Buying New A64 System

[RobSandbach]

Hi there,

Was poking around for CPU reviews and came across a thread in this forum. Figured everyone seems knowledgable and friendly round here, so I thought I'd post a few questions I have about my next system 🙂 I have read through 10's of reviews, guides to overclocking, benchmark comparisons etc. but find some to be contradictory, wouldn't mind a few more personalised opnions from those in the know 🙂 Anyway enough blabbering here's the main parts im considering at the mo:

Abit AN8 SLi Fatal1ty nForce4 SLi (Socket 939) PCI-Express Motherboard
AMD Athlon 64 3700+ San Diego 90nm (Socket 939) - Retail
4 x 512mb PC???? OCZ DDR Ram
1 x Western Digital Raptor 74GB
1 x Western Digital Caviar Special Edition 320GB SATA 8MB Cache
ATi x850 XT Video Card

Quite a standard PC for o/c'ing standards I believe. It's primary uses will be gaming and 3D modeling/animating/rendering.

Now I have a few questions which I could do with some help with 🙂 First of all:

1) I definetly want 2gb of ram in this machine (For my rending, please just accept this as a fact 😉) but I don't know the best configuration/speeds. I've always understood that having more sticks is better (2 x 512mb > 1 x 1024mb), but im not sure if that's just for the dual channel rate. Would 4x512s, or 2x1gbs be most productive (assuming I will not want to upgrade in the future), and which will lend itself to overclocking more?

2) I'm a little confused over memory timings, and the use of a 'splitter'. I've read some places I'll want to get PC4000 or PC4400 so I can push to 250-300mhz. Other places I've read that getting expensive overclocking memory is futile because of a memory controller on the chip. I confess to being very confused at the different articles and guides about this.

3) Using the 2 different speed HD's won't cause any problems will it? I want my OS and gaming/3d apps on the raptor, then media files on the larger drive, an 'archive' kind of. Is this setup going to hinder the raptors speed?

I think they're my main questions before I go ahead and spend this wad of cash 🙂 I look forward to tinkering with the o/c'ing abilities, just want to make sure the parts I buy are all going to work well together and lend themselves towards some high speeds 🙂 The system is going to be watercooled, but I need a little more research into which solution I'll be going for tbh. Im new to the water scene so I'm quite excited at getting my feet 'wet' 😉

Thanks in advance for your help/response 🙂

Rob

 

[n7]

Looks good, but don't waste money on that motherboard. For OCing, the DFI nForce 4 one is the best regarded.
If you can, getting 2x1024 MB of RAM would be the best, since i believe that will allow you run in 1T rather than 2T with the four dimms. Slightly better performance.
Most people use a divider when OCing A64s. For example, a 166 RAM divider would mean your CPU runs @ 200 MHz, & your RAM @ 166 MHz.

Here's a theoretical OC:
Let's say you buy some good value DDR400 RAM.

You could run the CPU @ 11*250 = 2750 MHz, with a 166 divider, which would mean the RAM runs at about 415 MHz, which it should be able to handle.

Buying expensive DDR500 RAM, etc. generally doesn't provide all that much of a performance increase with A64s.

Make sure you get a good PSU with that system as well...i'd likely look at an OC Powerstream 520W.

 

[sangyup81]

1.) While the 4x512 would be cheaper, 2x1024 will give you less of a headache even if you're getting a San Diego chip. If you do get 4x512, I suggest the OCZ VX or EL Platinums.

2.) Yup, the memory controller is on the chip. The Athlon 64 favors low latency over high bandwith. Also, using a divider does not hurt the performance of this chip like it would with P4s and Athlon XPs.

3.) Right, doesn't matter. Is money an issue for you? If it is, I wouldn't waste my money on a Raptor. Extra heat, noise, and much higher cost yet not enough performance increase to justify those.

Are you overclocking? If so, how come you aren't getting a DFI motherboard?

 

[coomar]

I can't find the timings for the ram but it has c2 in the name:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145575#DetailSpecs

 

[RobSandbach]

Thank you for the above posts 🙂

Well I shall be swapping in for a DFi, in a few group reviews the abit seems to come ontop, but on closer inspection, and from your advice I'll go with a DFI. As to the HDD, I think I might trade in the raptor for another high capacity drive, as you suggest. The only other wuestion I've come across is to do with my water cooling. Im getting a 'Thermaltake Shark' case, which is build with watercooling in mind. I was going to get the 'Corsair Cool', which I've read extremly good reviews for. But I've heard that Thermaltakes own brand 'bigwater' (which the case is designed to house apprarntly) might be a better option?

The site says "Universal 4 in 1 solution, compatible with Intel LGA775. P4 and AMD K7, K8 (Included AMD Sempron Series )", does that mean no compatibility with socket 939?

Thanks for the advice so far, it's been very useful 🙂

 

[Ruhnie]

Originally posted by: RobSandbach
The site says "Universal 4 in 1 solution, compatible with Intel LGA775. P4 and AMD K7, K8 (Included AMD Sempron Series )", does that mean no compatibility with socket 939?

I believe that the 939 pin CPUs are part of the K8 series, so you should be fine.

I'm glad you started this topic, as I'm in the same boat as you. I'm a semi-experienced system builder and overclocker, but never with an A64. I'm trying to determine myself if the San Diego 3700+ is worth the cash over a Venice 3200+. I'm sticking with AGP because I recently bought an X800XT. What mobo do you guys suggest? I'm leaning towards the EPOX 9NDA3J.

 

[AstroCreep]

Originally posted by: coomar
I can't find the timings for the ram but it has c2 in the name:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16820145575#DetailSpecs

Those appear to possibly be CH5-based DIMMs. Here's a link to Corsair's stie about them (scroll down about half way and look for part 'TWINX2048-3200C2PT'): http://www.corsairmicro.com/corsair/xms.html.

It says that theya re 2-3-3-6 on Intel platforms and 2.5-3-3-6 on AMD (though I'd bet they'd go 2-3-3-6 on A64). 😉

 

[theMan]

yeah, as long as you increase the voltage a bit, when i got that stuff, the spd was 2.5-3-3-8 and i couldnt get it to 2-3-3-6 without 2.8v, but that was when it was running at 215mhz

 

[richardrds]

Originally posted by: Ruhnie

Originally posted by: RobSandbach
The site says "Universal 4 in 1 solution, compatible with Intel LGA775. P4 and AMD K7, K8 (Included AMD Sempron Series )", does that mean no compatibility with socket 939?

I'm glad you started this topic, as I'm in the same boat as you. I'm a semi-experienced system builder and overclocker, but never with an A64. I'm trying to determine myself if the San Diego 3700+ is worth the cash over a Venice 3200+.

I would by the 3000+ venice core and be happy to OC it from 1.8Ghz to 2.7Ghz (300htt x9), not bad for a $160 CPU.

I am able to get a stable 2.5Ghz out of my 3000+ Winie on stock air cooling on a bad OCing mobo (Abit AV8 - Via Pro), and alot more people seem to be getting 2.7Ghz or higher out of the Venice chips now!!!

 

[RobSandbach]

Well guys I appreciate all the help you've offered me 🙂 I think I've finalised my new rig 😀

MyRig v2.0 😉

AMD Athlon 64 3700+ Socket 939 1MB Inc Fan
DFI Lanparty S939 nForce4 Ultra-D ATX
OCZ 1GB (2x512MB) PC3200 Dual Channel Gold VX EL-DDR CAS2.0
OCZ PowerStream 520w Power Supply
2 x Maxtor DiamondMax Plus10 200Gb S150
Radeon X850XT 256MB PCI-E DVI-I VIVO
Thermaltake VA7000SWA Shark Case - Silver with Window
Either Thermaltake 'BigWater' or Corsair 'Cool' CPU Cooling
Hyundai ImageQuest L90D+ 19" LCD Monitor

Yet to decide on cooling kit to buy. Now I know both are compatible its a tough call. The Tt is cheaper, and fits completely inside my case, which is a bonus, but I don't *think* it's as good, performance wise, as the corsair. I'll read some more reviews and find out 😉

Thanks again guys, and in a few weeks I'll probably come back with some o/c results 😀

 

[uOpt]

Insert ATI bashing here, I would always get NVidia cards for their better support.

I would allocate money right away to get a Zalman 7700 CPU cooler (or the 7000 if the 7700 doesn't fit) and the whatsthechars700 for the graphics card.

 

[cbehnken]

Originally posted by: MartinCracauer
Insert ATI bashing here, I would always get NVidia cards for their better support.

I would allocate money right away to get a Zalman 7700 CPU cooler (or the 7000 if the 7700 doesn't fit) and the whatsthechars700 for the graphics card.

Not to start an arguement, but machines that I've personally delt with get many more stop errors with nvidia drivers than anything else.

#1 Reason I went with ATI. I want stability.

 

[sangyup81]

Originally posted by: RobSandbach
Well guys I appreciate all the help you've offered me 🙂 I think I've finalised my new rig 😀

MyRig v2.0 😉

AMD Athlon 64 3700+ Socket 939 1MB Inc Fan
DFI Lanparty S939 nForce4 Ultra-D ATX
OCZ 1GB (2x512MB) PC3200 Dual Channel Gold VX EL-DDR CAS2.0
OCZ PowerStream 520w Power Supply
2 x Maxtor DiamondMax Plus10 200Gb S150
Radeon X850XT 256MB PCI-E DVI-I VIVO
Thermaltake VA7000SWA Shark Case - Silver with Window
Either Thermaltake 'BigWater' or Corsair 'Cool' CPU Cooling
Hyundai ImageQuest L90D+ 19" LCD Monitor

Yet to decide on cooling kit to buy. Now I know both are compatible its a tough call. The Tt is cheaper, and fits completely inside my case, which is a bonus, but I don't *think* it's as good, performance wise, as the corsair. I'll read some more reviews and find out 😉

Thanks again guys, and in a few weeks I'll probably come back with some o/c results 😀

Get a Koolance case/water cooler!

 

[RobSandbach]

I've always used ATi, seem to offer the best performance per £, along with, sometimes, best performance in a price range period. And I'm definetly going with the Corsair or Tt watercooling 🙂

 

[t3h l337 n3wb]

Argh, RobSandBach, you're too rich... I wish I had that much money to waste... Anyways, drop the super-uber-incredibly-expensive RAM and just get some value RAM sticks. Run a divider when overclocking, and you'll barely see a difference in performance.