Brexit: How the Conservative Right screwed England and makes Trump/Republican incompetencies look small

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JEDI

JEDI

Lifer
Sep 25, 2001
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https://psmag.com/ideas/brexit-how-austerity-and-a-cowardly-ruling-class-brought-down-England

The Conservative Prime Minister David Cameron pledged during the campaign for the 2015 UK General Election to hold a new referendum.
In 2016, Brexit passed 52% vs 48%.

Then he resigned.
Theresa May stepped up to be Prime Minister because no one else wanted the job.
(Think Paul Ryan being House Leader when Trump won the Presidency.)

David Davis, the minister in charge of delivering Brexit, assured the public early last year that a hard border would not lead to "a Mad Max-style dystopia." He's quit now.
So did the guy who replaced him. :eek:

So without a smooth transition plan to exit the EU, chaos will happen.
- Trade agreements will be null and void. England can't trade with EU countries and vice versa.
- Open borders will cease. Britains wont be allowed into the EU countries and vice versa.
and no one know what will happen to Britains already in the EU.
- There will be a hard border again between Northern Ireland (part of England) and the rest of Ireland (part of EU)
The 1998 peace accords that ended Northern Irelands violence/bombings will be in jeopardy because part of it relied on eliminating that border.

well, after 33 months of Brexit incompetence and chaos by the Conservative Right, it's about to hit the fan.
Jan 2019 was the deadline. it was postponed.
March 29, 2019 was the new deadline.
Now another extension to April 12, 2019.

France is getting tired of this drama and is pushing the EU to push England out even without a plan. :eek:
 
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KMFJD

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
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Just like Trump, i think they were surprised that they won the referendum
 
G

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
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52% get what they want, 48% can go to hell wearing gasoline underwear. This is what we want, unconstrained democracy, a direct vote by the people to choose their path forward.
 
J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
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Greenman said:
52% get what they want, 48% can go to hell wearing gasoline underwear. This is what we want, unconstrained democracy, a direct vote by the people to choose their path forward.
Click to expand...

Which doesn't apply to the electoral college, right?
 
J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
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Greenman said:
Of course not, that's established in the constitution.
Click to expand...

So, in order to be consistent, you'd advocate doing away with the EC? Or is there any principle involved other than conservatives winning?

Hard Brexit is even dumber than Trumpism. It's courting disaster. Like in N Ireland. Like in Scottish independence. Like in London being the financial capital of the EU. Like Gibraltar & all the far flung remnants of British empire whose trade agreements with their neighbors are gone in a fit of provincial British rage.
 
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M

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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As the pace of change in the world accelerates and people who used to lead insular lives unaffected by far flung events become increasingly agitated and manipulated by the news media to channel eyes to advertising by playing on people's paranoia, the level of frustration in people's lives increases and their dissatisfaction with everything in those lives multiplies. The result of all that building tension is that democracy itself is failing. People feel isolated, frightened, despondent, angry, and bitter with their lives. It amplifies the feelings of self hate and like animals in cages people begin to chew on themselves. The result is that Trump and Brexit present ways that the most emotionally vulnerable and immature can fuck themselves.

We are in a race to see if we will awaken by facing the fact that we fuck ourselves or go extyinct blaming others.
 
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G

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
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Jhhnn said:
So, in order to be consistent, you'd advocate doing away with the EC? Or is there any principle involved other than conservatives winning?

Hard Brexit is even dumber than Trumpism. It's courting disaster. Like in N Ireland. Like in Scottish independence. Like in London being the financial capital of the EU. Like Gibraltar & all the far flung remnants of British empire whose trade agreements with their neighbors are gone in a fit of provincial British rage.
Click to expand...
And for all of that, they made the democratic choice to leave. You can rage about it, call it stupid, mindless, foolish, but it was a democratic vote no matter how you cut it. Democracy is 51% of the people pushing the other 49% around. Everyone loves democracy, until they're on the 49% side.
 
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J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
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Greenman said:
And for all of that, they made the democratic choice to leave. You can rage about it, call it stupid, mindless, foolish, but it was a democratic vote no matter how you cut it. Democracy is 51% of the people pushing the other 49% around. Everyone loves democracy, until they're on the 49% side.
Click to expand...

Yep. 2016 will go likely down as the year of self ownage on both sides of the Atlantic.
 
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M

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
72,429
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Greenman said:
And for all of that, they made the democratic choice to leave. You can rage about it, call it stupid, mindless, foolish, but it was a democratic vote no matter how you cut it. Democracy is 51% of the people pushing the other 49% around. Everyone loves democracy, until they're on the 49% side.
Click to expand...
I think you see the world in this way based on inexamined assumptions you hold. For example, I have experienced a lot of abuse and disrespect in my life and grew up feeling stupid. I can’t spell. I learned to read and do math very late. I flunked the second grade and was miles behind other kids when I moved from California to Hawaii, and my father was exceptionally good at all of those things. But I knew by the age of seven that humanity is a insane and it turned out that I had other abilities.

But one terror, and we now get to my point, is the fear of being controlled by insane people. Incidentally, let me add, I’m having a ball under Trump. So, I suffer from one of two issues. I am either a totally arrogant elitist who despises and fears being controlled by people vastly inferior in abilities and naturally understanding, or I am full of anger at the world for being made to feel inferior as a child. Naturally it can be both.

But along the way to my acquisition of my ‘gifted’ understanding of the world, was exposure to the notion that there is a synergistic amplitude in the quality of group consensus wisdom, that the whole bedrock on which Western wisdom is based is in the sanctity and value of the individual, that people aren’t at root marching morons, but images of the gods.

So there can be two assumptions we can make about democracy and that is to fear the tyranny of the majority because people are malevolent, or that consensus government works because people are fundamentally good.

So, while I may feel like a conservative and fear the shadow in men, my own psychological experience has revealed the divinity in humanity.

So I think the degree to which one can trust in collective wisdom depends on how much one loves oneself. The mystic tells me we are all the same.
 
dainthomas

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,591
3,425
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Greenman said:
And for all of that, they made the democratic choice to leave. You can rage about it, call it stupid, mindless, foolish, but it was a democratic vote no matter how you cut it. Democracy is 51% of the people pushing the other 49% around. Everyone loves democracy, until they're on the 49% side.
Click to expand...

And the United States is where the 27% can push the 73% around.

And Brexit is dumb primarily because the proponents assured the voters it would be easy peasy. They lied. Then they quit and ran and left the voters holding the bag of garbage.
 
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J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
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dainthomas said:
And the United States is where the 27% can push the 73% around.

And Brexit is dumb primarily because the proponents assured the voters it would be easy peasy. They lied. Then they quit and ran and left the voters holding the bag of garbage.
Click to expand...

It's really quite remarkable how the Tories beat down the people of northern England with austerity & managed to blame all those woes on immigrants. That's what really led up to the Brexit vote. The fact that the Elite also co-opted Labour long ago didn't help, either.
 
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kage69

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
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Yeah that new Irish border is going to be fun. Woe to those having to build/man any checkpoints and crossings. May as well try to bring the Berlin wall back again is what Irish are saying. This could get really ugly.
 
V

Victorian Gray

Lifer
Nov 25, 2013
32,083
11,718
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Jhhnn said:
It's really quite remarkable how the Tories beat down the people of northern England with austerity & managed to blame all those woes on immigrants. That's what really led up to the Brexit vote. The fact that the Elite also co-opted Labour long ago didn't help, either.
Click to expand...

You might want to take a look at this map if you think it was only northern England that voted for Brexit

https://www.bbc.com/news/politics/eu_referendum/results
 
KMFJD

KMFJD

Lifer
Aug 11, 2005
29,184
42,271
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last dying gasp of desperation of a ruling class whose time has past, yet continues to think of itself a giant
 
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J

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
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G

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
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brycejones said:
It will go down as one of the greatest intelligence coups of all time. A little misinformation combined with xenophobic populism is a cheap way to weaken your opponents on the international stage.
Click to expand...
The great facebook battle of 16, when stupid p
dainthomas said:
And the United States is where the 27% can push the 73% around.

And Brexit is dumb primarily because the proponents assured the voters it would be easy peasy. They lied. Then they quit and ran and left the voters holding the bag of garbage.
Click to expand...
That's a darn shame. They need smarter voters.
 
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