Blair wins, Schroeder loses.

maluckey

Platinum Member
Jan 31, 2003
2,933
0
71
Another one down

Germany tires of high unemployment, and high higher still government social spending. Schroder must stay on his toes if he wants to stay in power.

If Schroder falls, then his ally Chirac should take note lest his power base erodes. The economy in France is not that good either.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81

Replace outdated 80's figureheads with whatever scaaawey boogeyman terrorist of the week you please, instead of soviets/events for a fun flashback into the same old sh1t!
Fun for the whole terrified family!





"Kinky Sex Makes The World Go 'Round"

Greetings:This is the Secretary of War at the State Department
of the United States
We have a problem.
The companies want something done about this sluggish
world economic situation
Profits have been running a little thin lately
and we need to stimulate some growth
Now we know
there's an alarmingly high number of young people roaming
around in your country with nothing to do but stir up trouble
for the police and damage private property.
It doesn't look like they'll ever get a job
It's about time we did something constructive with these people
We've got thousands of 'em here too. They're crawling all over
The companies think it's time we all sit down, have a serious get-together-
And start another war
The President?
He loves the idea! All those missiles streaming overhead to and fro
Napalm
People running down the road, skin on fire
The Soviets seem up for it:
The Kremlin's been itching for the real thing for years.
Hell, Afghanistan's no fun
So whadya say?
We don't even have to win this war.
We just want to cut down on some of this excess population
Now look. Just start up a draft; draft as many of those people as you can.
We'll call up every last youngster we can get our hands on,
hand 'em some speed, give 'em an hour or two to learn how to use
an automatic rifle and send 'em on their way
Libya? El Salvador? How 'bout Northern Ireland?
Or a "moderately repressive regime" in South America?
We'll just cook up a good Soviet threat story
in the Middle East-we need that oil
We had Libya all ready to go and Colonel Khadafy's hit squad
didn't even show up. I tell ya
That man is unreliable.
The Kremlin had their fingers on the button just like we did for that one
Now just think for a minute-We can make this war so big-so BIG
The more people we kill in this war, the more the economy will prosper
We can get rid of practically everybody on your dole queue if we plan this right.
Take every loafer on welfare right off our computer rolls
Now don't worry about demonstrations-just pump up your drug supply.
So many people have hooked themselves on heroin
and amphetamines since we took over, it's just like Vietnam.
We had everybody so busy with LSD they never got too strong.
Kept the war functioning just fine
It's easy.
We've got our college kids so interested in beer
they don't even care if we start manufacturing germ bombs again.
Put a nuclear stockpile in their back yard,
they wouldn't even know what it looked like
So how 'bout it? Look-War is money.
The arms manufacturers tell me unless
we get our bomb factories up to full production
the whole economy is going to collapse
The Soviets are in the same boat.
We all agree the time has come for the big one, so whadya say?!?
That's excellent. We knew you'd agree
The companies will be very pleased.

 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
17,844
1
0
Originally posted by: maluckey
Another one down

Germany tires of high unemployment, and high higher still government social spending. Schroder must stay on his toes if he wants to stay in power.

If Schroder falls, then his ally Chirac should take note lest his power base erodes. The economy in France is not that good either.

What do you mean by "another one down"? Another what? European? Anti-war politician?
 

irwincur

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2002
1,899
0
0
More like another utopian socialist down.

Most people don't like effective unemployment rates in the near 15% range. It pisses even more off that those not working are not even looking because they have unlimited, full wage benefits. Hell, every seven or so people working are supporting one that is not. Then add the elderly that they are supporting at full pensions and you have some major problems.

And you think GM has problems with their pensions. Europe is poised on the edge of economic collapse.


Thank you for giving us a good shot at WWIII by 2020... socialism.
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
17,844
1
0
Originally posted by: irwincur
More like another utopian socialist down.
No, what you anti-europeans need to understand is that these leaders are actually not popular because they are not socialist enough! Chirac is unpopular because he is trying to move towards a more economically liberal model! Schroder is in trouble because Germans have seen "cuts in the country's generous welfare system and no major boost in economic competitiveness or job growth."

Thank you for giving us a good shot at WWIII by 2020... socialism.
WTF are you talking about?
 

Genx87

Lifer
Apr 8, 2002
41,091
513
126
Originally posted by: irwincur
More like another utopian socialist down.

Most people don't like effective unemployment rates in the near 15% range. It pisses even more off that those not working are not even looking because they have unlimited, full wage benefits. Hell, every seven or so people working are supporting one that is not. Then add the elderly that they are supporting at full pensions and you have some major problems.

And you think GM has problems with their pensions. Europe is poised on the edge of economic collapse.


Thank you for giving us a good shot at WWIII by 2020... socialism.

According to Infohawk the high unemployment is simply a tradeoff for socialized health care.

You cant eat but when you are on the brink of dying from starvation you can cash in your healthcare chips. Sounds like quite a deal doesnt it?



 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
17,844
1
0
Originally posted by: Genx87

You cant eat but when you are on the brink of dying from starvation you can cash in your healthcare chips. Sounds like quite a deal doesnt it?

Are you just trying to trash Europe or does this somehow relate to the thread?
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
Originally posted by: irwincur
More like another utopian socialist down.

Most people don't like effective unemployment rates in the near 15% range. It pisses even more off that those not working are not even looking because they have unlimited, full wage benefits. Hell, every seven or so people working are supporting one that is not. Then add the elderly that they are supporting at full pensions and you have some major problems.

And you think GM has problems with their pensions. Europe is poised on the edge of economic collapse.


Thank you for giving us a good shot at WWIII by 2020... socialism.

You mean the whole world is poised on the edge of economic collaspe and the wealthy are waiting in the shadows for it to happen.
 

chcarnage

Golden Member
May 11, 2005
1,751
0
0
Originally posted by: irwincur
More like another utopian socialist down.

Part of Germany's deficit has of course to do with an utopia. German money builds motorways in Spain and infrastructure in Poland, it finances a part of the costs of the European Union. European unification (or cooperation for now) is a project of huge dimensions and needs the support of the biggest member states. Germany happens to have the largest economy of the EU countries.

It is true that Germany suffers from the so-called Reformstau (back-up of reforms). Problem is that rightist parties didn't solve them either. It's not all about social security, too. Germany has the most complex tax system on this planet, that's pure luxury. But instead of talking about reality, politicians make unfulfillable promises. It's not only the people, the politicians need to grow up, too.

Principally neither much social security or few taxes are snake oil or the best solution for a country. They are just two different approaches to the same problem with advantages and disadvantages. Both can work if implemented properly, as I see in my own country... sometimes at the same time. The sentence about WWIII may be a juicy finish for a post but it is just nonsense. I would like to underline again that Germany is US' most important ally in Afghanistan and a peaceful democracy for decades. And the next economical crisis... well it's going to be caused by the American state deficit if nothing changes in the next two years.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,808
6,362
126
In a years time it is increasingly likely the US will be back in recession. So don't be too smug yet.

 

Forsythe

Platinum Member
May 2, 2004
2,825
0
0
Originally posted by: maluckey
Another one down

Germany tires of high unemployment, and high higher still government social spending. Schroder must stay on his toes if he wants to stay in power.

If Schroder falls, then his ally Chirac should take note lest his power base erodes. The economy in France is not that good either.

It's a shame, i kinda like schröder. It's just gloabalisation, the markets need to adapt. And now the new european countries have joined, they can send up workers that will work for 2 dollars pr. day. Modern european companies in the major european countries can't compete against those wages. A union is the way.
 

maluckey

Platinum Member
Jan 31, 2003
2,933
0
71
Umemployment is three times the United States rate, while social spending is four times the rate. It just can't continue.

Also, the open dislike of the Turks in Germany is one of many reasons that Schroders party is floundering. The average German could deal without Turks, and the government is too lenient on Turkish immigrants as far as they are concerned. In Bayern, Anti-Turk sentiment isn't really present as much, but then again there is no real Turkish presence. The current German administrations acceptance towards Turkey joining the EU is not sitting well.

Ad that and a few, even more serious issues to the mix, and all's not well for schroder and Germany.
 

GTKeeper

Golden Member
Apr 14, 2005
1,118
0
0
I think all the anti-Euros need to listen up:

Schroeder did an 'ok' job. Its not his fault that unemployement rate is 15%. It is a demographic that cannot be avoided. Much like in the U.S, Germany's baby boomers are getting older and the population cannot sustain the medical/social benefits for everyone. Hence 15% unemployment and the social reform needed.

I do give Germany kudos for deploying a new social benefit system that will auto-calculate benefits and weed out a lot of illegal/fraudulent claims. This was deployed I think in January. Time will tell if it works.

The German work ethic is insane, I am sure they will figure out a way out of this one.

And don't give me the 'Europeans only work 35 hours/week' bullcrap. They actually WORK during that time instead of sitting in their offices running errands and/or checking sports brackets/news.
 

biostud

Lifer
Feb 27, 2003
19,977
7,073
136
Basically large reforms need to take place that make the working force more dynamical, and introduce new jobs for those who get their job outsourced.

People are afraid of reforms and loosing their benefits, but unless something is done they all suffer from a slow "death". If a politician can convince the voters of this and gain their support for 8-10 years we might have a winner.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
I guess none of the anti-europeans are listening to the fact that germany is helping build up the rest of the EU also....
There is a lot of growth there and Germany has been through some serious hardships due to it's own shoddy infrastructure in half the country.
They are doing a pretty bang-up job for the challenges presented to it in modern times.
The EU is going to take some time to get on it's feet and stand to it's full strength economiclly. America going down the tubes will not help any though.
What product can you think of that is German has failed you in quality?
They have stayed peaceful, helped neighbors and worked together with long time enemies,
and even had our back in afganistan. don't count them out yet.
They have a way of coming back strong when they are able to rise to their fullest potential.
The EU is still in it's infancy for crying out loud.
 

imported_Tango

Golden Member
Mar 8, 2005
1,623
0
0
Germans are an amazing kind of people. I can't think of a country I could be worried less about. They are still paying the incredible efforts made to integrate the ex-DDR, east germany. I don't think a better job could have been done in just 14 years, assimilating an entire nation, changing the capital to Berlin etc etc. And they do are paying quite a big part of the money need to develop the European Union, support the new members etc etc. If you want to see an european country that is facing real problems take a look at Italy. The most right-wing government in Europe is doing a mess of the country economy, as is the Chinese cheap imitations of italians fashion products.
 

maluckey

Platinum Member
Jan 31, 2003
2,933
0
71
They have stayed peaceful, helped neighbors and worked together with long time enemies,

Perhaps you forgot the two World Wars and the United States Invasion and occupation of Germany that prevented them from having an offensive army at all. Held at gunpoint, they had no choice......
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,808
6,362
126
Originally posted by: maluckey
They have stayed peaceful, helped neighbors and worked together with long time enemies,

Perhaps you forgot the two World Wars and the United States Invasion and occupation of Germany that prevented them from having an ofensive army at all. Held at gunpoint, they had no choice......

I suspect he hasn't. Hence the use of "stayed".
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
Originally posted by: maluckey
They have stayed peaceful, helped neighbors and worked together with long time enemies,

Perhaps you forgot the two World Wars and the United States Invasion and occupation of Germany that prevented them from having an ofensive army at all. Held at gunpoint, they had no choice......



This was a long time ago, best worry about possible facist regimes in modern times.
What happened there happened becasue the people loved their country and trusted their leaders and believed that a honorable country could never let the things happen that did.

I have nothing but respect for what Germany has become since learning this hard lesson, and Americans should learn it also. It can happen anywhere when people get too full of their own flag waving mumbo-jumbo.
 

maluckey

Platinum Member
Jan 31, 2003
2,933
0
71
This was a long time ago, best worry about possible facist regimes in modern times.

That is also wat the Frencgh said after WWI. When they waited to arm, wanting extra proof of Germanys intention, the proof marched into Paris under a Nazi banner.

50 years ago is not that long a time ago. Especially when the occupying forces were still there as an overwhelmingly dominant force until less than 5 years ago.
 

Steeplerot

Lifer
Mar 29, 2004
13,051
6
81
If you read a bit into the mindset of the 20 and 30's you will find there is nothing like that going on anymore.
Germany and France are strong allies now. Times change, a lot.
Hell Britan and France were at war for AGES. Look at them now.
If anything USA has become the worlds rouge nation, leave the Germans out of it.
That crap is from generations before we were born.
 

Infohawk

Lifer
Jan 12, 2002
17,844
1
0
So was I right to assume the OP was trying to tie in their opposition to the war that has nothing to do with why they are in trouble?

That is also wat the Frencgh said after WWI. When they waited to arm, wanting extra proof of Germanys intention, the proof marched into Paris under a Nazi banner.

This is simply not true about WWII. The French knew what the Nazis were about. That's why they declared war on Germany and had a big buildup to counter them. (You can even take it further and say the US were the blind ones since they waited until they had a surprise attack to do anythinga about Japan). It turns out their strategy was bad, but the same thing can be said about the US in Vietnam and Iraq.
 

chcarnage

Golden Member
May 11, 2005
1,751
0
0
Originally posted by: Genx87
According to Infohawk the high unemployment is simply a tradeoff for socialized health care.

This would be a way oversimplified perspective. He never said that, though. Newsflash, social welfare doesn't equal socialism.


Originally posted by: maluckey
50 years ago is not that long a time ago. Especially when the occupying forces were still there as an overwhelmingly dominant force until less than 5 years ago.

I guess that's the reason why Iraq is such a peaceful place by now. Naturally Germany had some military choices, it was their own will to help in Afghanistan and to stay out of Iraq.

However I just can't take people seriously if they argument with World War I, II or III. I guess Godwin's law evolved over time.