Blu-ray is dead

CFster

Golden Member
Oct 16, 1999
1,903
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76
BS.

With everybody rushing out to buy new HD sets due to the impending end of OTA analog broadcasts, they will be looking for HD sources. Couple that with the expected Black Friday price chops and I think this is only the beginning.

And while new services such as Netflix streaming HD to XBox 360s looks promising, you'd better have a pretty fast connection to get any kind of quality. I enjoy a 20MB connection, but I'd bet 95% of households out there are under 5MB.

You've got to get your HD somehow.


 

Soundmanred

Lifer
Oct 26, 2006
10,780
6
81
Most people I know (a good percentage have some type of HD set) either bought a Blu-Ray player and won't pay twice the price for the discs and rent them once in a while, or just don't own a Blu-Ray player at all.
They enjoy HD channels on cable/satellite, and already paid for the player, but the discs are priced too high for a movie. (I knw you can get them at great prices on sale, but most people don't want to scour the web just for a movie).
The jump from DVD to HD isn't as much as the jump from VHS to DVD, and they are happy with regular DVD's (upsampling just adds more of a reason to keep buying DVDs as well).
I don't think it will die completely, but I don't think it will be accepted by as many people as DVD was until the cost comes down to what DVDs/players are now.

 

Wuzup101

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2002
2,334
37
91
Originally posted by: CFster
BS.

With everybody rushing out to buy new HD sets due to the impending end of OTA analog broadcasts, they will be looking for HD sources. Couple that with the expected Black Friday price chops and I think this is only the beginning.

And while new services such as Netflix streaming HD to XBox 360s looks promising, you'd better have a pretty fast connection to get any kind of quality. I enjoy a 20MB connection, but I'd bet 95% of households out there are under 5MB.

You've got to get your HD somehow.

The problem is that you could also bet that 95% of homes don't have an HD-TV. You further assume that people have all the gear to reap the benefit of buying blue ray over DVD. If you don't have a newer receiver to take advantage of the HD audio features, well than that's not a reason to go BR. Furthermore, many people sit too far away from their HD set to reap the full benefit of HD. For them, DVD up conversion may be a great (and cheaper alternative). DVD's look great on a 1080p set with a good up converter.

I'll go on the record as saying that I don't want to have wasted money on yet another player (Yes I have an HD-DVD player too!). However, because I bought a PS3 (actually 2 of them), I don't have to worry about it becoming a brick (as there will always be games!). I don't want to see BR go the way of the do-do... but at current prices... I can't justify buying a BR of a movie that I already own when it comes out.

For the record... you'll probably find that the people who are fanatical about BR and HD video/audio are the same people that have 20mb connections :)
 

Pacfanweb

Lifer
Jan 2, 2000
13,155
59
91
Problem is, all the newer movies that have lots of CG, while in a side-by-side viewing the Blu Ray looks better than DVD, it doesn't look THAT much better, at least not enough for people to pay that extra premium for the BR discs.
So they buy an upconvert player and use regular DVD.

Of course, people like us here notice the difference and usually HAVE to have the "best", regular people think DVD looks great on an HDTV, and don't see paying 25-30 bucks for the BR versions.
 

ManBearPig

Diamond Member
Sep 5, 2000
9,173
6
81
my parents are luddites and they can tell the difference between upconverted dvds (and regular dvds) and blu-rays. They were pretty amazed. ive watched a movie ive already seen on dvd more than one time if the movie was out on blu-ray.
 

techwanabe

Diamond Member
May 24, 2000
3,145
0
0
Originally posted by: BladeVenom
Robin Harris at ZDnet is predicting Blu-ray's demise. http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=365 Sounds like others might agree. http://www.crunchgear.com/2008...-blu-ray-dead-already/ I expect more of these predictions before the year's out. R.I.P. Blu-ray.

I expect lots of whining from Blu-ray/Sony fans over these stories.


Good "set up" for a self fulfilling prophecy.

So if bluray dies, where will we get Hi Def movies in full 1080P while web download speed isn't fast enough to keep up, or cable HD is compressed and not up to par?

Title of this thread should be "Bluray is dying" since it isn't dead yet.
 

Wuzup101

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2002
2,334
37
91
Originally posted by: techwanabe
Originally posted by: BladeVenom
Robin Harris at ZDnet is predicting Blu-ray's demise. http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=365 Sounds like others might agree. http://www.crunchgear.com/2008...-blu-ray-dead-already/ I expect more of these predictions before the year's out. R.I.P. Blu-ray.

I expect lots of whining from Blu-ray/Sony fans over these stories.


Good "set up" for a self fulfilling prophecy.

So if bluray dies, where will we get Hi Def movies in full 1080P while web download speed isn't fast enough to keep up, or cable HD is compressed and not up to par?

Title of this thread should be "Bluray is dying" since it isn't dead yet.

The real question is: why do you think there needs to be a source of 1080p content (economically speaking)? If the market demand is not there to support this segment, than there is the very real possibility that the "powers that be" will cut their losses. If you can not convince the customer base that Blu Ray is worth the price premium over SD-DVD or other sources of media, then you have a real problem on your hands. We all know that BR is superior to DVD in every way (same goes with overly compressed on demand rentals). However, DVD is cheaper, and on demand/internet streaming/etc... has the whole "convenience" factor going for it. Honestly, 90% of the time i would prefer to watch a streaming movie over a BR movie just because I don't have to "go get" the BR movie (Either go out and buy it... or more likely rent it). Net flix (which I have) is convenient (delivery by mail). Clicking on "watch now" is even more convenient. In any case, there are more factors than simply cost and quality (not to mention still having to convince someone to "rebuy" something that they already own).
 

Shawn

Lifer
Apr 20, 2003
32,236
53
91
And that's why Blu-ray has had over 10% of the market share for 3 weeks straight? Blu-ray has been continuing to gain ground.
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86

ManBearPig

Diamond Member
Sep 5, 2000
9,173
6
81
Originally posted by: cubby1223
Originally posted by: BladeVenom
Robin Harris at ZDnet is predicting Blu-ray's demise. http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=365 Sounds like others might agree. http://www.crunchgear.com/2008...-blu-ray-dead-already/ I expect more of these predictions before the year's out. R.I.P. Blu-ray.

I expect lots of whining from Blu-ray/Sony fans over these stories.

Didn't I debunk your crap in your last Blu-ray is dying thread? Give it up loser.

I don't understand, does the OP have something against Blu-ray? If so, why? Only thing I don't like is the price of movies, and i don't ever buy movies (with few exceptions), I rent, so it doesn't really bother me.
 

Shawn

Lifer
Apr 20, 2003
32,236
53
91
Originally posted by: Kazaam
Originally posted by: cubby1223
Originally posted by: BladeVenom
Robin Harris at ZDnet is predicting Blu-ray's demise. http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=365 Sounds like others might agree. http://www.crunchgear.com/2008...-blu-ray-dead-already/ I expect more of these predictions before the year's out. R.I.P. Blu-ray.

I expect lots of whining from Blu-ray/Sony fans over these stories.

Didn't I debunk your crap in your last Blu-ray is dying thread? Give it up loser.

I don't understand, does the OP have something against Blu-ray? If so, why? Only thing I don't like is the price of movies, and i don't ever buy movies (with few exceptions), I rent, so it doesn't really bother me.

He is probably still bitter HD DVD lost. I have over 50 HD DVDs and while I still think HD DVD was the better format, I have moved on and bought a HD DVD/Blu-ray combo player. The OP needs to get over it.

That said this is yet another anti blu-ray thread that serves no purpose other than to troll. It should be locked.
 

dwell

pics?
Oct 9, 1999
5,185
2
0
LOL. Do HD DVD owners ever quit. The format wars ended almost a year ago and they're still spreading FUD.

Blu-ray is not dying, it's growing.
 

Trader05

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2000
5,096
20
81
I bet people had this argument with dvds also....dvd is dead! vhs forever! or beta?
 

Baked

Lifer
Dec 28, 2004
36,052
17
81
95% of homes don't have HDTV? Everybody I know had a HDTV 4 years ago when they were still semi pricey. You can get a decent HDTV for cheap now. They're as common as LCD monitors for computers. 95%... the hell you smoking, I want some of that.
 

s44

Diamond Member
Oct 13, 2006
9,427
16
81
Same old boring troll thread with the same boring troll title by the same boring troll member.

The last thread, amusingly, became somewhat interesting after it got hijacked to a real topic though.
 

Wuzup101

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2002
2,334
37
91
Originally posted by: Baked
95% of homes don't have HDTV? Everybody I know had a HDTV 4 years ago when they were still semi pricey. You can get a decent HDTV for cheap now. They're as common as LCD monitors for computers. 95%... the hell you smoking, I want some of that.

I clearly made that up (sorry I thought it was obvious). That being said, I hate to break it to you, but the majority of American's still don't own an HDTV. Sure, most of my friends have at least one HD set. The majority of my friends also make decent money and can afford these luxuries. A decent HDTV still runs a few hundred bucks. To someone making $30k a year, that weeks pay might put dinner on the table... definitely not "cheap" to them. Most recent statistics point to 25-30% of US homes having a HDTV set. That's a hell of a lot of people. I would still hazard to guess that there are more of the smaller sets, people probably are sitting further than they should be from their sets (based on set size), etc... If you have something like a 60" kuro elite, or a 100+ inch 1080p projector, etc... then the difference between BR and DVD is night and day. If you are watching on a 32" 720p set that you are sitting 10+ feet from... you might wonder why anyone would ever pay $30 to replace their DVD with a BR (or HD-DVD for that matter... the argument is valid no matter the format).

I don't want BR to die... and I hate buying "digital" content. I don't mind "renting" it... but when I buy I like to have something physical (personal preference). I'm just saying that a lot of people aren't seeing a huge difference between BR and DVD (up-converted). That doesn't mean that BR is going to die... it's just not growing as fast as Sony/BRA predicted.
 

SlickSnake

Diamond Member
May 29, 2007
5,235
2
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The most important fact the dipshit studios needed to realize before taking payola from Sony to drop HD-DVD was the fact that PS3 sales do not equal BR media market share, and it most likely never will.

I would estimate a majority of people who own a PS3 bought it for games. And they are teens or younger even and they are primarily playing games on the PS3 and not particularly interested in watching BR movies at all, much less buying BRs, unless they decide to rent a few on the parents rental memberships. Since they don't have an income, their obvious effect on the BR sales market is virtually nonexistant.

Remember that most tweens do not even own a 1080p HDTV or monitor, and for personal gaming use are still using either a hand me down tube PC monitor on their hand me down PC or a hand me down old SD tube TV of some sort to play games on in their rooms. They might occasionally use the main 1080p TV in the living room that the parents bought to play games on, but when the parents are around, you can bet the kids take the PS3 to their bedrooms again, or just don't use it at all.

And if the parents are also serious about BR media they will buy their own BR player, and not use the kids PS3, too. So that means this house may have 2 BR players in it, or even more if there are several PS3s in it, but the parents are doing the sole BR buying and renting and the kids have virtually zero financial input in this process. Which is why total BR player numbers, including PS3 sales, do not equal BR media sales, and likely never will.

So in order to figure an accurate number of actual BR player sales which will result in BR media sales, you would need to take the total number of PS3 sales, and subtract as much as 75% from the total, then add in BR stand alone players to get a reasonable number to figure how many people might actually buy or rent BR medias. I also know a lot of kids who have PS3s, and NONE of them have 1080p monitors or HDTVs that they are connected to. They bought the PS3 just because they liked it, and their friends have one, and they swap games around. They were NOT bought for a BR player.

And another thing to consider in the BR sales numbers, a majority of the sales are to rental places. I would even estimate around 2/3s or more of them, and once these large rental places buy a few truckloads of one new title on BR, they are not going to be buying any more. So that new title will then sit on a store shelf for sale for who knows how long, before the entire manufacturers run is depleted, which might take months or YEARS depending on how many they overproduced of a title, like Speed Racer, lets say. So the sales numbers of a new BR title are really suspect based on this rental presale when the new title might actually flop if more people decide to rent the stinker than buy it on BR.

So based on all these variable consumer sales market factors that you either can't accurately pin down or get BR studio supporters to honestly reveal, real consumer market sales of BR players and medias are really a hide and seek shell game at this point. And any rosy BR sales projections or BR sales reports are obviously being massively manipulated and slanted in favor of BR by the manufacturing and studio conglomerates at this point.

In a year or so when a higher resolution media than 1080p is needed (and for projection it already is) we will see what Toshiba or Sony cooks up to fill that void. Both companies are already working on that next generation media, which is most likely why Toshiba appeared to throw in the towel so easily. Why continue to waste development efforts on an outdated 1080p format a few years down the road? It makes more sense to let Sony have this short term BR win, especially if Sony is losing money on it, if you are looking 2 or 3 years down the road in the media development cycle.
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86
Originally posted by: BladeVenom
Robin Harris at ZDnet is predicting Blu-ray's demise. http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?p=365 Sounds like others might agree. http://www.crunchgear.com/2008...-blu-ray-dead-already/ I expect more of these predictions before the year's out. R.I.P. Blu-ray.

I expect lots of whining from Blu-ray/Sony fans over these stories.

Just for fun, I'll actually put some substance to show you are full of it, just bitter that HD DVD lost. :D


http://blogs.zdnet.com/bio.php?id=harris
Robin Harris has been selling and marketing data storage for over 20 years in companies large and small. He has introduced a couple of multi-billion dollar storage products (DLT, the first Fibre Channel array) to market, as well as a couple of dozen smaller ones. He also spent 10 years marketing servers and networks. He was part of the team that developed the StorageWorks brand and drove the marketing for his first billion dollar storage product, DLT tape drives. Moving to Sun, he managed the industry's first Fibre Channel array. Later, joining distributed array controller startup YottaYotta, he built the company's marketing team. Since leaving YY, he's developed StorageMojo.com into one of the top storage blogs and also is an analyst with the Data Mobility Group.
He's not giving his opinion, he's giving his marketing agenda.


So are you just blind or incompetent, or both?
 

cubby1223

Lifer
May 24, 2004
13,518
42
86
http://blogs.zdnet.com/storage/?page_id=154

Robin Harris is an analyst with Data Mobility Group, a principal of marketing consulting firm TechnoQWAN, writes StorageMojo.com, a blog which accepts advertising from companies in the storage industry, and has a 25 year history with IT vendors. He has many industry contacts, most of whom he has opinions about.

Robin has relationships with many companies in the technology industry. Every company he writes about may have sought to influence his opinion through carefully-crafted marketing messages and self-serving white papers, gifts ranging from desk calendars, t-shirts, lunches and trips as well as analyst or consulting assignments. He also invests in some technology companies. He may accept payment for services in stock as well.

Robin discloses financial investments in or client relationships with companies named in Storage Bits and will likewise disclose them here.

To help readers sort out the gold from the dross in his writings, Robin tries to communicate his reasons as clearly as he can. If you agree, you are intelligent and discerning. If you disagree, well, you disagree. In all cases, Robin encourages readers to subject everything they read, see or hear on the internet or from politicians to some simple questions:

* What assumptions are implicit in the world view and judgments of the author?
* What, if any, is the factual basis for the opinions the author expresses?
* Is it reasonable, logical and clear?

Your critical faculties: use ?em or lose ?em!

Check and mate.

Keep this crap off this forum. ;)
 

DAPUNISHER

Super Moderator CPU Forum Mod and Elite Member
Super Moderator
Aug 22, 2001
31,689
31,557
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ROFLwaffles@topic.

HD-DVD owners to Blu-Ray- "Towards thee I roll, thou all-destroying but unconquering Blu-Ray; to the last I grapple with thee; from hell?s heart I stab at thee; for hate?s sake I spit my last breath at thee. Sink all remotes and all HD formats to one common pool! and since neither can be mine, let me then tow to pieces, while still chasing thee, though tied to thee, thou damned Blu-Ray! Thus, I give up the Xbox 360 add-on player!"