Broscience - Body Recomposition

[JJChicken]

Hey guys, I've been reading up a lot on nutrition lately, and haven't got a satisfactory answer on the mythical 'Lose fat and Gain Muscle' diet/exercise program. So what to hear your thoughts

Here's what I read/learnt/experienced so far:
- Generally need to be in caloric surplus for optimal muscle gain
- Need to be in caloric deficit for weight loss D:
- For novices (aka high body fat and low muscle), it is possible to lose weight and gain muscle at same time. I have done this as well.
- As we get more advanced in weightlifting, this becomes more and more difficult as it's harder to put on more muscle. So most people recommend a bulk and cut cycle.
- There's a few things out there on calorie cycling etc, but I don't buy too much into that so I won't mention it here

So here's what I'm thinking: If I am at relatively high body fat % (lets say 18-20%), can I stay at maintainance calories and gain muscle at a similar rate to a bulk? Because I am over my fat "threshold", will the body get the excess calories it needs for muscle building from my fat stores, essentially doing a body recomposition.

Obviously once the bf % gets low, this strategy doesn't work. But I'm thinking if this is a good way to bulk without letting the fat get out of hand.

Thoughts please from the ATH&F experts

 

[Zivic]

if you want to lose fat you will need to be in a deficit... how much? depends on genetics and how fast you want to lose it

 

[norseamd]

what can the body turn fat into as far as carbs and sugar and amino acids

obviously the body can not make essential amino acids

 

[Nebor]

You're still going to need protein. But you should be able to stay around maintenance and gain muscle\lose fat for a little while.

I'm currently on an epic bulk. It's going well. Possibly dreamers bulk.

 

[JJChicken]

You're still going to need protein. But you should be able to stay around maintenance and gain muscle\lose fat for a little while.

I'm currently on an epic bulk. It's going well. Possibly dreamers bulk.

Yes, this is what I'm talking about. We still need protein, but thinking of managing the carb/fat intake to allow for some usage of stored fats. Only works when body fat is high?

Details on your bulk?

 

[Nebor]

Yes, this is what I'm talking about. We still need protein, but thinking of managing the carb/fat intake to allow for some usage of stored fats. Only works when body fat is high?

Details on your bulk?

Yeah, I think you're going to hit the wall pretty quick there and likely feel a loss of energy & see your strength decrease due to insufficient feeding.

My bulk isn't fancy. I started out at ~172lbs at 6'2" 3 months ago due to neglect (hunger doesn't bother me and I'm easily distracted away from eating.) So I started GOMAD (gallon of milk a day) which worked great for me in 2010. I also eat whatever I feel like, while avoiding true junk like potato chips and donuts. I eat plenty of pizza & burgers though. I'm just past the 3 months mark and at 195lbs now. Trying to get up to 210 and then cut back to somewhere between 195-200lbs. 199lbs is the max I can weigh without getting taped in the Army.

I'd generally not advise such reckless bulking for people who don't know they can shed the fat at the end easily. I anticipate that I can lose the 10 lbs at the end in less than 2 weeks.

 

[z1ggy]

I tried the whole build muscle while losing fat thing. It does work... Except verrrrryyy slowly (atleast for me). Mentally speaking, I think one is best doing them separately because while doing them at the same time, results do not happen very fast. Generally results are what keep people going, whether it's weight gain, weight loss, strength gain, etc etc.

I found that with 12 weeks of eating right under my maint. levels, I gained a small amount of strength (10-20% on most lifts) and lost 3lb. I lifted heavy, ate well and di no cardio other than lifts and sports.

In just 3 weeks of doing a pure cut I've already lost 3lb. I'm doing a non stop circuit for 15 minutes (do 15 pushups, 12 lunges, 6 pullups, 12 deadlifts... etc etc) then 15 mins of interval training on an elliptical or recumbent bike. For me personally, I think my body just needs to be in one mode at a time. I send signals to my body that it needs to shed weight by eating less and doing more cardio, or tell it to gain weight by eating more and lifting heavy. The key is during the shed phase, to retain as much muscle as possible and during the bulk plan to put on as little fat as possible. Both are done the same way really... Lots of lean protein and resistance training.

 

[SP33Demon]

It's possible to gain muscle and cut at the same time but it's hard to do at the elite level, and it may require genetics; there's not enough research to conclude either way at the elite level but we know it's attainable at the novice level, i.e. you haven't maximized your muscle gains to recomposition. To do this, you have to attain the magical positive nitrogen balance while in a caloric deficit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bz3AG-oCXTE