Blizzard admits Diablo III Auction House was a mistake (gold and RMAH)

[smackababy]

Yes, D2 was significantly easier. That's a good thing. You can run a playthrough using self found gear and sill beat the game. D2 isn't about item grinding, its about character development. That's where Jay Wilson got it wrong, because he thought the game was about item grinding.

No, it is not about character development. There is no character development. You are picking skills so, at end game, you can do runs to get better gear. That is the whole Action RPG genre. If you want character development play Planescape Torment or Ultima 7. Go play a real RPG that actual develops the characters, and not just their skills.

 

[Grooveriding]

Diablo 3 was never a difficult game and from what I've read, is massively less 'difficult' than it was at release. Because they set the game up with an overly simplistic system that revolves around a primary stat, vitality and resistances, that was the only hurdle to either being one shot or living. I dropped the game after a little over a month from its release. It was a simple matter of getting my vitality, resistances and main stat high enough to finish Inferno then you realize the game is garbage and has nothing Diablo 2 did to keep you interested and you quit.

The problem with Diablo 3 is that there is zero depth, complexity, commitment to your character, interesting itemization, pvp of any significance/fun and social system that encourages playing with everyone else. Basically a host of missing items that Diablo 2 had.

They didn't make an arpg, they made an action game. I liken Diablo 3 to Call of Duty in a medieval setting. There is no skill system, just a loadout, just like CoD. Your skill is a weapon choice and the rune is the weapon attachment. It's absolutely pathetic. Path of Exile, Diablo 2 and similar games are an example of what makes a proper skill and customization system in an ARPG. Diablo 3 is not an ARPG, it's an action game designed for consoles and released first on PC.

What kept Diablo 2 interesting and games like Path of Exile compelling was the depth to itemization, the huge myriad of possibilities you could find for unique builds and customization via items. Diablo 3 has a brain-dead system where you stack your main stat, resistances, some vitality and then get some crit modifiers and one of two life regain stats. It's done on purpose because they are catering to the lowest common denominator so the entire game is easily mastered and you just stack stats and watch your numbers go up. You see this highlighted when you read garbage from Blizzard like 'people just went to websites' Yeah, the people you made Diablo 3 for did 'just go to websites' They designed the game for your typical watered-down WoW player to pick up and understand in 2 minutes.

This is just one epic fail in the game. This is not even touching on the horrible social dynamic, lack of enjoyable pvp, micro-transaction infestation, complete lack of area/map randomization and the list just goes on. Never mind that the other major compelling nature of Diablo 2 was the item hunt. When every item in Diablo 3 boils down to main stat, vitality, crit and attack speed, it's hard to excited or interested in hunting for items that are that bland. There are no game-changers, no cool and unique rares that rolled with really unique modifiers, no single item that opens up a whole new build for you, no breakpoints and the list goes on. Just stat sticks of primary stat, resistances and the other three needed stats. It's WoW with RNG applied...


There is 95% wrong with the game and 5% right, and what is right is about two things; the combat/game engine its self and the art design is well done, albeit not exactly in line with the feel of the real past Diablo games.

 

[smackababy]

Diablo 3 was never a difficult game and from what I've read, is massively less 'difficult' than it was at release. Because they set the game up with an overly simplistic system that revolves around a primary stat, vitality and resistances, that was the only hurdle to either being one shot or living. I dropped the game after a little over a month from its release. It was a simple matter of getting my vitality, resistances and main stat high enough to finish Inferno then you realize the game is garbage and has nothing Diablo 2 did to keep you interested and you quit.

The problem with Diablo 3 is that there is zero depth, complexity, commitment to your character, interesting itemization, pvp of any significance/fun and social system that encourages playing with everyone else. Basically a host of missing items that Diablo 2 had.

They didn't make an arpg, they made an action game. I liken Diablo 3 to Call of Duty in a medieval setting. There is no skill system, just a loadout, just like CoD. Your skill is a weapon choice and the rune is the weapon attachment. It's absolutely pathetic. Path of Exile, Diablo 2 and similar games are an example of what makes a proper skill and customization system in an ARPG. Diablo 3 is not an ARPG, it's an action game designed for consoles and released first on PC.

What kept Diablo 2 interesting and games like Path of Exile compelling was the depth to itemization, the huge myriad of possibilities you could find for unique builds and customization via items. Diablo 3 has a brain-dead system where you stack your main stat, resistances, some vitality and then get some crit modifiers and one of two life regain stats. It's done on purpose because they are catering to the lowest common denominator so the entire game is easily mastered and you just stack stats and watch your numbers go up. You see this highlighted when you read garbage from Blizzard like 'people just went to websites' Yeah, the people you made Diablo 3 for did 'just go to websites' They designed the game for your typical watered-down WoW player to pick up and understand in 2 minutes.

This is just one epic fail in the game. This is not even touching on the horrible social dynamic, lack of enjoyable pvp, micro-transaction infestation, complete lack of area/map randomization and the list just goes on. Never mind that the other major compelling nature of Diablo 2 was the item hunt. When every item in Diablo 3 boils down to main stat, vitality, crit and attack speed, it's hard to excited or interested in hunting for items that are that bland. There are no game-changers, no cool and unique rares that rolled with really unique modifiers, no single item that opens up a whole new build for you, no breakpoints and the list goes on. Just stat sticks of primary stat, resistances and the other three needed stats. It's WoW with RNG applied...


There is 95% wrong with the game and 5% right, and what is right is about two things; the combat/game engine its self and the art design is well done, albeit not exactly in line with the feel of the real past Diablo games.

This clearly shows you have an ignorance of D3. There are breakpoints, there are unique stats that allow for builds normally not viable, and there are no microtransactions. Certain areas are randomized.

And for how much "fail" this game claimed to be, it still was a huge success and still continues to have around 1 million unique players a month.

 

[Grooveriding]

This clearly shows you have an ignorance of D3. There are breakpoints, there are unique stats that allow for builds normally not viable, and there are no microtransactions. Certain areas are randomized.

And for how much "fail" this game claimed to be, it still was a huge success and still continues to have around 1 million unique players a month.

Just took a look at their forums. One year later it is still predominantly nothing but negative. Compare that to WoW or SC. The game was a disaster. Really not interested in whatever tripe Blizzard tries to throw out there to save face.

I never get the denial over Diablo 3 having failed epically. It's basically everywhere, the game went down in flames and about the only success seen is by Activision/Blizzard and the money they made capitalizing on the name established by Diablo and Diablo 2. NO idea why, but I just don't care about their financial success and see it as a boon for me ?

Check out Blizzard's past games and the awards they've received, look at Diablo 3's accolades http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/about/awards.html

lol.........

Good luck to them with the expansion, that is where the proof will be in the pudding, when they sell millions and millions less than they did of the base game.

 

[RPD]

Lmao at the awards list. So glad I passed on D3.

 

[smackababy]

Just took a look at their forums. One year later it is still predominantly nothing but negative. Compare that to WoW or SC. The game was a disaster. Really not interested in whatever tripe Blizzard tries to throw out there to save face.

I never get the denial over Diablo 3 having failed epically. It's basically everywhere, the game went down in flames and about the only success seen is by Activision/Blizzard and the money they made capitalizing on the name established by Diablo and Diablo 2. NO idea why, but I just don't care about their financial success and see it as a boon for me ?

Check out Blizzard's past games and the awards they've received, look at Diablo 3's accolades http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/about/awards.html

lol.........

Good luck to them with the expansion, that is where the proof will be in the pudding, when they sell millions and millions less than they did of the base game.

Go take a look at the WoW and SC forums. It is filled with the same crybaby forum trolls as D3. And they all have a thousand hours in each game. PC gamers are just a bunch of whiners in general. Why do you think EA was voted worst company in America? Was it because they illegally foreclosed on people's houses? Was it because they invested people's money without their consent and lost it? Nope, they just sold millions of games internet crybabies didn't like.

 

[Hacp]

No, it is not about character development. There is no character development. You are picking skills so, at end game, you can do runs to get better gear. That is the whole Action RPG genre. If you want character development play Planescape Torment or Ultima 7. Go play a real RPG that actual develops the characters, and not just their skills.

Character develoment =/= story.

 

[smackababy]

Picking skills != developing characters. Sorry, but deciding at level 10 that you want to use swords and not axes or maces in a game with 100 levels is not something gamers should be forced to choose. PoE does this. You have nodes that force you to make end game decisions based on guesses of what you get endgame.

D3, and WoW, circumvent this by allowing you to change you skills. There is little penalty for it. Having a system that forces you to reroll a character because you didn't make him the exact way you want is an idea that needs to be done away with. It doesn't add depth. It doesn't add anything except some artificial "hardcore" aspect people shouldn't care about. If you disagree with free respecs, go ahead and make 15 paladins and never change their skills. Nobody is stopping you. If you agree with it, some people want to limit those.

 

[Hacp]

Picking skills != developing characters.

In fact, many of Diablo 2's original creators called it character development.

It doesn't add depth. It doesn't add anything except some artificial "hardcore" aspect people shouldn't care about.

It makes the player responsible for his choices. In civilization, you decide very early where all your core cities go, and the penalty of moving them later on is so harsh that most of the time, people don't do so. If I could move my cities at will and have as many undo buttons as I could, then the game would be no fun. Same concept applies to diablo.

If you disagree with free respecs, go ahead and make 15 paladins and never change their skills. Nobody is stopping you.

I can just play games that have it built in, which is what a large portion of D2 players have done. They're tired of the MMO style skill system that has no place in a series like Diablo.

 

[Dumac]

Picking skills != developing characters.

Sure it does. It is literally how you develop your character whiel playing.

Sorry, but deciding at level 10 that you want to use swords and not axes or maces in a game with 100 levels is not something gamers should be forced to choose.

I have fun coming up with an idea for a build an then executing it, and so do a lot of other players. ARPGs are a great place for this, as leveling doesn't typically require a huge time investment and the character builds translate directly to unique gameplay, meaning that playing character A is a whole different experience than playing character B.

PoE does this. You have nodes that force you to make end game decisions based on guesses of what you get endgame.

PoE has respecs, both as quest rewards and as a findable/tradable item in-game.

I don't think it is a terrible thing to ask a player to put a little bit of thought into how they developer their character. Not to meniton, it is a mostly organic process.

D3, and WoW, circumvent this by allowing you to change you skills. There is little penalty for it.

And in doing so, you lose the identity of your character. Because of this, there is no reason to make more than 5 characters in D3. Also, you character lacks any core identity - you can just float from build to build as the flavor of the month builds come out. I wouldn't even call it a build really, since you don't build up your character at all, but it is more akin to an FPS loadout.

Having a system that forces you to reroll a character because you didn't make him the exact way you want is an idea that needs to be done away with. It doesn't add depth. It doesn't add anything except some artificial "hardcore" aspect people shouldn't care about.

I don't agree with you here, and I think a lot of players feel the same way. Sure, it may not be the majority, but I hope small games continue to target this demo. D3 is the first ARPG that did away with character development, but who knows how many games adopt it in the future. There is room for both to exist.

It does add depth, in my opinion. You have to put some thought into your build. You can't pick things willy nilly and then just copy the build of the top ladder guy later.

I think respecs have utility, but they should be incremental and limited in order to retain the identity of the character you are developing. You just feel like you tweaked your character a little rather than having a totally new character. Of course, this doesn't really translate to D3 cause you don't really develop your character at all.

If you disagree with free respecs, go ahead and make 15 paladins and never change their skills. Nobody is stopping you. If you agree with it, some people want to limit those.

This doesn't make sense at all. It never has. It is the same as when people said "If you don't like the AH, don't use it! It isn't going to affect the meta of the game at all. It is completely optional!".

Why would I play a game where I have to limit myself outside of the game mechanics in order to be kept amused?

 

[darkswordsman17]

Everyone who says the drop rate was changed in any way for the AH has no idea what they are talking about. Please go play D2, RIGHT NOW, and tell me the drop rate for end game items is not worse than D3. If anything, D3 made gear (without the AH) easier to obtain. The game itself is harder than D2, to encourage multiplayer, so it doesn't feel like you get the upgrade progression like you did in D2. When in reality, you could be D2 Hell in starter gear. Okay, that is a bit of an exaggeration, but you still could have "bad" gear and farm well. This isn't the case in D3 and people whine about gear drops. The AH made trading gear so much simpler. In D2, you had to go to some obscure forum and hope then track down a player to make the trade. In D3 you list it and forget it.

The overall itemization took a lot from WoW, but randomized it. Which you may or may not like. Same with the gameplay. If you dislike the way the game plays, that is fine and a valid reason for disliking D3. If you dislike D3 because of the AH, you are a moron.

Didn't Blizzard themselves say they skewed the drop rates because of the auction house?

In D2 I routinely found items I'd actually consider using (either drops or buying from merchants) until late in Hell (and even then I'd occasionally get something pretty good) and never resorted to trading unless it was with friends who were around the same level as me. In D3 I'd get stuff worth using from drops until about the end of my first playthrough, then I basically had to resort to the auction house to get gear. My drops in D3 were awful. Maybe it was bad luck, but I even bolstered my magic find and still got garbage for drops for 95% of the time I played (I literally only ever had one Legendary item drop that was worth using myself). I'm not sure I ever bought anything but potions and dyes from merchants because they never had anything good. I also filled up my inventory with crafting stuff because I thought it might actually be worthwhile but its a total waste.

I mostly agree, I think people put an inordinate amount of blame on the auction house and respecing, however because of their crap game design I was basically forced to do both (and their skill/enemy adjustments regularly made me have to adjust my skills which meant I'd have to build up gold to buy stuff from the auction house) and that all just highlighted all the rest of the game that was bad. That's why I think people focus on both of those aspects.

Quick, are these features of D2 or D3?

The answer? Both!

That's a valid point, and I suppose its possible I would have hated D2 if I played it from the start as well, although I seriously doubt it. I certainly don't think its a perfect game either but I enjoyed it vastly more than D3.

 

[PhatoseAlpha]

What an odd conversation. Many of you seem to be saying "I don't want to do X, but if X is available, I will do it anyway, despite not wanting to." - which is bizzare.

I can't shake the feeling this is really about forcing arbitrary limitations onto everyone since you're lacking in self control - an odd belief that the best way to 'compete' with other players is to force them into your play style when you yourself are unwilling to actually play that way.

 

[badb0y]

Why some people incessantly defend this crap pile of a game is beyond me. When the game launched Inferno was exponentially more difficult then it is now because:

a.) Monster were fucking OP hard hitting.
b.) Without a shield you wouldn't survive at all.
c.) My brothers barb used to stand behind my Wizard lol.
d.) Without using the AH you wouldn't get the gear you needed to progress. This created a circular effect where the people who were D3 rich would go on beat the game and farm items to sell on AH to people who were stuck in the earlier stages.

Now that they nerfed Inferno and the AH is flooded with good items so you can buy them cheaply, everyone and their mother can beat inferno.

 

[Arkadrel]

In fact, many of Diablo 2's original creators called it character development.

Didnt Diablo II have attribute points you could assign your character?
Diablo III doesnt.

Didnt Diablo II have skill points, you could assign your character?
Diablo III doesnt (you mix skills + runes as you wish, and swap as you wish = no developement if everyone can do the same thing, on the fly swapping skills).

Skill tree's + synergies of skills = build diversity uniquely suited to many differnt purposes.

No skill tree, on fly swap skills = everyone uses optimal skills for X part of game = sucks.
(blizzard nerfs things, or buffs things, and everyone just adapts to the "new" best thing)

What little character growth you had in diablo II, was gone in diablo III.

The problem with Diablo 3 is that there is zero depth, complexity, commitment to your character, interesting itemization, pvp of any significance/fun and social system that encourages playing with everyone else.

This.

Diablo III was a stupified Diablo II, with a broken combat mechanic (dps rateing on weapons = bad in practis compaired to Diablo II's skill system). The item system was f***ed up. I found like 5 uniques all through out my gameplay, and they all sucked (skill system > dps rateing system for this, Diablo II had lowbie items that where usefull to certain wacky builds for long long times = fun)

They spent all the development money on makeing f*** CGI cut scenes and poorly writen dialog.
They didnt even beta test the endgame difficulty! wtf? any wonder it was such a mess?

 

[IAteYourMother]

Why some people incessantly defend this crap pile of a game is beyond me. When the game launched Inferno was exponentially more difficult then it is now because:

a.) Monster were fucking OP hard hitting.
b.) Without a shield you wouldn't survive at all.
c.) My brothers barb used to stand behind my Wizard lol.
d.) Without using the AH you wouldn't get the gear you needed to progress. This created a circular effect where the people who were D3 rich would go on beat the game and farm items to sell on AH to people who were stuck in the earlier stages.

Now that they nerfed Inferno and the AH is flooded with good items so you can buy them cheaply, everyone and their mother can beat inferno.

I think it would've been more fun if the best items dropped in Hell, and that way you could try the best builds to try and survive Inferno.

 

[Wyndru]

Early on that blizzard forum rep, "bashiok" or something like that, said that the loot tables overlapped, so you had just a much chance of getting inferno act 1 items in hell act 4 as you do getting act 3 hell items. A lot of people called bs on that though. I wasn't playing back then, so I don't know.

 

[PhatoseAlpha]

That wasn't true at release. iLvl63 items were limited to Inferno Acts 3&4 then. One of the early patches changed it so up to iLvl62 dropped in Hell4, and iLvl63 could drop in IA1, but the probabilities were so low you were extraordinarily unlikely to ever find anything good.

 

[stag3]

yea i wish inferno was back to the way it was where you had to work hard in a group to just get past act 1, i remember getting 1 shot by the stupid wasps right @ act 2 start LOL.

they should make it uber hard again and make MP levels for hell and below 🙂

 

[smackababy]

yea i wish inferno was back to the way it was where you had to work hard in a group to just get past act 1, i remember getting 1 shot by the stupid wasps right @ act 2 start LOL.

they should make it uber hard again and make MP levels for hell and below 🙂

MP10 Inferno is still no joke. The problem is that they have handed gear out to all the crybabies that can't stand having to work for it and now everyone out gears the content. They started doing the same thing in WoW in WotLK.

 

[digiram]

MP10 Inferno is still no joke. The problem is that they have handed gear out to all the crybabies that can't stand having to work for it and now everyone out gears the content. They started doing the same thing in WoW in WotLK.

Yap!! It's funny to, alot of people that think it's *soooooo* horrible left the game after banking on it already.

 

[darkewaffle]

Dont know what game you played, maybe Jay Wilson's imaginary version of D2? In D2, you could find non-unique items in normal mode that would last you till the end of hell. It was always worth picking up and item and identifying it because everything could potentially be useful, not just an ilvl 63 item found in the hardest difficulty.

Pretend no items in D2 had +skills, then what do you wear? It's the cornerstone property of almost every popular item/runeword.

D2 is just as guilty as D3 when it comes to having simple items. People lambast D3 for "if it doesn't have a main stat, it's not good" but D2 did the same thing. Except that 'main stat' was just "+ skills" because that was all that mattered (again, stat points do next to nothing). The difference is a binary property like that can't really be scaled, so once the you reach some given monster level or item level, you have that static property available. Since you can't find an item with "+ 1.24 to skills" and it is the best property in the game, those items remain useful for longer periods because it will be probably be useful until the point in time where you can find a mostly equal item with "+2 to skills" instead of "+1 to skills".

D3 on the other hand can scale more precisely; let's hypothetically say 100 D3 STR is equal to +1 D2 Skills. Then let's say you find a 110 STR item, it replaces the 100 STR item. Then a 120 STR item. Then a 130 STR item. Then a 140 STR item and so on and so forth; all this time you're making marginal upgrades. So, yes, you're not keeping items for an extended period of time but also as a result you have a larger upgrade 'window' both in terms of time and criteria. A player using +1 skills item is 'stuck' with it in a potential 'dead zone' of sorts until they reach a level or the enemies reach a level which makes +2 possible.