Bush adviser: Military draft worth considering

[1prophet]

Bush adviser: Military draft worth considering

WASHINGTON - Frequent tours for U.S. forces in Iraq and Afghanistan have stressed the all-volunteer force and made it worth considering a return to a military draft, President Bush's new war adviser said Friday.

"I think it makes sense to certainly consider it," Army Lt. Gen. Douglas Lute said in an interview with National Public Radio's "All Things Considered."

"And I can tell you, this has always been an option on the table. But ultimately, this is a policy matter between meeting the demands for the nation's security by one means or another," Lute added in his first interview since he was confirmed by the Senate in June.

President Nixon abolished the draft in 1973. Restoring it, Lute said, would be a "major policy shift" and Bush has made it clear that he doesn't think it's necessary.

"The president's position is that the all volunteer military meets the needs of the country and there is no discussion of a draft. General Lute made that point as well," National Security Council spokesman Gordon Johndroe said.

In the interview, Lute also said that "Today, the current means of the all-volunteer force is serving us exceptionally well."


Still, he said the repeated deployments in Iraq and Afghanistan affect not only the troops but their families, who can influence whether a service member decides to stay in the military.

"There's both a personal dimension of this, where this kind of stress plays out across dinner tables and in living room conversations within these families," he said. "And ultimately, the health of the all-volunteer force is going to rest on those sorts of personal family decisions."

Draft history
The military conducted a draft during the Civil War and both world wars and between 1948 and 1973. The Selective Service System, re-established in 1980, maintains a registry of 18-year-old men.

Rep. Charles Rangel, D-N.Y., has called for reinstating the draft as a way to end the Iraq war.

Bush picked Lute in mid-May as a deputy national security adviser with responsibility for ensuring efforts in Iraq and Afghanistan are coordinated with policymakers in Washington. Lute, an active-duty general, was chosen after several retired generals turned down the job.

How long is this guy going to last since he contradicts the President himself, in a political double talk sort of way, or are the current recruitment numbers making some feel uneasy?


Or is the draft inevitable if things keep going like they are?

 

[randym431]

Finally! The public taking to the streets, like in the late 1960's and 70's, to end an unjust war.

 

[UberNeuman]

I can't see why strong Bush supporters would be against this - we've had the draft for all other major wars, and to them "the war of terror" is the mother of all wars, so let's draft away.....

 

[Summitdrinker]

well.............I think the pres and congress (both worthless parties) are too weak to bring back the draft, there scared of it. what if people really get mad about the draft..some may not get re-elected

I say bring the draft back.........................nam 2 it will be

I think we need a limited draft...what if something big would happen next week? were not ready for it, at least train them, doesn't mean we have to ship the drafties to iraq.
but our goverment will screw that all up too

 

[gcy]

I think to be fair if the draft is brought back, no defferment allowed.

 

[Phokus]

I'm hoping they bring the draft back just so the public finally wakes the f up. I mean, sure everyone's dissatisfied with the war, but people aren't angry enough. Plus the chickenhawk a-holes who won't enlist won't have an excuse to not answer the call of duty.

 

[Summitdrinker]

ya, no special get out of it for the rich kids like last time

 

[1prophet]

Yep, none of this fortunate son nonsense.

 

[heartsurgeon]

can't see why strong Bush supporters would be against this

Yep, draft 'em all....turn you kids into men!

Let's also remember that our fav Congressman from Harlem, Charley Rangel (D) has been pushing to reinstitute the draft for several years now..

hey, it's BIPARTISAN!!

when they all agree on it (like the immmigration bill), you know we're gonna get scr3wed!

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: heartsurgeon

can't see why strong Bush supporters would be against this

Yep, draft 'em all....turn you kids into dead men!

Fixed.

If the war were justified, there'd be no need for a draft.

 

[Blain]

Originally posted by: 1prophet
Or is the draft inevitable if things keep going like they are?

"Rangel introduces bill to reinstate draft"
Charley would have let you finish high school, of course. :laugh:

 

[Lemon law]

Nixon understood one thing politically. He would be allowed to continue the Vietnam war by buying off the parents of the middle and lower classes by getting rid of the draft. And its somewhat the back handed point Rangel is making. This precisely the policy of a volunteer army that somewhat allows the US to have its present imperialistic foreign policy because we can say they knew the risks. And with a draft, we have to admit we are compelling our youth to submit to being canon fodder against their will.

But Nixon had a far easier time of it because we still had not passed the end of the draft age baby boom. And now we are at a lower point on the demographic curve at exactly the time the early baby boomers are starting to retire.

But anyone in or out of the military can tell you that the military had to spend a very long time rehabilitating its own public image after the Vietnam war. And that was precisely the idea of the Powell doctrine. And we all know what happened to Powell.

But we can see now that enlistments are really down and GWB has really damaged the reserve system. We may need to bring back a draft and then lose our imperialistic foreign policy in the short term. Or we can finally do what the Russians did in the early 1990's. And simply admit we can't have guns and butter and its better to have butter than guns.

 

[Jhhnn]

In the wake of Viet Nam, our volunteer military was specifically designed to deny the possibility of an imperialist foreign policy. Troop strength will never be large enough to allow it outside our traditional sphere of influence.

Shinseki wanted 350-400K troops to invade and occupy Iraq. There's just one catch- 350-400K US troops weren't available, and probably never will be for such purposes with a volunteer force. Basically, the reality of the situation would have deterred sane leadership, but Dubya ain't skeered, sane, or half as smart as he thinks...

Rangel's call for a Draft has been ongoing, an exercise in getting America's upper middle class to think about what we're doing, think about what it would mean if it were their kids getting killed and shot up instead of somebody else's... really an attempt to change policy rather than to change the military...

 

[1EZduzit]

We have a draft.... a back door draft implemented by the chickenhawks who have already proven they think our laws are for people besides themselves.

 

[heartsurgeon]

Charley would have let you finish high school, of course.

Lemme get this straight...you graduate H.S on time, you get drafted...
you screw around, need to repeat grades, don't graduate on time, your not drafted???
Does this seem a litttle odd (think about it a while).

also...

Nixon understood one thing politically. He would be allowed to continue the Vietnam war by buying off the parents of the middle and lower classes by getting rid of the draft. And its somewhat the back handed point Rangel is making.

let's make one thing perfectly clear...Nixon did not start the Vietnam War (JFK(D) and Johnson(D) did), Nixon was elected to office pledging to reduce our troop levels in Southeast Asia, and to end the conflict with "honor". Every year Nixon was President, the troop levels in Vietnam were reduced. Nixon did not "continue" the Vietnam War, he ended it.

 

[palehorse]

We don't need a draft, nor do we want a draft. What we do want is the political panzies to get out of our way so that we can take our gloves off and solve the problems once and for all.

 

[umbrella39]

Originally posted by: UberNeuman
I can't see why strong Bush supporters would be against this - we've had the draft for all other major wars, and to them "the war of terror" is the mother of all wars, so let's draft away.....

I 100% agree. Let's see how the support for this 'war' fades as a draft approaches.

 

[Jhhnn]

From Palehorse-

We don't need a draft, nor do we want a draft. What we do want is the political panzies to get out of our way so that we can take our gloves off and solve the problems once and for all.

How lame. GWB has received everything he asked for, every dime, every bit of equipment- you name it, congress delivered for 4 years.

Unless you're claiming that the Bush Admin is also a bunch of political pansies, too...

What would you suggest? Flights of 52's carpet bombing Sadr City? Declare the whole place a free-fire zone? Reducing all of iraq to rubble, marching the population off to death camps? Salting the fields, ala Rome's treatment of Carthage?

It took 30 years for the public to forget the lessons of Viet Nam, ones the Neocons never did learn, and for the same bitter bullsh!t sentiment to emerge among the warmongers-

"We Coulda Won except for the Pansies!"

America doesn't have the stomach or the lack of morality to win on the terms required, something that was obvious before the most excellent neocon adventure in Iraq... They and their intellectual mentors counselled Kennedy and Johnson, were discredited and driven out of the Democratic party, only to find a new home and even more money on the rightwing... and more maudlin emotionalism parading as patriotism...

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
Unless you're claiming that the Bush Admin is also a bunch of political pansies, too...

well, I never said otherwise...

What would you suggest? Flights of 52's carpet bombing Sadr City? Declare the whole place a free-fire zone? Reducing all of iraq to rubble, marching the population off to death camps? Salting the fields, ala Rome's treatment of Carthage?

That's a good start... well, everything short of the death camps and salting the fields. Allowing us to close with and destroy the enemy, properly, is all I ask.

It took 30 years for the public to forget the lessons of Viet Nam, ones the Neocons never did learn, and for the same bitter bullsh!t sentiment to emerge among the warmongers-

"We Coulda Won except for the Pansies!"

well, the panzies DID tie the hands of the military.. completely. Who knows what would have happened had the politicans stayed the fvck out of the way..?!

America doesn't have the stomach or the lack of morality to win on the terms required, something that was obvious before the most excellent neocon adventure in Iraq...

too true.. and too bad.

 

[ProfJohn]

I think people on the left are making too much out of this.

The guy said ?it makes sense to certainly consider it? that is a FAR cry from ?yes, we should have a draft.?

The military makes plans and considers everything. How many times do you hear a member of the military brass answer a question ?no, that is something we won?t do? verse ?that is something we will have to look into??

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: Phokus
I'm hoping they bring the draft back just so the public finally wakes the f up. I mean, sure everyone's dissatisfied with the war, but people aren't angry enough. Plus the chickenhawk a-holes who won't enlist won't have an excuse to not answer the call of duty.

I think that a great many people would voluntarily serve cocktails to their legislators, both in office and at home. Delectable Molotov Cocktails.

 

[1prophet]

Originally posted by: ProfJohn
I think people on the left are making too much out of this.

The guy said ?it makes sense to certainly consider it? that is a FAR cry from ?yes, we should have a draft.?

The military makes plans and considers everything. How many times do you hear a member of the military brass answer a question ?no, that is something we won?t do? verse ?that is something we will have to look into??

Do you think someone in the administration could have brought up the draft to National Public Radio of all places a year ago and still remained working for the president?

Frequent tours for U.S. forces in Iraq and Afghanistan have stressed the all-volunteer force and made it worth considering a return to a military draft, President Bush's new war adviser said Friday.

"I think it makes sense to certainly consider it," Army Lt. Gen. Douglas Lute said in an interview with National Public Radio's "All Things Considered."

 

[Lemon law]

Somewhat ignored on this thread is the three big realities. (a) We are coming into an election year. (b) Not only is GWB a lame duck, right now his credibility is in the sewer. (c) Any draft decision can be proposed by the President but still requires congressional approval very unlikely to come from Congress in the near future.

 

[dahunan]

The first people to be drafted should be the children of every politician who voted to invade Iraq

 

[Jhhnn]

From Palehorse-

That's a good start... well, everything short of the death camps and salting the fields. Allowing us to close with and destroy the enemy, properly, is all I ask.

Sounds peachy, except that it's tough to sort out the "enemy" from the civilian population in Iraq type scenarios... so we'll just kill 'em all, let God sort 'em out, right?

Seems incompatible with "freeing the Iraqi people", don'tcha think?

The whole point of the post vietnam military is to have a rapid reaction defensive force, not a force capable of subduing conquered territories and peoples. The latter requires a lot more troops and a whole diferent kind of expertise than our military currently possesses, as the situation in Iraq demonstrates rather clearly.

I recognize that's frustrating for the military, but then I never advocated sending them off on this quixotic quest for oil and glory, either... The biggest problem with a large standing military is that sooner or later some damned fools will try to use it as something other than for what it was intended, which is a deterrent against military aggression...