Bush, Citing Fire Hazards, Wants Logging Rules Eased

justint

Banned
Dec 6, 1999
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I'm sorry but this article makes me laugh. The administration could at least come out and say they don't care about the enviornment or fires one bit, yet want to allow the logging to start.

From New York Times


August 21, 2002
Bush, Citing Fire Hazards, Wants Logging Rules Eased
By DOUGLAS JEHL

W ASHINGTON, Aug. 21 ? President Bush will ask Congress to relax environmental laws so that the timber industry can accelerate cutting efforts across millions of acres of national forest land increasingly prone to devastating wildfires, senior administration officials said today.

The plan is to be made public on Thursday, when Mr. Bush travels to southern Oregon to view recent fire damage there. But word of its basic thrust has already ignited a new political fight, with environmentalists condemning what they called a White House effort to promote rejuvenated logging under the guise of fire prevention.

After two summers in three in which the West has suffered devastating wildfires, Congress has already thrown its support, backed by hundreds of millions of dollars, behind a national plan to remove more brush and undergrowth from public lands to make them less susceptible to blazes.

But with the support of many Western governors and senators, Mr. Bush now appears to have thrown his support behind a plan to go further. As described today by administration and Congressional officials, it would give loggers greater leeway to cut commercially valuable trees, which environmentalists and many scientists say do not fuel fires the way the dense but commercially worthless underbrush and tinder-dry saplings do.

In particular, the officials said, Mr. Bush is likely to ask Congress to waive provisions of the National Environmental Policy Act, which dates from 1970, in order to streamline approval of what proponents call a necessary forest-thinning. The change would curtail the environmentalists' ability to appeal the logging plans, a legal tool that groups have used to stop such sales to timber companies in the past.

Already this summer, the fires in the West have burned an area larger than Connecticut and Rhode Island combined, and Western lawmakers have become increasingly outspoken in calling for more aggressive measures to reduce the fire danger.

"Without active management, we will be asking ourselves in a few short years where our forests have gone," said 15 Western senators, including Dianne Feinstein, the California Democrat, and Larry Craig, the Idaho Republican, in a statement earlier this month.

But the idea that Mr. Bush might try to set aside existing environmental laws in the name of fire protection has prompted an angry outcry from several Democrats and environmental leaders. A spokesman for the Sierra Club, Allen Mattison, said today that his group and others were concerned that Mr. Bush's plan might open the door to "runaway logging" in areas that are now protected.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
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Uh, in some places, he's right.

The forests grow in too thick, and many trees end up dying out and turning into dead, dry, kindling ready to catch on fire. Doing SELECTIVE cutting can thin down the forests and prevent the hazards.

There is also the no-touch areas where fallen trees aren't allowed to be taken out, and in turn, turn into nesting grounds for beetle infestations, as well as providing ground fuel for a forest fire.

Some times, hippy tree huggers with good intentions end up hurting the forests MORE than they do actually helping them.

 

BaliBabyDoc

Lifer
Jan 20, 2001
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Hey don't dis' Bush for thinking about this one.

BUSH: Cut all the trees down . . . nothing to burn . . . no more fires.

Sec. Norton: Well, you can't say that. Let's relax burdensome regulations so timber companies can cut more wood, produce more jobs, and reduce fire risk.

BUSH: Yeah, that sounds better I can use the regulations and jobs thing to raise money. Everybody hates fire . . . fire destroys the environment . . . so I'm the Environmental President.
(unsure if it is a joke everyone waits for Bush to smirk before they all break into raucous laughter).

Sec. Whitman: But Mr. President the loggers want to cut the big trees which do not contribute to fires as much as underbrush and little trees. Some timber companies clear cut regions b/c it's cheaper than more selective logging. Not only will increased logging destroy some habitats but it will likely lead to increased flooding and pollution.
(Silence)

BUSH: Who are you?

Sec. Whitman: I'm director of the EPA . . . you appointed me . . . I used to be governor of New Jersey.

BUSH: Let me explain something to ya, Chrissy. One, you got the job b/c you're a woman from a state I lost in the election. Two, the director of the ETA in my adminishun is responsible for making my policies look envirunmental. Four, we work by consensus here. So it's my way or the highway. Three . . . Jersey? Damn that 'hole makes the brownfields of TX look like daisy farms.

But with the support of many Western governors and senators, Mr. Bush now appears to have thrown his support behind a plan to go further. As described today by administration and Congressional officials, it would give loggers greater leeway to cut commercially valuable trees, which environmentalists and many scientists say do not fuel fires the way the dense but commercially worthless underbrush and tinder-dry saplings do.
 

vi edit

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Oct 28, 1999
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Laugh all you want, but I guarantee your attitude would be different if your house was threatend by a fire because environmentalists wouldn't let park services and logging companies come in and clean up fallen trees and under brush.

My (soon to be)inlaws sat with their belongings packed and ready to go for an entire month, just waiting for a phone call from the forest service telling them they need to evacuate their home when the forest fires ripped though the Black Hills of SD in the summer of 2000.
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
29,178
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Originally posted by: BaliBabyDoc
Hey don't dis' Bush for thinking about this one.

BUSH: Cut all the trees down . . . nothing to burn . . . no more fires.

Sec. Norton: Well, you can't say that. Let's relax burdensome regulations so timber companies can cut more wood, produce more jobs, and reduce fire risk.

BUSH: Yeah, that sounds better I can use the regulations and jobs thing to raise money. Everybody hates fire . . . fire destroys the environment . . . so I'm the Environmental President.
(unsure if it is a joke everyone waits for Bush to smirk before they all break into raucous laughter).

Sec. Whitman: But Mr. President the loggers want to cut the big trees which do not contribute to fires as much as underbrush and little trees. Some timber companies clear cut regions b/c it's cheaper than more selective logging. Not only will increased logging destroy some habitats but it will likely lead to increased flooding and pollution.
(Silence)

BUSH: Who are you?

Sec. Whitman: I'm director of the EPA . . . you appointed me . . . I used to be governor of New Jersey.

BUSH: Let me explain something to ya, Chrissy. One, you got the job b/c you're a woman from a state I lost in the election. Two, the director of the ETA in my adminishun is responsible for making my policies look envirunmental. Four, we work by consensus here. So it's my way or the highway. Three . . . Jersey? Damn that 'hole makes the brownfields of TX look like daisy farms.

But with the support of many Western governors and senators, Mr. Bush now appears to have thrown his support behind a plan to go further. As described today by administration and Congressional officials, it would give loggers greater leeway to cut commercially valuable trees, which environmentalists and many scientists say do not fuel fires the way the dense but commercially worthless underbrush and tinder-dry saplings do.

Lol, that was funny.
 

BaliBabyDoc

Lifer
Jan 20, 2001
10,737
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Laugh all you want, but I guarantee your attitude would be different if your house was threatend by a fire because environmentalists wouldn't let park services and logging companies come in and clean up fallen trees and under brush.

Hehehehehehehe . . .
One I would welcome the Park Service to come in and clean up fallen trees and under brush.
Conservative spending plan

Damn brush and fallen trees . . . we need roads
Rep. Don Young chairs the House Resources Committee and Sen. Frank Murkowski chairs the Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee. "We need to very frankly just keep cutting this budget back until they finally squeal," Young said.

Taxpayers for Common Sense
"They?re throwing good money after bad," said Michael Finkelstein, Director of Taxpayer for Common Sense?s Forest Campaign, "and the timber industry is laughing all the way to the bank."

But it appears the Forest Service doesn't clear more brush and fallen trees b/c they spend what little money they have building roads for timber companies and administering the sale of timber.

Most new roads are built by timber companies which are in turn reimbursed by being permitted to cut extra trees. When revenues from the timber do not cover the Forest Service's cost of preparing and administering the sale, taxpayers end up subsidizing timber companies- and the roads. According to the U.S. General Accounting Office (GAO), Forest Service road construction cost taxpayers nearly $245 million between 1992-1994, contributing to a net loss of $995 million on total timber sales. The Wilderness Society's analysis of the fiscal year 1994 timber program show that 109 of 121 national forests lost money on Forest Service timber sales.

Hmm back then they were cutting 4x more timber but losing nearly half a billion a year. Oops my mistake the timber companies weren't losing anything. If logging companies can't make money just cutting the wood they want, what are the odds they will spend time "clearing brush and fallen trees"? (And yes I am not taking into account the global wood and paper market and its effects on US industry)

The second problem with your statement is the pristine wilderness is the reason to have a home or explore these areas. Who wants to drive their X5 4.4 on a logging road? And everybody loves the view of a nice clear cut.