Basic question from the semi-ignorant; are all HARDWARE RAID cards 64-bit? And other RAID questions.

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MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
I do know the diff b/t a software and a hardware raid card. But I don't know if "real" RAID cards are all 64-bit. If so, one obviously won't fit on my Abit KT7 mobo.

I may have the opportunity to attend a "going out of business/used stuff" type sale this weekend. I know there will be server-type parts there and if the price is right, I may try to pick up a hardware RAID card. (Lot of "mays" here, but I'd like to be prepared just in case). Thanks.

Oh, also, what's the diff b/t RAID 0+1 (I know what that is) and RAID 10? Um, also, what's the RAID mode that uses three drives? The mode where it stipes to two drives and the third drive gets a parity bit? Is that mode as secure as 0+1? Thanks.
 
S

Smbu

Platinum Member
Jul 13, 2000
2,403
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I'm not sure if those 64bit cards will be incompatible with your system. The Adaptec 29160 U160 scsi card(not a raid card) that I have is a 64bit pci card, but it is also backwards compatible in 32bit pci slots.
 
MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
Hmm. Maybe I'm confused. I am under the impression that ALL 64-bit cards have "the big connector" you know, the part that actually goes into the PCI slot is of the "long" variety as opposed to say, a 32-bit sound card which has the "short" PCI connector for a normal PCI slot. AM I confused? :confused:
 
U

ucla88

Senior member
Jul 15, 2001
265
0
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most hardware raid controllers are 64 bit-but many 64 bit cards will fit into a regular 32 bit slot and work in 32 bit mode (i.e. limited
to 133mb/s). so you have to address two questions- one, will the specific raid card support 32 bit operation and will a full length card
fit in your case?

raid 01 and 10 are often used interchangeably, but they are not quite the same for larger arrays. it's easier to draw than explain.
think about an eight drive array. in 10 the drives are mirrored first, then striped. in 01 they are striped first then the stripes are mirrored (like i said-easier to draw eight arrays under both scenarios then think about the difference)

actually, there are a couple of parity raid setups, most common is raid 5-which uses a parity bit distributed across the drives.
this usually requires 3 or more drives
 
W

Windogg

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
10,241
0
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Nope, not all. A few low end card like the Adaptec 2100S is 32bit/33Mhz. Unfortunatly, the card is pure junk with awful performance. A lot of higher end IDE RAID adapters are 32bit/33mhz. My Adaptec 2400A is great. Running full hardware RAID5 with no problems at all. CPU utilization never breaks 3%. :)

RAID3 and RAID5 can use 3 drives with redundancy. You can stripe 3 drives in RAID0 but that is getting risky.

Windogg
 
MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
Thanks gents, I appreciate the education.

Windogg,
RAID 5 is the 3-drive setup with the parity bit thing, right? Also, the Adaptec2400A is a Hardware card, right? Thanks bud. EDIT: I looked at the card on Adaptec's site. It's nice! It already has 32mb of memory onboard, correct? Do you have more memory in yours, or is it OK as is? Thanks.

EDIT:
UCLA88,
Thanks very much for addressing all the variables with me. That was nice of you. I have an Antec 1040, which even has the plastic support thingee for full length cards,so I'd be good to go. SCSI raid is just too expensive right now, plus i already have enough IDE HD's for a 3-drive RAID setup....looks like I'll go that way. Thank you. :)
 
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Windogg

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
10,241
0
0
MichaelD, yes, RAID5 is striping with parity so the array can lose one drive without loss of data. A "hot spare" can also be in place rebuild the array should a drive fail. As for my card, it actually ran great on 32MB. I've have since upgraded to a 128MB. It's easy because most cards the a standard 168pin ECC SDRAM DIMM. As for the hardware, it's basically the same guts as its larger SCSI RAID cousins. It utilizes the Intel i960 RISC processor.

Windogg
 
MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
Thanks, Windogg. Is there a particular reason you went with the 2400A as opposed to a Promise or Tekram card? I've been browsing the different sites and they all seem basically the same.
 
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Windogg

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
10,241
0
0
I want with the Adaptec card because the price was right the time. I thought about the Promise SuperTrak but it was kinda pricey and more than what I needed. I actually didn't know there is a Tekram card out there. Before I purchased, it came down to either the Adaptec or a 3Ware card. Going through the boards at StorageReview, information suggested that the 3Ware board had problems handling mismatched drives and it sometimes even had problems with similar drives using differnt firmware. I didn't want to risk a failure in the future when my drive went out of productions. So I went with the proven i960 based Adaptec.

Windogg
 
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Windogg

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
10,241
0
0
Anand also has a IDE card roundup. They used the older Adaptec AAA-UDMA which was pretty bad. Still, from what I have read, those that want pure performance should get the 3Ware Escalade. All reviews point to it as the top performer in hardware IDE RAID.

Windogg
 
MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
Yes, and I've noticed that the 3Ware is about $100 cheaper....I can get a fourth 40GB drive with that money.....more research is in order here....back to SR! Thanks Windogg.
 
MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
Wow, I hate to say it, but 3Ware's web page stinks! Very little "real" info (not just pamphlet-type advertising stuff) and almost no pics!

I have some questions maybe you guys can answer as 3Wares' page doesn't.

1. Are the 3Ware 6400 and 6410's hardware raid cards? What's the diff b/t the two? Are they ATA-100? One etailer says they are ATA66.

2. Will the performance of these "low end" hardware raid cards be significantly better than the RAID0 from my onboard software raid on my KT7R mobo?

Thanks and sorry for the constant, nagging questions. :eek:
 
MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
Sorry about that QuestionsandAnswers; didn't mean to omit you! You are the man too! :cool: I appreciate the info.
 
MichaelD

MichaelD

Lifer
Jan 16, 2001
31,528
3
76
Ugh. The 6400 is only ATA66. That is not good. Yes, I know all about how no drives can do 66mb/s, let alone 100, but I'm thinking "future compatibility." What to do.....
 
Q

QuestionsandAnsweres

Golden Member
Jun 27, 2001
1,628
0
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umm actually acording to storagereview.com

the ata 100 verson and ata 66 verson peform. the same? :)


the 7410 is ata-100

cost $100 more than the 6410

and performance is same
for raid 0?

ata-100 is not worth it.
 
Q

QuestionsandAnsweres

Golden Member
Jun 27, 2001
1,628
0
0


<< future compatibility >>



what do u mean

FUTURE COMPATIBILITY? talking about 10k rpms IDE hard drives coming out that will use more than 66mbs? sorry but maybe thats why serial ata is coming out :)

i doubt there will ever be a EIDE hard drive that is 10k RPMS
 
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