Can capitalism survive?

Painman

Diamond Member
Feb 27, 2000
3,805
29
86
America tends to do the right thing, after it has exhausted all other possibilities.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
Capitalism can survive as long as there is no government.

Capitalism can survive as long as there is no greed.

When human compassion, morals and values are cast to the side in favor of making money, then no, capitalism can not survive.

If you want an example, there was a scientific study that was delayed for 17 years by special interest groups.

http://blogs.nature.com/news/2012/03/embattled-scientists-publish-miner-cancer-study.html

The companies are more worried about being sued then the health and safety of their workers.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
The only people who "think" capitalism won't survive are the ones who "wish" it wouldn't survive.
 

ky54

Senior member
Mar 30, 2010
532
1
76
Capitalism, although wholly uncool amongst the oh-so-hip circles, is flourishing in an unlikely place - China. The question I've been pondering the last few years as we gallop to socialism/communism will China in the next 20 years be the beacon for capitalism?
 

Ausm

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
25,215
14
81
Capitalism can survive as long as there is no greed.

When human compassion, morals and values are cast to the side in favor of making money, then no, capitalism can not survive.

If you want an example, there was a scientific study that was delayed for 17 years by special interest groups.

http://blogs.nature.com/news/2012/03/embattled-scientists-publish-miner-cancer-study.html

The companies are more worried about being sued then the health and safety of their workers.

You just made a funny!

:D
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
You just made a funny!

:D

Yea, I kinda snickered as well.

I think the days of making an honest living are behind us. Instead of everyone being able to earn an honest days wage, companies look to squeeze, cheat, lie, con,,,, every penny they can.

Look at all of the people that were conned into signing flexible mortgage rates. The banks knew what they were doing. Get the people to sign the flexible mortgage, then hike the rates up so high the family can not pay, the bank gets the home, rinse, repeat,,,,.

Look at apple raking in billions in profits, but contracts out the production of apple products to cheap labor in china. Would there be anything wrong with having ipads and ipods made in the USA?

I think capitalism can work, but not while unbridled greed is involved.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
Do you own stock?

No.

I have talked about buying stock for a long time, but my wife does not like the idea at all. Last time I talked to my wife about buying stocks, we ended up getting into a big fight about it. The stocks only cost 60 cents, but my wife was dead against buying any.
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,563
9
81
Please, list the alternatives. I'd love to hear about all of those succesful non-capitalist economies.
 

QuantumPion

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2005
6,010
1
76
This guy was still optimistic in 1977: http://youtu.be/gaPO4j85irY

I highly recommend watching this very insightful 10 minute video. It's funny how applicable it is to today's situation. I guess history does progress in cycles.
 

thraashman

Lifer
Apr 10, 2000
11,072
1,476
126
Capitalism, although wholly uncool amongst the oh-so-hip circles, is flourishing in an unlikely place - China. The question I've been pondering the last few years as we gallop to socialism/communism will China in the next 20 years be the beacon for capitalism?

The version of capitalism that can't survive is the version of people like ky54 here. The people who feel that attempts to reign in the destructive version of capitalism that caused a massive worldwide economic collapse is itself socialism. Those people that view that any limitations on capitalism to protect the people, is communism. Capitalism can survive, if the people who don't understand the slightest thing about socialism stop throwing the word around like they do.

Basically ky54, I'm telling you that a view like yours does far more detrimental to capitalism than this boogie man of socialism you incorrectly perceive.
 

Matt1970

Lifer
Mar 19, 2007
12,320
3
0
Look at apple raking in billions in profits, but contracts out the production of apple products to cheap labor in china. Would there be anything wrong with having ipads and ipods made in the USA?

I think capitalism can work, but not while unbridled greed is involved.

Apple has LONG been the staple of greed in the market. They would often take an already produced product, make a $50 change to the product to make it proprietary to Apple, and then they jack the price up 100-150%. I could give you examples I ran across that would make you sick to your stomach.

Apple is finally trying to make less expensive stuff. You can't make cheap electronics in the US. It isn’t just the labor as most of the components in an iPad and similar electronics are not done by hand. If you put your Made in USA iPad out on the shelf next to a competing product made overseas , they are always going to buy the overseas product as it will always be at least 25% cheaper.
 

QuantumPion

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2005
6,010
1
76
Look at apple raking in billions in profits, but contracts out the production of apple products to cheap labor in china. Would there be anything wrong with having ipads and ipods made in the USA?

If apple products were made entirely in the USA, they would cost thousands of dollars. Few would be willing or able to afford them. Tens of thousands of Chinese factory workers would instead have to go back to subsistence survival living instead of working skilled labor which will eventually lead to a middle class in Chinse economy.
 

momeNt

Diamond Member
Jan 26, 2011
9,297
352
126
Please explain at what number of stocks held you are officially greedy.

Hoarding and greed are the two statist, socialist bogeyman that they will always bring out when they are in a discussion regarding capitalism. Nobody knows when saving becomes hoarding, or when good profits become greed, but trust them, they are there and we must watch out for them!!!
 

Franz316

Senior member
Sep 12, 2000
976
431
136
Another question is: can basic human ethics exist within a profit driven system? So far the answer seems to be no.
 

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
197
106
If apple products were made entirely in the USA, they would cost thousands of dollars.


No, they would not cost thousands more. Apple would just have to make a few billion dollars less in profits.

There used to be a time when most of the products we use were made in the USA. People were able to earn a good living and be able to buy consumer items.
 

Franz316

Senior member
Sep 12, 2000
976
431
136
There was a really good article on Zero Hedge yesterday showing where everything is heading. It's lengthy but worth the read. Here.
 

highland145

Lifer
Oct 12, 2009
43,315
5,740
136
Please, list the alternatives. I'd love to hear about all of those succesful non-capitalist economies.
Here you go.......no wait......:D
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]The Jamestown Colony was established as a communal society in which all settlers were required to work jointly together to provide for the community in the common store, as a whole rather than individually. As in most trials of this kind, many shirked their work and the people were not driven to be industrious but rather the few who were hard working provided for the whole who shared the rewards of their labor. [/SIZE][/FONT]​
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]"As at this time were most of our chiefest men either sicke or discontented, the rest being in such dispaire, as they would rather starve and rot with idleness, then be persuaded to do any thing for their owne reliefe without constraint..." John Smith[/SIZE][/FONT]​
http://genealogical-gleanings.com/Jamestown.htm
 

bfdd

Lifer
Feb 3, 2007
13,312
1
0
Yes, of course it will. Capitalism has always survived, bastardization of it won't last though. Nor will the current bastardized definitions of it last. People need to stop confusing capitalism with utilitarian faults of man. Short term profit gain over long term profit gain is NOT a capitalist principle. Maximizing profit is and all profit must be maximized for the long term or derp it's not profitable. Short term thinking stems from utilitarian beliefs of nothing but my immediate happiness mattering. Nothing to do with Capitalism.
 

crownjules

Diamond Member
Jul 7, 2005
4,858
0
76
If apple products were made entirely in the USA, they would cost thousands of dollars. Few would be willing or able to afford them. Tens of thousands of Chinese factory workers would instead have to go back to subsistence survival living instead of working skilled labor which will eventually lead to a middle class in Chinse economy.

At what point did we become so altruistic towards the Chinese worker and not the American worker? What about the skilled labor and middle class of the American economy?

If the products were made in the USA, yes they'd cost more than they do now. But then we'd also have less families relying on minimum wage service sector jobs. Or worse, government assistance/handouts. The average household income level would be higher and people could afford the higher price of such items. But in their rush to satisfy investors, companies have taken out the legs of the American economy. Moving those jobs overseas to take advantage of lower wages and lax regulations kept their products cheap but removed those jobs from our economy. Now we reap what we sow.