Being aware of computer filesystem limitations and the habits it creates

[mikeymikec]

Even though I started on Windows PCs a good bit after 8.3 was an absolute limitation, I stuck to the convention for a fair few years (I probably gave up on it shortly after I stopped using Win9x).

I was just naming Ghost in the Shell Stand Alone Complex episodes that I've ripped from BR on my PC when I came across one called '¥€$', and I had to figuratively twist my own arm into changing the file name to include that, after googling for invalid NTFS characters and being mindful of the fact that Linux Mint will happily allow me to put a colon into an NTFS file name despite obviously being a big no-no in Windows terms.

Also, seeing too-long file/folder names that say were auto generated by customers saving say a web page to their computer and thinking about the 255 char path length limit (that Windows claims not to have but I routinely encounter it), gets my heckles up a smidge.

 

[sdifox]

LoL try ripping classical CDs.

3.05. Symphony No. 6 in F Major, Op. 68 Pastoral - I. Erwachen heiterer Empfindungen bei der Ankunft auf dem Lande Allegro ma non troppo

that is the file name, then throw path on top and NTFS will choke. I shortened name of composer to Lv Beethoven.

 

[BoomerD]

Even though I started on Windows PCs a good bit after 8.3 was an absolute limitation, I stuck to the convention for a fair few years (I probably gave up on it shortly after I stopped using Win9x).

I was just naming Ghost in the Shell Stand Alone Complex episodes that I've ripped from BR on my PC when I came across one called '¥€$', and I had to figuratively twist my own arm into changing the file name to include that, after googling for invalid NTFS characters and being mindful of the fact that Linux Mint will happily allow me to put a colon into an NTFS file name despite obviously being a big no-no in Windows terms.

Also, seeing too-long file/folder names that say were auto generated by customers saving say a web page to their computer and thinking about the 255 char path length limit (that Windows claims not to have but I routinely encounter it), gets my heckles up a smidge.

Does heckling raise your hackles?

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

Even though I started on Windows PCs a good bit after 8.3 was an absolute limitation, I stuck to the convention for a fair few years (I probably gave up on it shortly after I stopped using Win9x).

I was just naming Ghost in the Shell Stand Alone Complex episodes that I've ripped from BR on my PC when I came across one called '¥€$', and I had to figuratively twist my own arm into changing the file name to include that, after googling for invalid NTFS characters and being mindful of the fact that Linux Mint will happily allow me to put a colon into an NTFS file name despite obviously being a big no-no in Windows terms.

Also, seeing too-long file/folder names that say were auto generated by customers saving say a web page to their computer and thinking about the 255 char path length limit (that Windows claims not to have but I routinely encounter it), gets my heckles up a smidge.

Yup, lots of fun quirks in windows mainly.

Windows actually has no trouble with 255 char limits. Lots of software does though, including Explorer.

One of my favorites that fucks up like 95% of windows admins: MS doesn't let you get an elevated token for explorer, so 'run as admin' on explorer does let you launch it, but without a token, which is why you can't browse to a c$ on another system that you've got admin access on unless your normal account has admin access (which it shouldn't). It's also why you can't make changes to folders that the local admin group has perms to without elevating the file/folder edit process, even if you're a local admin, because you don't inherently have an elevated token just by launching explorer.

 

[mikeymikec]

Windows actually has no trouble with 255 char limits. Lots of software does though, including Explorer.

Other software inside Windows too, like the command prompt. I'm often robocopy'ing a user profile which works fine, then later when I no longer need that data, RMDIR DIRNAME /s /q:

can't delete folder structure
can't delete folder structure
can't delete folder structure

It empties the folder structures, but leaves the problematic folder names intact. Pre my Linux using days I often had to go in and rename folders in those structures to have shorter names then run the delete again and it would handle it, sometimes I ended up with orphans that had to wait for the next quick format.

Sometimes Linux isn't over-keen about cleaning up filesystems affected by this such as exFAT either.

Does heckling raise your hackles?

Probably the best computer-related heckle to aim at me is to suggest wiping and reinstalling Windows as the solution to any computer problem.

 

[Brainonska511]

LoL try ripping classical CDs.

3.05. Symphony No. 6 in F Major, Op. 68 Pastoral - I. Erwachen heiterer Empfindungen bei der Ankunft auf dem Lande Allegro ma non troppo

that is the file name, then throw path on top and NTFS will choke. I shortened name of composer to Lv Beethoven.

View attachment 126349

It can also get bad with SharePoint if you try to access stuff through the file explorer. No limits online for nesting folders and file names, so things can quickly become "path too long".

 

[Red Squirrel]

On a sorta similar subject, street names are another place where it might be best to avoid weird characters. Lot of computer systems like banks etc probably can't handle weird characters.

Vancouver man says institutions unable to recognize new Indigenous street name - BC | Globalnews.ca

Signposts on the Vancouver street bear the English name below the official Musqueam name, which is written in the North American Phonetic Alphabet.

globalnews.ca

Who they hell thought THAT was a good idea. Imagine trying to call 911 if you live on that street lol.

 

[lxskllr]

I can't remember the rules to naming, so I limit non letters to dash, underscore, or dot. I have files with other characters that were created by others, but I don't do it myself.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

I can't remember the rules to naming, so I limit non letters to dash, underscore, or dot. I have files with other characters that were created by others, but I don't do it myself.

Even that can be unreliable, in esxi? i think, usernames can't have .'s in them, maybe underscores as well? been a bit since I walked through this but I got through a few dozen linux hosts with a monitoring account before tripping over esxi username conventions.

 

[sdifox]

Even that can be unreliable, in esxi? i think, usernames can't have .'s in them, maybe underscores as well? been a bit since I walked through this but I got through a few dozen linux hosts with a monitoring account before tripping over esxi username conventions.

 

[Muse]

LoL try ripping classical CDs.

3.05. Symphony No. 6 in F Major, Op. 68 Pastoral - I. Erwachen heiterer Empfindungen bei der Ankunft auf dem Lande Allegro ma non troppo

that is the file name, then throw path on top and NTFS will choke. I shortened name of composer to Lv Beethoven.

View attachment 126349

I have 301 CD players that feature CD Text display. They support display of 3 fields: Track title, Disk title and Performer. If CD Text is present on a disk, it will display the entire CD Text for those fields if the Title button is pressed on the remote. I've never encountered a too long string limitation. While a track is playing, what's shown is the first 10 characters of the track title. I almost always make copies of my CDs, adding or altering the CD Text fields.

If the machine changes the disk selected (but doesn't yet load it to play) it shows the 1st 10 characters of the Disk title (without scrolling the rest). This makes creating a smart & helpful 10 digit string very useful sometimes. I'd never use LV Beethoven! I mean, how many Beethovens were there?

 

[sdifox]

I have 301 CD players that feature CD Text display. They support display of 3 fields: Track title, Disk title and Performer. If CD Text is present on a disk, it will display the entire CD Text for those fields if the Title button is pressed on the remote. I've never encountered a too long string limitation. While a track is playing, what's shown is the first 10 characters of the track title. I almost always make copies of my CDs, adding or altering the CD Text fields.

If the machine changes the disk selected (but doesn't yet load it to play) it shows the 1st 10 characters of the Disk title (without scrolling the rest). This makes creating a smart & helpful 10 digit string very useful sometimes. I'd never use LV Beethoven! I mean, how many Beethovens were there?

Foobar2000 picks up the MP3 Tag so it really doesn't matter what I call the folder. I have about 2.5TB of music on HDDs. Mostly FLAC. Some like the DG Karajan set is 1 file per CD.




this is Karajan conducting Berliner Philharmoniker playing Beethoven's symphonies

 

[Muse]

Probably the best computer-related heckle to aim at me is to suggest wiping and reinstalling Windows as the solution to any computer problem.

I figure I'm probably going to do that with both my Win10 64bit Lenovo Workstation laptops. One won't go into suspend (I therefore have it hibernating when I close the lid), the other can't see USB attached storage devices. I figure a clean install of Windows 11 is apt to resolve both of those problems.

 

[Red Squirrel]

I can't remember the rules to naming, so I limit non letters to dash, underscore, or dot. I have files with other characters that were created by others, but I don't do it myself.

If you want to have fun create a folder called ~ and then delete it.

Preferably in a VM. Actually it's fine if you put it in quotes, but it's still a bit unnerving. Had messed up a script and it ended up creating a folder with that name once and I was like "uhh how do I delete that without deleting my home directory?"

 

[Charmonium]

I feel like such a slouch. I think the 8.3 limitation must have somehow wheedled its way into my genome.

I did finally get used to using longer file names, but just long enough to give me a clue as to what might be in the folder, subfolders and subsub folders.

For whatever reason, using a meaningful name is something that has never made to the level of conscious thought.

 

[Kaido]

"Starting in Windows 10 (Version 1607), the MAX_PATH limitations have been removed from Common Win32 file and directory functions. To use the new extended path behavior, you must opt-in by using a registry key change."

How to Make Windows 10 Accept File Paths Over 260 Characters

Want a small novel for a file path? We've got you covered.

www.howtogeek.com

https://www.autodesk.com/support/technical/article/caas/sfdcarticles/sfdcarticles/The-Windows-10-default-path-length-limitation-MAX-PATH-is-256-characters.html

Windows Doesn't Accept Long Paths by Default

Before Windows 95, Windows only allowed file names that were eight characters long, with a three-character file extension — commonly known as an 8.3 filename. Windows 95 abandoned that to allow long file names, but still limited the maximum path length (which includes the full folder path and the file name) to 260 characters. That limit has been in place ever since. If you've ever run into this limit, it was probably when you were trying to copy deep folder structures into other folders, such as when copying the contents of a hard drive to a folder on another drive. The Windows 10 Anniversary Update finally added the option to abandon that maximum path length.

There is one caveat. This new setting won't necessarily work with every application out there, but it will work with most. Specifically, any modern applications should be fine, as should all 64-bit applications. Older 32-bit applications need to be manifested in order to work, which really just means that the developer has indicated in the application's manifest file that the application supports longer paths. Most popular 32-bit apps should experience no problem. Still, you don't risk anything by trying the setting out. If an application doesn't work, the only thing that will happen is that it won't be able to open or save files that are saved in places where the full path exceeds 260 characters.

 

[[DHT]Osiris]

"Starting in Windows 10 (Version 1607), the MAX_PATH limitations have been removed from Common Win32 file and directory functions. To use the new extended path behavior, you must opt-in by using a registry key change."

How to Make Windows 10 Accept File Paths Over 260 Characters

Want a small novel for a file path? We've got you covered.

www.howtogeek.com

https://www.autodesk.com/support/technical/article/caas/sfdcarticles/sfdcarticles/The-Windows-10-default-path-length-limitation-MAX-PATH-is-256-characters.html

View attachment 126398

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That's still only for Windows itself though. The software 'explorer' still doesn't support long path names, among others.