Bicycle parts discussion (MTB/Hybrid/road): Avid SD-7 brake/lever set for $65 the best value? Is XTR ever worth the $$?

Thegonagle

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2000
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I recently got a new bike, an '01 Trek 7300 Hybrid. I got a great deal on it and I'm very happy overall, but I want to customize a few things, and I wouldn't mind hearing any opinions about the bike setup. An average ride is 20-30 miles a few times per week, time and weather permitting, and I intend to keep my bike for a long time.

I've got a lot of questions, so don't any one person feel obligated to answer everything.

I've already lost the heavy steel original handlebars in favor of some Specialized Al straight MTB bars I had sitting around. I've also upgraded the Grip-Shift style shifters in favor of Shimano 8-speed STX-RC trigger shifters.

I was told at the time of purchase that they're the best current 8-speed shifters available, and they look/feel decent, but are they really decent stuff that will last a long time? Where did STX-RC shifters fit into the line, higher end, mid-range, or low?

Should I be looking at replacing the SRAM 5.0 8-speed cartridge soon? If I go to a 9-speed cartridge and shifter, will my existing rear derailleur still work fine?

I've got Pro Max something or other V-brakes. They look cheap-azz and I think they could feel quite a bit better in use. I'm wondering if I should step right up to XTR brakes because of their replaceable bearings, should I just get the Deore XT brakes with the replaceable brass bushings, or will Deore LX brakes with non-replaceable bushings be fine for years and years?

How much should LX, XT and XTR brakes/cable/levers cost online or at the LBS?

Are my Shimano Nexave cranks POS porkers that I should trade up (and notice the difference)? Where did Nexave fit into the line, low-end, or mid-range?

Lastly, I think the stock Shimano Nexave front derailleur shifts like crud. I've gathered from MTBR that the XTR front derailleur is the one and only FD to buy for precise, dependable front shifting. Is this true in the experience of all you serious riders out there?

Thanks, everyone.

 
Feb 10, 2000
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I am not sure I have time to address ALL of your concerns, but let's see:

STX-RC was a midrange gruppo that slotted in just below LX. They should last a long time. Honestly it would probably have been better to go 9-speed at that point, since the shifters would still have worked fine with 8 speeds, but c'est la vie, and there is nothing wrong with STX-RC.

I assume by "cartridge" you are referring to the rear cassette (cogs). This should be replaced once a year or so. Try buying a new chain and see whether it works without skipping; if it does then you can get away with holding off on a new cassette. I would not worry about buying a 9-speed cassette and shifter, which offers only minimal benefits, but if you did so, your existing derailleur would work fine.

The XT V-brakes are probably the best price/performance deal. I have a $4,500 mountain bike and deliberately chose the XT brakes over XTR. Since you already have V-style brakes, you should not need new levers at the same time.

The cheapest online outlet for Shimano MTB stuff is Supergo.

Nexave is a gruppo created especially for "urban" and hybrid bikes, so I have no experience with it. I think it is not too bad, actually, and your cranks are Hollowtech, so they are probably not worth upgrading at this point. I believe there are different levels of Nexave, though I am not positive.

There is nothing magical about XTR front derailleurs; they have actually stopped making the design that most of those reviews pertain to. I would go XT instead; there is essentially zero weight or performance savings to XTR in this application.

Do yourself a favor and don't get too carried away upgrading this bike. I did this with my first nice bike (a Bridgestone MB-3) and ended up spending thousands on what was still a middle-of-the-pack bike that was worth about the same as it was when I started. If you really enjoy riding, perform only specific, targeted upgrades and save up for a new, nicer bike or bikes instead.
 
Mar 18, 2002
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<< Do yourself a favor and don't get too carried away upgrading this bike. I did this with my first nice bike (a Bridgestone MB-3) and ended up spending thousands on what was still a middle-of-the-pack bike that was worth about the same as it was when I started. If you really enjoy riding, perform only specific, targeted upgrades and save up for a new, nicer bike or bikes instead. >>



There you go, I spent almost as much on parts as I did on my Zaskar BRAND NEW. Think hard before spending.

FreAk:D
 

DougyDanger

Senior member
Dec 7, 2001
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I have several bikes and have upgraded them all consiberably, so I know what it is like to have 'upgradeitis'. First let me say that you don't need to upgrage anything util the previous part stop working. Don't upgrade because there are better parts out there. I usd to upgrade everything, now I hardly notice which bike has what parts. Its not the bike!

Now about your bike...it ain't worth it. Hybreds are not meant for 'serious' riding. Any kind of trails that would require better brakes, cranks or drivetrain would not suit your bike. Its geometry is not set up for technical trails.

Now if you insist on upgrading....STX-RC are mid to low end parts. Durable, a bit on the heavy side, and finiky to adjust, but they get the job done. my XT and XTR ders shift much smoother and consistently when dirty or slightly out of adjustment, but right out of the workstand they all shift the same. XT and XTR just work better more often in all conditions.

Upgrading to 9 speed....why? I still have 8 speed on all my bikes and lots of 8 speed parts. Don't let anyone tell you you need 9 speed. You don't. Related to that....9 speed shifters DO NOT WORK with 8 speed systems. The index spacing is different so every shift will be slightly off. That translates to shifting nightmares. You'll have a fit trying to get it all to work right.

XTR front der...only for standard size chainrings. Those are the 110mm bolt pattern (usually 46 or 48T big ring). Now having said that, I use an XTR with compact rings. Works fine with my SRAM shifters. With rapid fire it gave me trouble. Front ders are by far the most useless upgrade. They work only as good as they are set up. I can get an STX to shift like XTR. Don't think one is really any better than the other. Now the el cheapo altus/alivio/etc ones are just made like crap. Those are worth upgrading IF your shifting is giving you trouble. IF not, don't change it.

Cogs, or cassettes. IF you change your chain when it 'stretches' (see www.sheldonbrown.com) 1/16" you should get many miles, even years out of it. I get about 1-2 seasons of heavy riding out of mine.

V brakes. Good brakes are needed no matter where you ride. Get LX or some cheap avids. XT and XTR are overkill for most people. LX do the job. YOu may want new levers too. Yours are for Vs, but if they are poor quality braking may still suffer.


Cranks...don't even think about it. Not worth the cash at this point. Ride them until they brake or wear out. Getting new cranks may mean needing a new BB. It all depends on the measurements of the cranks (q factor and such).


Bottom line, save your money, ride your bike, develop skills, then buy what fits your needs. Most folks spend lots of money on their bikes and never use the bike to its potential, or at all! That bike is not a good trail bike, the parts you want are for serious trail riding. Hybreds are like SUVs...they look like they can do it, but in the end they were never inteded to be taken off the road or smoothed path.
 

yakko

Lifer
Apr 18, 2000
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<< Upgrading to 9 speed....why? I still have 8 speed on all my bikes and lots of 8 speed parts. Don't let anyone tell you you need 9 speed. >>

I agree. Since I live in Florida I am actually more than heppy with 7 speed.
 

Thegonagle

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2000
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Thanks for the opinions and advice, more discussion is welcome.

I know it "can't really do it" as far as off roading is concerned, but when I see a $499 bike for $240, and I do a lot of street/paved path biking as it is, I fall for it. It was just barely used, I estimate under 100 miles on the thing, so I feel like over 50% off retail is a great deal on a high quality Al frame bike. So far, I really like the extra speed from the 700C wheels and tires pumped up to 80 PSI. (What is 700C a measurement of, anyway?)

One reason I'm looking at upgrading parts on this bike is because I still intend to build/buy a serious MTB, and it wouldn't hurt me too badly now to have some great parts ready to go.

I think I'll go for a full set of XT brakes/levers now and forget the rest as long as it all works. That way I can put the old Pro-Max brakes on an old Miele I have sitting around. I'm gonna rebuild that bike for fun and practice.
 
Feb 10, 2000
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<< I think I'll go for a full set of XT brakes/levers now and forget the rest as long as it all works. That way I can put the old Pro-Max brakes on an old Miele I have sitting around. I'm gonna rebuild that bike for fun and practice. >>



Does the Miele have cantilever bosses? Even if it does, be careful with mixing V-brakes with road levers - they really cannot pull enough cable without the assistance of a pulley device like a QBP Travel Agent or World Class V-daptor.
 
Feb 10, 2000
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<< Oh man. Reading this thread makes me miss my old biking days. :( >>



There's an easy cure for that - get out and ride!
 

MazerRackham

Diamond Member
Apr 4, 2002
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I'm actually in the process of upgrading my Specialized Rockhopper Comp. I switched out the Manitou 'Magnum' fork for a Rock Shox Duke Race '02, which made a world of difference. I've also ordered an Avid Single Digit 7 set of brakes and levers. And at some point I'm going to toss my wheels in favor of much lighter and stronger set, but I haven't decided which yet.

It's really a lot of fun to work on my bike. I like getting greasy sometimes, just like I love working on the innards of my computer rig :) It holds the same appeal for me
 

Thegonagle

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2000
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The Miele has cantilevers. I would keep the Pro-Max levers with the Pro-Max brakes (not mixing braking components), and replace the levers and the brakes on my new Trek.

Was Miele any good? The Miele is an '88 MTB, I think.
 

pillage2001

Lifer
Sep 18, 2000
14,038
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<<

<< Oh man. Reading this thread makes me miss my old biking days. :( >>



There's an easy cure for that - get out and ride!
>>



I've got no bike here. I lost my old bike which is half STX and XT to some jerk. :( And I don't really know how to put a bike together to begin with. If I do, I would have bought a new bike here. :D
 
Feb 10, 2000
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<< The Miele has cantilevers. I would keep the Pro-Max levers with the Pro-Max brakes (not mixing braking components), and replace the levers and the brakes on my new Trek.

Was Miele any good? The Miele is an '88 MTB, I think.
>>



Honestly I have never heard of a Miele MTB; I assumed you were talking about a road bike (hence my useless comments re. road levers). I believe Miele is a Canadian company, and the only Mieles I have ever seen were road bikes. I have no idea whether they are any good; I guess if you like yours then they are OK!
 

MazerRackham

Diamond Member
Apr 4, 2002
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Hey guys, is there any decent forum online where people discuss MTB/road bikes and equipment and repair, etc.? I'm looking for something like AT, but for bikes! :) I haven't been able to find anything at place like mtbr.com. They have a forum, but it's one of those really crappy ones (software) that makes me want to jump out the window :) thanks-
 
Feb 10, 2000
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<< Hey guys, is there any decent forum online where people discuss MTB/road bikes and equipment and repair, etc.? I'm looking for something like AT, but for bikes! :) I haven't been able to find anything at place like mtbr.com. They have a forum, but it's one of those really crappy ones (software) that makes me want to jump out the window :) thanks- >>



Well, I like the MTBR forums OK and they are the best MTB forums of which I am aware. Velo News also has a decent "Tech Talk" forum, but the software is even more annoying, and it is predominantly road-bike stuff.
 

SirFshAlot

Elite Member
Apr 11, 2000
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supergo and nashbar, both have good prices

supergo had some good prices on complete GT mt bikes

I can't believe GT is dropping out of the market to make dept store bikes
:(
 
Aug 16, 2001
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OK, here are some advice.
You got a Hybrid so it's not a full blown MTB. Having said that let's continue.
1.
STX-RC is one level below Deore LX, and is now discontinued and replaced by Deore (just Deore). They are good so keep them if you are not upgrading to 9 speed. You DO NOT need to have 9 speed. I've been using 8 speed and that is enough. I now have 9 speed on the new full suspension bike.
What kind of rear derailleur do you have? They usually work fine because it is a 'dumb' piece of hardware. The number of speed is determined by the shifters only, and the spacing between gears is also only controlled by the shifters. I have a XTR rear derailleur and it came from a 8 speed group. Works just fine with 9 speed.

2. Brakes
I would not go for the XTR V-Brakes. Way too expensive and the LX, XT, XTR V-brakes has a fancy paralellogram mechanics which looks nice but doesn't really make it work exeptionally well compared to other brakes. I used to have Pro-Max brakes and they feel 'cheesy'. You should pick up a complete set of Avid Single Digit 7 V-Brakes. I bought mine on sale for $65 from Supergo. These are IMHO the best V-brakes on the market. They look like the Pro-Max brakes and do not have the extra paralellogram ....... but they are absolutely excellent and I think they work better than Shimano brakes. They are also light and you can buy a Titanium version but that's a bit overboard.

3.
Nexave is the hybrid cranks. Don't know much about them but will probably do just fine.

4.
Do not spend the extra $$$ on the XTR front derailleur. XT is just as good if not better. I use it and you can not go wrong for that price.


Finally. Don't spend to much money on upgrading a hybrid. Enjoy it as much as you can. You'll se which parts do and don't work. When you get really hooked upgrade to a new bike. I just finished building my Rocky Mountain element race full suspension MTB.
That is a sweeeeeeet ride.
 

RossMAN

Grand Nagus
Feb 24, 2000
78,855
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I just got my 2nd cup of coffee for the day, on the walk back to the bank I saw a _NICE_ Gary Fisher.

Damn those are nice mtn bikes.
 

Thegonagle

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2000
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So the ½ price hybrid of mine is getting no respect. I didn?t really expect that, that?s but fine. I really do like it. I don?t think I?m ready for a serious road bike yet, and I had complete buyer?s remorse after I reserved a $750 MTB, mostly because of the price. The $240 Trek deal kind of fell into my lap, and thought, why not?

Yeah, the Pro-Max brakes look cheesy and clunky as hell, like they belong on a dept. store bike. And I?ve test ridden several bikes with much nicer feel on the brakes, too.

I really want something good.

So, Avid levers? OK, whatever is a great value. :)

And Avid brakes? If they?ve got a great price:performance ratio, I?ll check those out too, but I was actually thinking that the parallelogram (parallel-push) linkage of the LX/XT/XTR, which keeps pads 100% parallel to the rim at all times, would be a considerable improvement. Do folks disagree with this?
 
Feb 10, 2000
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Other things being equal I prefer the parallel-push linkage mechanism on the Shimano brakes, but non-linkage designs are definitely simpler and may last longer (though it will be an academic difference unless you ride a LOT; in non-racing road riding the brakes do not take much of a beating). Go to a bike shop and give the Shimanos a squeeze, as well as the Avids if you can find them.
 

Entity

Lifer
Oct 11, 1999
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<< So the ½ price hybrid of mine is getting no respect. I didn?t really expect that, that?s but fine. I really do like it. I don?t think I?m ready for a serious road bike yet, and I had complete buyer?s remorse after I reserved a $750 MTB, mostly because of the price. The $240 Trek deal kind of fell into my lap, and thought, why not?

Yeah, the Pro-Max brakes look cheesy and clunky as hell, like they belong on a dept. store bike. And I?ve test ridden several bikes with much nicer feel on the brakes, too.

I really want something good.

So, Avid levers? OK, whatever is a great value.

And Avid brakes?
>>


I'm not a big fan of Trek, and I guess that rubs off when I post. You got a good bargain, and if you're happy with the bike, that's all that counts.

Regarding the Avid levers, not only are they a better price/performance ratio, but they're just plain better, overall. I've had several sets of Shimano levers, both XT and XTR, and have had massive problems. I haven't had a problem since switching to Avid.

Rob
 
Aug 16, 2001
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<< And Avid brakes? If they&#146;ve got a great priceerformance ratio, I&#146;ll check those out too, but I was actually thinking that the parallelogram (parallel-push) linkage of the LX/XT/XTR, which keeps pads 100% parallel to the rim at all times, would be a considerable improvement. Do folks disagree with this? >>



NO, the simpler Avid design works better in the long run. The over-designed LX, XT, XTR works great but there are a lot more components in them and they also develop play.
Avid all the way.