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Beamdog confirms new Baldur's Gate title in works

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exar333

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2004
8,518
8
91
Eh, no thanks. I'd rather they fix up the remakes they already released, and then move onto Icewind Dale II or Planescape Torment. Still haven't bought any of them though, waiting for them to be all brought up to the same, feature complete standard, though perhaps that will never happen.
Coming from a software dev background, its not the most fun to re-write code from one language to another. Essentially that's what BD is going with the BG franchise. They have done a great job, but I see this as a way for them to monetize their expertise in all the code work they did for BG1 and 2. At this point, I doubt anyone else on the planet knows the ins and outs of the code better than them. Why not use that experience to try and take a crack at something new and original?

Re-creating awesome games from the past is great, but so is working-on and playing new titles and stories.
 

motsm

Golden Member
Jan 20, 2010
1,822
2
76
Coming from a software dev background, its not the most fun to re-write code from one language to another. Essentially that's what BD is going with the BG franchise. They have done a great job, but I see this as a way for them to monetize their expertise in all the code work they did for BG1 and 2. At this point, I doubt anyone else on the planet knows the ins and outs of the code better than them. Why not use that experience to try and take a crack at something new and original?

Re-creating awesome games from the past is great, but so is working-on and playing new titles and stories.
As I said, I'd just rather them fix their current releases first, then go gallivanting making new content that will likely stink.
 

exar333

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2004
8,518
8
91
As I said, I'd just rather them fix their current releases first, then go gallivanting making new content that will likely stink.
Their current releases work great. I played through all of the BG EE and it was almost perfect. Less buggy than the original, actually...
 

bystander36

Diamond Member
Apr 1, 2013
5,154
132
106
You are talking about two different kinds of games.

Action RPGs (DA:I) and a 'real' RPG (BG).
Origins is not an action RPG. DA-I really isn't either, but it certainly is closer towards that side of things. I did not say DA:I, except that it went too far in the wrong direction.

I like both, but what game allows you to really spec out your characters in limitless combinations? How about simulating magic in a way other than just a MMO spam-fest? How about casting spells before, during and after battle for combat and non-combat purposes?
There are tons of possibilities like that in DA:Origins and modern RPG's. There were traps in Origins and runes, there are runes in Skyrim. There are lots of possibilities open to dev's, without having to follow the overly complicated AD&D class system. And all this can be done with melee having more active abilities.

It also allows more logical, and refined combat calculations. Dice rolling was needed back on table top gaming. Now we have PC's to do that all instantly, in much more interesting ways.

That's the huge advantage D&D provides. The wealth of spells, skills and options is 1000x more than a game like DA:I. They don't even compare.

It IS dumbing-down...D&D isn't first and foremost about combat, it is about adventure. I think a lot of modern devs/players forget about that and think combat is the main focus. Its a piece, but not everything. That's why BG1/2 were so darn good. You could complete the game as evil, good, or somewhere in-between. You could have an all-good party, all-bad party, or mixed.
Again, you are talking about DA:I. I'd rather have a DA:O, or something between DA:O and DA2. Stop talking about DA:I's weaknesses, as if that is the only option we have.

AD&D had its place, but it really isn't that spectacular for PC RPG's. You can get all the positives of it, without having to have so many hours of research to manage to put together interesting characters.

I get that nostalgia is why many want it. I get that is why you want AD&D, but it really isn't a great system for PC gaming these days, even if I'd likely play an AD&D PC game again, if it was done well.
 
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Bateluer

Lifer
Jun 23, 2001
27,730
7
0
Eh, no thanks. I'd rather they fix up the remakes they already released, and then move onto Icewind Dale II or Planescape Torment. Still haven't bought any of them though, waiting for them to be all brought up to the same, feature complete standard, though perhaps that will never happen.

The EEs work just fine, and BG1EE and BG2EE have both gotten multiple rather large patches. Beamdog's site has changelogs, I believe. I think I started a thread on the most recent one for BG2EE because it claimed over 300 bug fixes.
 

motsm

Golden Member
Jan 20, 2010
1,822
2
76
The EEs work just fine, and BG1EE and BG2EE have both gotten multiple rather large patches. Beamdog's site has changelogs, I believe. I think I started a thread on the most recent one for BG2EE because it claimed over 300 bug fixes.
The path finding was always the most broken thing about the Infinity Engine, and Beamdog just got around to fixing it a couple months ago (according to their change log anyway), and only for BGII. Until it's fixed in their other releases, I can't say I'm even slightly interested in them.
 

Bateluer

Lifer
Jun 23, 2001
27,730
7
0
The path finding was always the most broken thing about the Infinity Engine, and Beamdog just got around to fixing it a couple months ago (according to their change log anyway), and only for BGII. Until it's fixed in their other releases, I can't say I'm even slightly interested in them.
It really wasn't that bad. You adapted to the game's pathfinding in the first 10 minutes. Its a non-issue, unless you want to just click on the opposite side of the map and have your party arrive there together.
 

exar333

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2004
8,518
8
91
Origins is not an action RPG. DA-I really isn't either, but it certainly is closer towards that side of things. I did not say DA:I, except that it went too far in the wrong direction.


There are tons of possibilities like that in DA:Origins and modern RPG's. There were traps in Origins and runes, there are runes in Skyrim. There are lots of possibilities open to dev's, without having to follow the overly complicated AD&D class system. And all this can be done with melee having more active abilities.

It also allows more logical, and refined combat calculations. Dice rolling was needed back on table top gaming. Now we have PC's to do that all instantly, in much more interesting ways.


Again, you are talking about DA:I. I'd rather have a DA:O, or something between DA:O and DA2. Stop talking about DA:I's weaknesses, as if that is the only option we have.

AD&D had its place, but it really isn't that spectacular for PC RPG's. You can get all the positives of it, without having to have so many hours of research to manage to put together interesting characters.

I get that nostalgia is why many want it. I get that is why you want AD&D, but it really isn't a great system for PC gaming these days, even if I'd likely play an AD&D PC game again, if it was done well.
DA:O and DA:I are in the same league for customizability. If you think those (or really any modern 'RPG' other than a few that came out last year like Divinity: OS) are in the same league as BG1/2/ID1/2, you obviously didn't play those games. :p

Its laughable to compare the two. And yes, I like both genres, but they are leagues apart.
 

exar333

Diamond Member
Feb 7, 2004
8,518
8
91
It really wasn't that bad. You adapted to the game's pathfinding in the first 10 minutes. Its a non-issue, unless you want to just click on the opposite side of the map and have your party arrive there together.
This.

It worked fine. Just not perfect. Not playing the game because of something silly/minor like this means you miss out on a fantastic title.

Believe me, the pathfinding was a heck of a lot worse back in the first few releases on BG at original launch. The game was so much fun, you forget those little things, unless you just can't find joy in anything. :p
 

bystander36

Diamond Member
Apr 1, 2013
5,154
132
106
DA:O and DA:I are in the same league for customizability. If you think those (or really any modern 'RPG' other than a few that came out last year like Divinity: OS) are in the same league as BG1/2/ID1/2, you obviously didn't play those games. :p

Its laughable to compare the two. And yes, I like both genres, but they are leagues apart.
I've played every game you mentioned.

DA:O gives each character roughly 80 talents to choose 25 skills. You can mix and match them in a lot of ways. Not to mention 40ish skills, and stats. I felt like I had a lot of different ways I could mix and match my characters.

Divinity: OS has fewer skill choices, though a skill point gives you access to a lot of spells/abilities. To be honest, DA:O felt a lot more personalized on each character than Divinity: OS, because as you max out your skills, you then could buy every spell/ability in that category. I felt the higher level I got, the more generic each character was.

You obviously have a very different view of what we could create in those games.

It really, at least for me, came down to how you could give each character personalized abilities. In DA:O, I could create a tank rogue, I could create a Backstabbing rogue, or a stunning rogue. I could make a support rogue and so on. As I got high level, they maintained their personality, and even became more specialized in a way.

In Divinity: OS, I found my characters had a lot less personality. As a warrior, I was a tank, or DPS, but ended up with the same skills. If I played a rogue, I would either be an archer or backstabber, and I just had one set of skills or the other and end up with both by the end. The mage had the most choices, but in the end, they almost always end up with almost every spell, and one or 2 trees that were slightly less filled.

I just didn't get the same experience you seem to have.

Edit:
And if you want to compare to AD&D based games of the past. That was my point. They were overly complicated on builds, yet when you played them, melee was almost entirely passive, and mages had fewer abilities, even then. It isn't that you couldn't add a larger list of abilities to choose from either.

My issue with AD&D for modern RPG's, is the character building was overly complicated. If you wanted to pick a spec, you better have picked many very specific abilities as you leveled up. That sort of thing is not needed and melee in AD&D is a snooze fest compared to modern games.
 
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Bateluer

Lifer
Jun 23, 2001
27,730
7
0
My issue with AD&D for modern RPG's, is the character building was overly complicated. If you wanted to pick a spec, you better have picked many very specific abilities as you leveled up. That sort of thing is not needed and melee in AD&D is a snooze fest compared to modern games.
I don't think I'm alone in saying I preferred the more complicated character build. Using DAI as an example: it has very rigid classes, the best weapon is the one with the highest DPS/stats, every rogue ends up the same, every mage ends up nearly the same, every warrior ends up exactly the same. Combat for ranged classes consists of 'click & hold', combat for melee characters consists of the same, except now you have to make sure you're in melee distance and facing the target. Its boring, dull, disconnects the player, and its otherwise a craptastic combat system. Compared to BG2, even if you play as a fighter, there's still several variations of a fighter archetype, with several options underneath each of them.

Granted, and I'll use NWN2 as an example here, if there's 300 skills in the game, and only 12 are actually usable in the game. Why have 'Talk to Animals' for a ranger class if there's no place in the game you actually use it. If you're going to add many skills, feats, and character build options, then there should be places in the game that make them useful. Whats that saying about the rifle on the mantle? If you show the audience a rifle, it'd better get used in the next scene?
 

shortylickens

No Lifer
Jul 15, 2003
79,538
12,356
126
The EEs work just fine, and BG1EE and BG2EE have both gotten multiple rather large patches. Beamdog's site has changelogs, I believe. I think I started a thread on the most recent one for BG2EE because it claimed over 300 bug fixes.
Bg1 EE stopped working on my system as of the latest patch.
And Beamdog refused to fix it.

So, yeah, theres that.
 

pathos

Senior member
Aug 12, 2009
461
0
0
Curse of the Azure Bonds takes place in the city of Tilverton.
Eye of the Beholder takes place in the city of Waterdeep.
Gateway to the Savage Frontier takes place in Yartar.
Hillsfar takes place in, well, the town of Hillsfar.
Icewind Dale takes place in the city of Easthaven.
Icewind Dale II takes place in the harbor town of Targos, of the Ten Towns.
Menzoberranzan takes place in the undercity of Menzoberranzan.
Pool of Radianceis set in and about the city of Phlan.
/shock Where is my close to favorite game temple of elemental evil? :eek:
 

pathos

Senior member
Aug 12, 2009
461
0
0
Theres literally like a thousand games worth of material in Faerun and more on Abeir-Torril as a whole.
But they are trying to make money and known settings get people coming back. Known as in the sense that video gamers remember it from a recent game.
I actually used to play pnp dnd waaaay back in the day. We'd take turns running campaigns. I'd run greyhawk, a friend would run fr, a second friend would run some other campaign that I never could remember the name of, while a third friend would run a custom campaign.

I was always partial to my greyhawk campaign myself (heh, go figure). Followed by the custom campaign, then fr 3rd. I never really liked whatever the last realm was. I just remember it was very low fantasy, and I could never get into it.

I'd actually rather see more games set in the greyhawk universe myself, like the Temple of Elemental Evil (although I understand why fr is used more). Heck, I'd be ok with them just converting more of the original dnd modules into pc games (doing the whole against the slavers/giants/drow campaign would be great).

But, even I'll admit that the fr realm is more fleshed out, and has alot more material to pull from. The greyhawk world was huge...but they sort of left it up to the individual dm to flesh out the world, after they gave you some rather brief descriptions, normally.
 
Oct 30, 2004
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NWN 1 & 2, with all their options, did make for some great replay value.
I can't really comment on NWN 2 since I never played that. But NWN-1 was great, and offered free online multiplayer which is one of the most overlooked aspects of that game. It wasn't available in Baldur's Gate or Dragon Age.

Modders would create "persistent worlds" servers that would remember your character, and you could log onto the server and play with dozens of other people at one time (with hundreds and potentially thousands of characters being part of the server's world).
 

Ancalagon44

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2010
3,274
202
106
Hmmm.

The problem is, BG1 had you ending at level 1. BG1 with the expansions allowed you to reach level 10 or so.

BG2 expects new characters to be level 7.

What happens if you play BG1:EE, get to level 10, then export to Dragonspear? What level will you finish at? Level 13? 14?

When you then import your character into BG2:EE, you'll be ridiculously overpowered.

I actually wish they would leave the Bhaalspawn saga alone. Its been done to death. They should have made a game that has nothing to do with Bhaalspawn. There are so many stories to tell in the Forgotten Realms universe, why does everything need to be about Bhaalspawn?
 

Mopetar

Diamond Member
Jan 31, 2011
6,125
2,943
136
It's probably not a huge difference as that only works out to an extra 4.5 million experience (depending on class), which will give you an extra level by the end of ToB. It might trivialize some of the earlier encounters in SoA, but if it's only one character it won't be too bad.
 
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