Anyone care to comment? When you work a blue collar job you have a lot of time to think and this what came out one day .

This idea came about when I was thinking about what makes people smart... I always hear people labeling someone smart but it seems to be how a person presents himself. Sometimes we mis-label someone's &quot;smartness&quot; because of the way the person is presented. Even after I thought of this there was a small 1-page article in Scientif American about this thought. They said charm and power sometimes have an influence on what we perceive as smart... that is why George Bush beat Stephen Hawking, and Bill Clinton beat Isaac Newton in a study of sophomores and juniors about who is smart! Please don't view my spelling errors as a representation of how &quot;smart&quot; I am

Anyways I'm starting to ramble now...

 

[piku]

I have no respect for people who are &quot;geniuses&quot;, but wonder where Hawaii is on a map of Europe. (true story, might not have been Hawaii, but it was some US state)

Yeah, the book worms. I don't care how much book reading you do, if you fail to possess any common sense your stupid in my book.

I think people shouldn't be allowed to study, and THEN be given tests. None of this 10 hours of studing a night BS. Anyone can do that. Lets see how smart you REALLY are. I never study (minus like 10 minutes before a test) and I get B's and C's (A's depending on the class), which is much better than most A students would do I'm sure.

 

[Mucman]

I prefer tests where the stress APPLIED knowledge. Anyone can quote stuff from the textbook, but when you use the knowledge you have gained to problem solve that is good. I found my C++ course was really good at that.

 

[Looney]

<< I have no respect for people who are &quot;geniuses&quot;, but wonder where Hawaii is on a map of Europe >>



And i have no respect for people who seem to know all facts and figures, but don't have an ounce of reasoning skills or problem solving abilities.



<< Yeah, the book worms. I don't care how much book reading you do, if you fail to possess any common sense your stupid in my book. >>



What exactly are you referring to when you say common sense? What kind of individuals don't have common sense? What are actions that are without common sense.



<< I never study (minus like 10 minutes before a test) and I get B's and C's (A's depending on the class), which is much better than most A students would do I'm sure. >>



Hm, and you're proud that you didn't study and got Bs and Cs?

Try getting a job like that... 'hell yeah sir, i only got Bs and Cs in college, but i spent most of it drinking and rarely studied.' You think that's admirable?

College isn't to weed out the dumb from the intelligent... or that the grades measure how smart you are... it measures how well you have learned your material. Personally, i have more respect for the individual that spent 5 hrs a night studying so that he could get his MD, rather than the individual that had that natural ability to learn. It's like watching two climbers climb Mount Everest. One is a professional climber that has done similar feats many times, but one is a layperson who just began. I would feel that the layperson who just began (and no doubt had to work harder than the professional climber) should be admired as much or even more than the professional climber.

 

[Eeks]

There is intelligience and abilities that can be lop sided, but that's normal. Maybe you are socially retarded and brilliant academically. That summarizes the entire school of Harvard.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

<< Can someone be smart and stupid at the same time? >>

See ViperGTS for example
*snicker snicker*

 

[piku]

<< And i have no respect for people who seem to know all facts and figures, but don't have an ounce of reasoning skills or problem solving abilities. >>



I agree. This is also quite prevalent with smart people.

About common sense, I just refer to it as things you should know, and their application. (thats probably not the actual definition, but its what I meant then) Like the Hawaii thing - no textbook says that Hawaii isn't in Europe, but that doesnt mean it is.



<< College isn't to weed out the dumb from the intelligent... or that the grades measure how smart you are... it measures how well you have learned your material. >>



Thats true. But I still have more respect for someone who can pick up the material without studying their asses off. Sure its the opposite in the real world, but I never said it wasnt


(edit: stupid quote tags ;0 )

 

[Yeeny]

While I don't consider myself anywhere near genius level, I do think I am reasonably intelligent. And I have often wondered how I can be smart, and such an airhead at the same time. It's one of lifes great mysteries I guess.

 

[Looney]

<< About common sense, I just refer to it as things you should know, and their application. (thats probably not the actual definition, but its what I meant then) Like the Hawaii thing - no textbook says that Hawaii isn't in Europe, but that doesnt mean it is. >>



I wouldn't call that common sense... i would call that disinterest. People only have a finite amount of time to learn, some just focus it in different ways.



<< Thats true. But I still have more respect for someone who can pick up the material without studying their asses off. Sure its the opposite in the real world, but I never said it wasnt >>



Well, we live in a meritocracy... we judge people on how successful they are. We don't care whether it came natural or if they worked their ass off. That's the beauty of this society... people aren't automatically labelled, judged, and segregated based on biology.

 

[Handle]

Mucman: if you are interested in different types of &quot;smartness&quot; I believe Howard Gardner has written a book discussing multiple intelligences. You might want to read it to learn more about the different ways in which a person can be smart.



And about really smart people having social problems. I would have to say that it does not occur at any higher of a rate than among the normal population. Of course, I don't know what you mean by &quot;really&quot; smart people, but if you are talking about the top 1% of students in an academic high school, then I disagree. I went to a very competitive high school (from an academic perspective) and I know top students from other &quot;academic&quot; high schools and most of them did not have social problems. They may not have been social butterflies with girls hanging off their arms, but they did not exhibit weird antisocial behavior.

Of course, if you are talking about supergeniuses in a certain field (top 0.00001%) then I may tend to agree. This is because, often, a brain abnormality (not necessarily a bad thing) causes both the problem and the super-ability in a certain area (human calculators).

 

[SirFshAlot]

I know people who score extremely high on aptitude tests, yet can't figure out how to complete the simplist of basic household tasks on their own. I consider those types not smart.
I rank smartness on adaptability, and that means how well you function in your environment. Most people live in an environment that requires social skills.
I also look at it in terms of evolution and the term fitness. Do your skills improve your fitness? Does the lack of social skills affect your fitness?

I would rather associate with people that are jacks of all trades than an intellect that is lost inside his/her own world jumbling numbers. Has anyone seen any studies on suicide rate in relation to IQ scores? I'd be interested in seeing that.
Fortunately, my IQ dropped during my later high school years with all the pot use. It made me more adaptable. LOL

 

[yakko]

You can be both. Einstien flunked out of school.

 

[SackOfAllTrades]

<< You can be both. Einstien flunked out of school. >>



No he didn't. In Germany, during he changed school districts where the grading marks were reversed. The school he transferred from gave him all O marks or something like that, which was the highest grade. The school he transferred to thought he failed because O marks were the lowest grades of that district.

Plus this was when he was like six or seven. I was smart up until senior year high school when my socializing skills overtook my intellect.

 

[Mucman]

Handle, thanks! I'm will definitely check that out.

 

[urbantechie]

Maybe. I am really smart at computers which landed me a job (only weekends and free time since I can't drive yet (underage) but I do the stupidest things. Maybe my parent's don't know what being a teen is. I just don't get it!!


Oh yea, like sticking M-80s in a Hollywood Video Return box!

 

[Hoeboy]

<< Show me the research on this... because from the research i've seen, there is no correlation. There may appear to be a correlation, because when smart people do stupid things, it's more shocking, so you remember it more often. But if a dumb person does the same thing, you just equate it with his dumbness. But demographically, there are no difference. Your high school program was just passing on more false stereotypes.>>

my high school program didn't pass on anything. it's from my own observation on the &quot;really&quot; smart kids. true that if a smart person do something dumb, it will be remembered more. but i think we're talking about behaviors that deviate from the norm and not just something dumb. for example if you come to school with poor hygiene and you sneeze on the person's neck who sits in front of you, regardless if you're smart or known to be dumb, people will still look at you funny.


<<If you think that the 'something has to give' is biological in nature, that when you get a certain intelligence, that takes 'energy' away from the behaviorial part of the brain, then you're completely wrong. Although our brain has a finite number of neurons, it's got an infinite number of connections (for all practical purposes... so don't start quoting me mathematics), so learning one thing doesn't take away from learning something else. >>

i don't want to go into biology since i admit i know jacksh!t. but from a sociological standpoint if you spend most of your time studying, you are giving away social time. i want to bring something up. don't you notice most, if not all, of the smart scientist and mathematicians in the past have some sort of weird behavior? if i recall newton was an outcast and einstein was very weird himself.

 

[Dameon]

Smart and Stupid are direct opposites, so I would have to say, on the official question itself, No.

But as to the larger issue, one can easily be FOOLISH - someone who may be very intelligent, but makes poor decisions. My uncle is a great example... very factually knowledgeable, but made very poor decisions about sex, family, credit, and crime and it's pretty much ruined his life.

One can easily be IMMATURE - someone who may be very intelligent, but may conduct themselves in an improper manner, or be socially inept.

One can also easily be INARTICULATE, but be very intelligent. This OFTEN occurs with computer-oriented persons. They may be very brilliant programmers, but highly unable to communicate their ideas to others, especically those unfamilliar with technology.

Often people mistake other attributes, such as those above, for someone being &quot;stupid&quot;. Personally, I believe much of it is due to their own laziness to properly look at the behavior and identify the true aspect they have a problem with. Instead, they take the easy way out, lump it all together, and brush someone off as being &quot;stupid&quot;.

 

[Handle]

According to my professor at university, Newton was apparently a jerk and quite hard to work with. In addition, his brilliant work in physics and mathematics was nowhere close in volume to his other work (it was on really weird topics). But enough Newton bashing.

About your comments though... like I said, I don't know what you mean by the really smart people, but most really smart people I know are very normal people. I know a lot of very intelligent people (do very well in class) and none of them exhibit that type of behavior. I will say that many of them are on the shy side, and more withdrawn, but not bizarre and not antisocial (note, shy and antisocial are not the same thing).