BulletStorm didn't sell well because of piracy

uclaLabrat

Diamond Member
Aug 2, 2007
5,621
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Publishers will never admit that their half-assed effort was to blame...talk about entitlement.

"We want to make all the money, we just don't want to do all the work!"
 

VashHT

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2007
3,251
1,239
136
Publishers will never admit that their half-assed effort was to blame...talk about entitlement.

"We want to make all the money, we just don't want to do all the work!"

Yeah that's exactly what I was thinking, they think their game should automatically sell well even though it was a poorly ported crap shooter.
 

frostedflakes

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2005
7,925
1
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I like how he basically just admits it was a crappy port and they put little effort into making the gaming experience on a PC enjoyable, but still just brushes that off and pretty much blames the poor sales on just piracy, lol.
 

Gheris

Senior member
Oct 24, 2005
305
0
0
Played the demo as well. Game was not very good. I have limited time to game and I considered the demo a waste, but at least it kept me from ever buying the game.
 
Oct 16, 1999
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I played through the whole thing after having paid $3 dollars for it. It was worth that and the time to play through but despite having its moments it was just not a great game relative to what else is out there IMO. I was expecting something more "from the developers of Painkiller." But yeah, let's blame pirates.
 

LurkerPrime

Senior member
Aug 11, 2010
962
0
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Maybe they should have loaded it up with better DRM. That surely would have cut down on all the pirating.

Joking aside, a half assed consolized FPS released into a world already saturated with FPSs, and they thought it was going to thrive?
 

thespyder

Golden Member
Aug 31, 2006
1,979
0
0
Publishers will never admit that their half-assed effort was to blame...talk about entitlement.

"We want to make all the money, we just don't want to do all the work!"

Admittedly it was a crap game. However, this is not an appropriate use of "Entitlement". Entitlement is laying claim and ownership to that which is not yours. They own the POS, they are just not willing to admit that it is a POS.
 
Oct 16, 1999
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A lot of companies out there seem to think they're entitled to the money in your pocket regardless of the quality of the product they produce.
 

QueBert

Lifer
Jan 6, 2002
22,863
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Um what? Bulletstorm was a great game imho, I know it wasn't everyone's cup of team. But overall reviewers really liked it, it's 82% average on Gamerankings, which is not bad at all. I absolutely loved it. Was one of the last games I remember actually beating. And I did it over a maybe 3 day period. Which is fast for me. It was short and linear but it really kept my interest.

This makes it sound like there won't be a PC port if there's a sequel, which makes me a sad panda because I'd absolutely buy it.
 

Martimus

Diamond Member
Apr 24, 2007
4,490
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The only reason I did not buy Bulletstorm is because it forced you to use Games For Windows Live. I wanted the game, and definitely would have bought it if not for that.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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Sorry, but I'm tired of the denial among gamers about piracy. It's an ignorant, knee-jerk insistence of fact based on nothing but that ideology.

I can recall PC publishers finding an estimated 90% of players of their games had pirated them about 20 years ago, threatening their staying business - so they made 'shareware'.

The level of ideology can even be seen in this case, when posters allege the publishes is blaming it all on piracy and denying it has anything to do with the product - when the very headline in the linked article says it's both problems with the port and piracy. But peope want to make the false claim, so ignore the facts.

There is no reason or excuse for players to excuse and deny the piracy.

Bulletstorm has a PC gamerankings rating of 82%, which is not bad at all, just as the publisher said.

Supporting, defending, denying piracy is a threat to the creation of the creation of good products - in part forcing them to shift more to forms less pirated, like MMORPG's.

There are no 'pirated copies' of World of Warcraft I know of, given the need for an online subsciption - but look at the market in stolen, hacked accounts and gold.

I've personally had my account stolen and hacked multiple times in WoW; it's a many millions-dollar industry. I can't count the phishing scams for just that game's thieves.

Some publishers have shifted to consoles away from PC's in large part over piracy.

Some of the ones who remain tend to pander to the PC crowd, reassuring them, 'oh we agree with you! Piracy is overblown! And when it's done it's by honest people who will buy the game! And whatever else you want to hear to make you feel good about the publisher and just hopefully be one of the few actually buying the game!'

They know they get 'street cred' by spouting the line denying piracy.

Meanwhile, a lot of honest publishers try to deal with the issue with DRM, with the problems that brings, and not working all that well to stop the pirates.

But as I said I'm tired of the BS denying the thievery. The sellers of games deserve to be compensated, and that's what brings quality new games. But not Bulletstorm 2.

Look, let's take just the comments of the CEO of CD Projekt, which seems to be a darling of the anti-DRM crowd by choosing to offer games without DRM.

Is it because of views like the posters above - piracy isn't really a problem, publishers use it as an excuse? No.

First, I just noticed he made comments like mine about the high rates of piracy for decades; second, he said: "We of course experimented with all available DRM/copy protection, but frankly nothing worked. Whatever we used was cracked within a day or two, massively copied and immediately available on the streets for a fraction of our price."

Then he went on to look for approaches, since he couldn't defeat piracy, that would sell copies despite it, like adding items gamers would only get by buying the games.

That's not excusing or denying piracy as a policy - it's trying to work around it, which might help the publisher but it at odds with the 'piracy denier views'.

Take the very visible 'no DRM' release of The Witcher 2. A very well-reviewed game, and one loudly being offered with no DRM, with many gamers praising that.

And how was Project CD rewarded for being a game that 'deserved being bought' as a poster child as a good non-DRM game? The CEO estimated the piracy on it:

"The result is roughly 4.5 million illegal downloads. This is only an estimation, and I would say that’s rather on the optimistic side of things; as of today we have sold over 1M legal copies, so having only 4.5-5 illegal copies for each legal one would be not a bad ratio. The reality is probably way worse."

So, 'probably way more than 4.5 million illegal downloads' for about 1 million sold, and that's a 'not bad ratio'. So, cut the crap about piracy not being a problem. It is.

Some games get made despite having that 1 to many ratio copies sold to piracy; big titles like Skyrim made good money despite piracy. Other games like Bulletstorm 2 - no.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
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The only reason I did not buy Bulletstorm is because it forced you to use Games For Windows Live. I wanted the game, and definitely would have bought it if not for that.

I started my post above when there were only 5 replies - your post is an honest position.

Unfortunately, publishers have to choose - GFWL offers some marketing benefits.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
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Um what? Bulletstorm was a great game imho, I know it wasn't everyone's cup of team. But overall reviewers really liked it, it's 82% average on Gamerankings, which is not bad at all. I absolutely loved it. Was one of the last games I remember actually beating. And I did it over a maybe 3 day period. Which is fast for me. It was short and linear but it really kept my interest.

This makes it sound like there won't be a PC port if there's a sequel, which makes me a sad panda because I'd absolutely buy it.

Good to hear! Sorry you don't get Bulletstorm 2 because, one big reason, of piracy. (I bought it too - two copies on accident, in fact - but haven't played yet.)
 

gothamhunter

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2010
4,464
6
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wall of text
No one was denying piracy being a problem. Everyone just stated that it didn't sell well because many reviewers and buyers stated it was a shitty game.

Did people pirate because it was a shitty game? Probably.

Here's food for thought - just about every game has a lot of pirates, but the ones that are overall good games still have good sales.

Sometimes I wonder how developers get piracy numbers - does anyone know?

Edit - also, people keep reviewing games way after their released. If I bought Bulletstorm for $5, I'd probably give it a good rating for a $5 game. Paying full price for it, however, left me a bad taste in my mouth, much like the dibacle of Brink.
 
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Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
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A lot of companies out there seem to think they're entitled to the money in your pocket regardless of the quality of the product they produce.

Gonad, please explain to me the companies, with some evidence, who expect you to buy their game despite bad quality? I'm not familiar with those companies. DRM, yes.

Are their companies who put out not so good games for sale? Of course - but you can not buy them, there's no indication they 'think they're entitled to your money' for them.

I'd understand more if you were talking about a market with less competition, with some more compulsary element, though it's hard to come up with many examples in the US.
 
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Red Storm

Lifer
Oct 2, 2005
14,233
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The game isn't very good (that's my opinion, and it seems to be shared by quite a few others here), that is the reason why it didn't sell well. Your 82% figure is from "official" reviewers who get paid to advertise the very same games they're supposed to be critical of.

Piracy definitely does happen with every title that gets released. It happens on consoles, it happens on PC. The issue is in assuming that each and every torrent download = a lost sale, when that is not the case at all.

Pirates are pathetic, as are publishers/developers who can't man up and admit they did a poor job. They deserve one another.
 

VashHT

Diamond Member
Feb 1, 2007
3,251
1,239
136
Gonad, please explain to me the companies, with some evidence, who expect you to buy their game despite bad quality? I'm not familiar with those companies. DRM, yes.

Are their companies who put out not so good games for sale? Of course - but you can not buy them, there's no indication they 'think they're entitled to your money' for them.

I'd understand more if you were talking about a market with less competition, with some more compulsary element. Like Cable TV.

Umm, this company seems to expect it, they admit to poorly porting an already poor game and then proceed straight to blaming piracy for it as if there is no other reason their poorly ported mediocre fps didn't sell well.
 

ImpulsE69

Lifer
Jan 8, 2010
14,946
1,077
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I hate to burst their bubble, but many games these days aren't even worth pirating. I grabbed this game at $5. The game was meh at best.. Are there pirates? Yep, but damn well guarantee many of those people who pirated the game pirated it because they could and never played it, or they gave it about 10 minutes before they moved on to something else. That's how true pirates work ;p
 

slag

Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
10,473
81
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There are no 'pirated copies' of World of Warcraft I know of, given the need for an online subsciption - but look at the market in stolen, hacked accounts and gold.

There is in a sense. Play on a private server and there are no fees to play. Instead of giving money to Blizzard, you are downloading the client for free and playing for free with the private server rules.

Thats a form of hacking to me because you are playing a game designed by the blizzard team but depriving them of their money.
 
Oct 16, 1999
10,490
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Gonad, please explain to me the companies, with some evidence, who expect you to buy their game despite bad quality? I'm not familiar with those companies. DRM, yes.

Are their companies who put out not so good games for sale? Of course - but you can not buy them, there's no indication they 'think they're entitled to your money' for them.

I'd understand more if you were talking about a market with less competition, with some more compulsary element, though it's hard to come up with many examples in the US.

I think EA whining about the poor sales of their mediocre game speaks for itself. There is a much larger trend of companies feeling entitled to the money in their customer's pockets that goes beyond just game companies. BoA is just one that comes to mind.

I'm not excusing piracy, I'm not saying it wasn't a factor here, but companies complaining about not making big money on a mediocre product get little sympathy from me. Not to mention there are other factors like the economy, customers waiting for inevitable price drops, and better products for customers to spend their money and time on being out there. Even in a perfect world decent products can get hit by these and other factors.

Are their any numbers on how much this game did make vs. what EA was projecting?