Bible in a Year Thread: 339 days left: Genesis 46-50

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iamme

Lifer
Jul 21, 2001
21,058
3
0
Originally posted by: Gurck
I'll also reiterate my previous question, since nobody was able to answer it: If "don't like it, don't click it" is the feeling, then why not allow hardware & software threads?

there is a seperate forum for this.

Hot deals?

there is a seperate forum for this.

Political discussion?

there is a seperate forum for this.

Ipod scams?

these are spam and not allowed.

Stark's post is in the correct forum (Off-Topic). I've got no problem with Stark posting a set of bible verses each day. I have no problem with you debating the verses or the content of the post. However, when your intentions are only to incite a flame war, you've crossed the line to becoming a troll. It's like someone posting in an iPod opinion thread just to start a flame war about how much they hate Apple.
 
Aug 16, 2001
22,505
4
81
Originally posted by: Arkitech
I don't really believe that the bible is 100% accurate but I think its a good idea to read through it at least once.

The reviews ain't that great so I've been holding off. :D
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: FrustratedUser
Originally posted by: Arkitech
I don't really believe that the bible is 100% accurate but I think its a good idea to read through it at least once.

The reviews ain't that great so I've been holding off. :D

But it's the best seller of all time!
 

callmesteve

Senior member
Jan 5, 2005
690
0
0
Originally posted by: Mathlete
Adam's second wife right???

Something along those lines yes. I ran into this problem and was like wow, BUT the Bible seemed to correct it. Only reason why I've been reading it more in depth. Found many instances where people attack the Bible for contradicting itself but when you REALLY read it, it seems to work out....

Stark, is it ok if we start talking about the Lilith? ;)
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Anyways, this thread having to do with Genesis Chapter's 1-3, you guys ever heard of the Lilith?

Heard of? Yes. Studied? Nope. Been considering looking up information about it, but not something you'd look up on the internet.
 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
126
Please do continue Stark. Though I am an agnostic at best, I can see the educational value in reading the Bible - even if just to see what all the 'hype' is about.
 

loic2003

Diamond Member
Sep 14, 2003
3,844
0
0
I get a daily reading sent to my inbox and I'm going to post the content here.

Couldn't you just post the address for the site that provides this service? That way

a) You don't have to do anything more
b) Only people that want to know about it will be sent it
c) We can avoid one of these big flamey threads each day
d) Only those that wish to increase their 'literacy awareness' do so.

Also, it's not really that cool having a high post count. Figuring ways to increase it whether with 'worthwhile' content or otherwise is pretty lame. There are better ways of getting respect than having "Elite member" next to your name on some internet forum...

Instead of copy-pasting some dodgy e-mail, why not do something genuinely useful such as browsing all the tech sites and posting a rundown of the day's events?

just an idea....
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Originally posted by: Mathlete
Adam's second wife right???

Something along those lines yes. I ran into this problem and was like wow, BUT the Bible seemed to correct it. Only reason why I've been reading it more in depth. Found many instances where people attack the Bible for contradicting itself but when you REALLY read it, it seems to work out....

Stark, is it ok if we start talking about the Lilith? ;)

Haven't seen a single so-called contradiction that wasn't really a misinterpretation or lack of actually reading the bible. Although, there are many misconceptions in christianity due to christians not reading the bible either.
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: loic2003
I get a daily reading sent to my inbox and I'm going to post the content here.

Couldn't you just post the address for the site that provides this service? That way

a) You don't have to do anything more
b) Only people that want to know about it will be sent it
c) We can avoid one of these big flamey threads each day
d) Only those that wish to increase their 'literacy awareness' do so.

a) The point was he wants to do more
b) Only people that want to know about it can click the topic
c) Ban the trolls then
d) read b)
 

callmesteve

Senior member
Jan 5, 2005
690
0
0
Originally posted by: malak
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Anyways, this thread having to do with Genesis Chapter's 1-3, you guys ever heard of the Lilith?

Heard of? Yes. Studied? Nope. Been considering looking up information about it, but not something you'd look up on the internet.

Yup, lot of misconception about this Lilith character, because it seems to be a mythical Hebrew character, that like kills all your kids or what not. Some type of she demon and comes out only once in the Bible, in Isaiah.

Lot of people have two arguments when it comes to her. First, Bible talks about Hebrew mythology, Bible thus equals Hebrew mythology.

Second was something along the lines of what Mathlete said about her being the wife of Adam. I didn't hear it was the second but more along the lines of the first. She was the prototype that lead to Eve, or something along the lines of that

It was a very interesting read. Just out of curiousity did a little "bible project". Not online of course. Too many biased opinions.
 

Stark

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2000
7,735
0
0
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Anyways, this thread having to do with Genesis Chapter's 1-3, you guys ever heard of the Lilith?

Lilith in the Bible and other ancient texts

Lilith's name only appears once in the Old Testament at Isaiah 34:15, where it is translated as "great owl" in the King James Version of the Bible, leading to Lilith often being portrayed in imagery as an owl (this interpretation has been disputed).

However, some interpret the passage in Genesis 1:27 ? "So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them" ? before describing a mate being made of Adam's rib and being called Eve in Genesis 2:22, to mean that Adam had a wife before Eve, and that this could have been Lilith. However, this divergence is often explained as a weaving together of two different creation myths, as the Bible describes man being created in both Genesis 1:26 and 2:7.

Lilith's name also appears in the Dead Sea Scrolls in passages that are based on the above-noted Isaiah reference, and in various places in the Talmud and the Zohar.

Lilith as Adam's first wife

The origin of Adam and Lilith is not clear, as only one explicit reference to her exists in the bible. However, the Hebrew tradition of placing an amulet around the neck of newborn boys, inscribed with the names of 3 angels who are to protect them from the Lilins until their circumcision, lends weight to the argument that Lilith has her origins in Hebrew mythology, and is not the creation of later medieval authors.

One medieval reference to Lilith as the first wife of Adam, The Alphabet of Ben-Sira, was authored anonymously. Lilith is described as refusing to assume a subservient role to Adam during sexual intercourse and deserts him ("She said, 'I will not lie below,' and he said, 'I will not lie beneath you, but only on top. For you are fit only to be in the bottom position, while I am to be the superior one.'"). :D Lilith then went on to mate with Asmodai and various other demons she found beside the Red Sea, creating countless lilin. :eek: Adam urged God to bring Lilith back, so three angels were dispatched after her. When the angels, Senoy, Sansenoy, and Semangelof, made threats to kill one hundred of Lilith's demonic children for each day she stayed away, she countered that she would prey eternally upon the descendants of Adam and Eve, who could be saved only by invoking the names of the three angels, and did not return to Adam.

This story has similarities with the original Mesopotamian myth, where Lilith killed children, and so the practice of protecting children by placing Lilith amulets around their necks with the names of the three angels became a custom of many Jewish communities in medieval times. The practice still exists today.

This legend was mistakenly included in an English language book of rabbinic works (the author seemingly assumed that any ancient book read in the Jewish community must have been a rabbinic work). However, contrary to popular belief, The Alphabet of Ben-Sira is not a Jewish religious text; rather, it is a collection of stories about heroes of the Bible and Talmud. Modern historians are unsure of its original purpose, although it may have been a collection of risqué folk-tales, a refutation of Christians, Karaites or other separatist movement, or simply an anti-Jewish satire.

wikipedia

cool reference... i didn't know much beyond that she was the posterchild for the lilith fair. Hey, if it relates in any way to the daily material, throw it out there!!
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Sounds like Lilith is just a folk tale, nothing more. The Isaiah reference doesn't seem to have anything to do with it.
 

callmesteve

Senior member
Jan 5, 2005
690
0
0
Yup looks like Stark found an internet reference ^^

The scripture in Genesis is what I was going ot bring out next. I like how before we mentioned that chapter 1 was all on history yes? It describes day 1-6 no? You know its up to day 6 (last day of creation) because he mentions the creation of man and woman

*hope I have everyone there*

next in chapter 2 the female being he's referencing to IS Eve, and many people say this, 1:27 mentions male and female and 2:22 mentions Eve, there must've been another woman. Which is the Hebrew myth Lilith.

HOWEVER, creation ended day 6. Nothing happened after that because of resting periods. That is why 1:27 talks about a female which is EVE and this can be seen in Chapter 2 (the more detailed version of chapter 1) when it says that Eve was created. She was NOT created after day 6 impossible.
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Yup looks like Stark found an internet reference ^^

The scripture in Genesis is what I was going ot bring out next. I like how before we mentioned that chapter 1 was all on history yes? It describes day 1-6 no? You know its up to day 6 (last day of creation) because he mentions the creation of man and woman

*hope I have everyone there*

next in chapter 2 the female being he's referencing to IS Eve, and many people say this, 1:27 mentions male and female and 2:22 mentions Eve, there must've been another woman. Which is the Hebrew myth Lilith.

HOWEVER, creation ended day 6. Nothing happened after that because of resting periods. That is why 1:27 talks about a female which is EVE and this can be seen in Chapter 2 (the more detailed version of chapter 1) when it says that Eve was created. She was NOT created after day 6 impossible.

Well actually, creation stopped day 7, but that doesn't mean it didn't start up again, nor does it mean adam and eve were the only ones created. After all, Cain did leave his parents to go to another people.
 

callmesteve

Senior member
Jan 5, 2005
690
0
0
Regarding the reference to Owl. Its more like a nightjar. This is only seen in the King James Version. Why can we assume they meant the nightjar (owl) and not the she demon lilith? Well if you read all of that chapter, it mentions the destruction of Edom. God says he is going to leave it totally destroyed, desolate and all these dirty creatures are going to come into the land. It references to hyenas and such thus we can assume that the meaning the Lilith was taking was not the one of the shedemon but of the disgusting bird, nightjar.

WHY though would they use Lilith in KJV and not the word owl or nightjar? This was written in Hebrew times and the Jews knew just how disgusting of a creature the lilith was because of all the folk tales. Thus for emphasis they used Lilith
 

Stark

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2000
7,735
0
0
kind of puts this verse in a new perspective:
16 To the woman He said: "And he shall rule over you."

but what if i enjoy being on the bottom every once in awhile? :p
 

callmesteve

Senior member
Jan 5, 2005
690
0
0
Originally posted by: malak
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Yup looks like Stark found an internet reference ^^

The scripture in Genesis is what I was going ot bring out next. I like how before we mentioned that chapter 1 was all on history yes? It describes day 1-6 no? You know its up to day 6 (last day of creation) because he mentions the creation of man and woman

*hope I have everyone there*

next in chapter 2 the female being he's referencing to IS Eve, and many people say this, 1:27 mentions male and female and 2:22 mentions Eve, there must've been another woman. Which is the Hebrew myth Lilith.

HOWEVER, creation ended day 6. Nothing happened after that because of resting periods. That is why 1:27 talks about a female which is EVE and this can be seen in Chapter 2 (the more detailed version of chapter 1) when it says that Eve was created. She was NOT created after day 6 impossible.

Well actually, creation stopped day 7, but that doesn't mean it didn't start up again, nor does it mean adam and eve were the only ones created. After all, Cain did leave his parents to go to another people.


100% that creation ended day 6. Its also in the first 2 chapters of the Bible. Finished because God said he was pleased with what he created, then he takes a resting day.

Secondly in the New Testament God is said to be a God of order and also it says that anything coming out of his mouth is true and will happen. He is satisfied, thus no more creation
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
The KJV has many wrong words in it. In fact, the language it was written in was outdated before it was written. Many words weren't translated, or were kept from previous translations, instead of going straight from the manuscripts into english. For instance, Lucifer, the name often mistakenly given to the devil, is only found in the KJV.
 

Stark

Diamond Member
Jun 16, 2000
7,735
0
0
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Regarding the reference to Owl. Its more like a nightjar. This is only seen in the King James Version. Why can we assume they meant the nightjar (owl) and not the she demon lilith? Well if you read all of that chapter, it mentions the destruction of Edom. God says he is going to leave it totally destroyed, desolate and all these dirty creatures are going to come into the land. It references to hyenas and such thus we can assume that the meaning the Lilith was taking was not the one of the shedemon but of the disgusting bird, nightjar.

WHY though would they use Lilith in KJV and not the word owl or nightjar? This was written in Hebrew times and the Jews knew just how disgusting of a creature the lilith was because of all the folk tales. Thus for emphasis they used Lilith

you lost me on "nightjar." it's some sort of nasty bird? Is it a real species?
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Originally posted by: malak
Originally posted by: callmesteve
Yup looks like Stark found an internet reference ^^

The scripture in Genesis is what I was going ot bring out next. I like how before we mentioned that chapter 1 was all on history yes? It describes day 1-6 no? You know its up to day 6 (last day of creation) because he mentions the creation of man and woman

*hope I have everyone there*

next in chapter 2 the female being he's referencing to IS Eve, and many people say this, 1:27 mentions male and female and 2:22 mentions Eve, there must've been another woman. Which is the Hebrew myth Lilith.

HOWEVER, creation ended day 6. Nothing happened after that because of resting periods. That is why 1:27 talks about a female which is EVE and this can be seen in Chapter 2 (the more detailed version of chapter 1) when it says that Eve was created. She was NOT created after day 6 impossible.

Well actually, creation stopped day 7, but that doesn't mean it didn't start up again, nor does it mean adam and eve were the only ones created. After all, Cain did leave his parents to go to another people.


100% that creation ended day 6. Its also in the first 2 chapters of the Bible. Finished because God said he was pleased with what he created, then he takes a resting day.

Secondly in the New Testament God is said to be a God of order and also it says that anything coming out of his mouth is true and will happen. He is satisfied, thus no more creation

I think you have to see it from a computer programmer's viewpoint. I used to create things in an online game. I could create a sword with specific properties, and it existed. But I could continue to clone it over and over again. In a more complex way, you can create a template that can create an object with random properties, and clone it repeatedly with mixed results. My view is that when God created man and woman, he created templates of man and woman. According to science, we would need multiple templates even to have the cultures we have today. So the concept of man and woman was created in one day, but the people themselves were made later.