Basement bathroom rough-in questions

[Tifababy]

I'm in the process of framing my basement. I plan on hiring a plumber to do the plumbing in the bathroom (you have to be a master plumber in our city to do plumbing...and I'm trying to be legit and get permits for everything).

My question is where should I put the walls for the bathroom? Here is where the toilet will go, but to I enclose the tubes on the right in the wall? Or do I put them behind/infront of the wall (it's a utility room behind the future wall, so it wouldn't be bad to be behind it) I'm assuming this is the vent for the toilet (or maybe it's the drain for the sink or maybe both).

Then for the shower, I know this is the vent pipe, but is the plumber going to put a tee on the bottom to feed the tub drain or is he going to have to smash up the concrete? I'm assuming the concrete is messed up there because there is a P-trap underneath, but I can't tell for sure without taking a sledge hammer to it. Here is a close up of the shower vent. So do I enclose this vent in the wall too? If the plumber tees off the vent pipe, then I guess I could put the side wall anywhere, but he goes in-line with the vent pipe, then I'd have to know which tub I'm getting and measure the distance from the side to the center of the drain.

I know I could call a plumber and he'd give me the answers, but I'd rather not pay $60-$70/hr for someone to tell me where to put walls. I've looked online for diagrams of roughed-in bathrooms, but I haven't had much luck.

 

[sohcrates]

i'd sure like to know this as well. i've got an almost identical setup waiting for a shower/toilet in my basement, and i've always wondered where i would have to rough in, and how much space it would take out of my furnace room (where the setup is)

if you dont hear anything here, definitely check out alt.home.repair on groups.google.com

i've found a lot of good info there

 

[Tifababy]

To give an idea of what everything looks like, here is a scan of the blueprints from the builder. Although the walls don't fit exactly like this because the furnace is bigger in real life.

 

[Rubycon]

Is that a Gottlieb pinball machine? :Q

 

[GoPackGo]

Typically you cant frame the bathroom until after the rough-in for the plumbing is done.

 

[dullard]

Hmm, this seems familiar. I started the same thing a couple weeks back. Unfortunately for me, the results aren't pretty. I've had to take a break for now.

Heck, I too even had to move Christmas garland from my toilet area.

I'm enclosing all my tubes into the walls. That will give me a great area for a medicine cabinet inset.

 

[Tifababy]

Originally posted by: MS Dawn
Is that a Gottlieb pinball machine? :Q

Yes, it's a 1977 Gottlieb Superspin (same as this one). My father-in-law gave it to me, unfortunately it doesn't work right now (probably one of the hundreds of contacts is bad and it will be a tedious job to fix it). That's a job for after the basement is finished.

 

[Rubycon]

Originally posted by: Tifababy

Yes, it's a 1977 Gottlieb Superspin (same as this one). My father-in-law gave it to me, unfortunately it doesn't work right now (probably one of the hundreds of contacts is bad and it will be a tedious job to fix it). That's a job for after the basement is finished.

Awesome. I love the sound of the relays and solenoid bumpers and bells along with the scoreboard clicking. Those can be a bear to work on too but it's fun if you like the old school electromechanical stuff.

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Originally posted by: GoPackGo
Typically you cant frame the bathroom until after the rough-in for the plumbing is done.

no. You frame the walls, then they run the rough-in, get inspected, then you sheetrock.

 

[Tifababy]

Originally posted by: MikeyIs4Dcats

Originally posted by: GoPackGo
Typically you cant frame the bathroom until after the rough-in for the plumbing is done.

no. You frame the walls, then they run the rough-in, get inspected, then you sheetrock.

But I don't want to frame the wall around the vent pipe and then they have to bust up the concrete so I have to take down my wall.

 

[tweakmm]

You mean amazing space age tubes?

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: Tifababy
But I don't want to frame the wall around the vent pipe and then they have to bust up the concrete so I have to take down my wall.

Can you call a plumber for a free estimate and while he/she is there ask about the walls? You'd get the correct answer from a professional without paying for it.

 

[Tifababy]

I found a plumber in town that gives free estimates. He's showing up on Tuesday. So hopefully I'll be able to continue with finishing the basement next week.

 

[Tifababy]

The plumber came out yesterday and told me where all the walls should go and he'll have an estimate in the mail in the next day or so.

So now I need to frame in the walls, but I need to smooth out the loose concrete seen here. The wall will be very close to where the chalk line/tape is. So I need to make the concrete surface smooth for the wall.

Is there a tool that can smooth the concrete? I'm guessing that something diamond tipped will be required.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: Tifababy
The plumber came out yesterday and told me where all the walls should go and he'll have an estimate in the mail in the next day or so.

So now I need to frame in the walls, but I need to smooth out the loose concrete seen here. The wall will be very close to where the chalk line/tape is. So I need to make the concrete surface smooth for the wall.

Is there a tool that can smooth the concrete? I'm guessing that something diamond tipped will be required.

I'm not a concrete expert by any stretch of the imagination. But I've done some concrete projects in the past. It may be crude and a poor choice of solutions, but a hammer would probably do that work for you in very little time. Hit the peaks, and they'll be gone.

 

[Kntx]

Originally posted by: Tifababy
The plumber came out yesterday and told me where all the walls should go and he'll have an estimate in the mail in the next day or so.

So now I need to frame in the walls, but I need to smooth out the loose concrete seen here. The wall will be very close to where the chalk line/tape is. So I need to make the concrete surface smooth for the wall.

Is there a tool that can smooth the concrete? I'm guessing that something diamond tipped will be required.

Doesn't look too bad, you can probably go right over it.

 

[Tifababy]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: Tifababy
The plumber came out yesterday and told me where all the walls should go and he'll have an estimate in the mail in the next day or so.

So now I need to frame in the walls, but I need to smooth out the loose concrete seen here. The wall will be very close to where the chalk line/tape is. So I need to make the concrete surface smooth for the wall.

Is there a tool that can smooth the concrete? I'm guessing that something diamond tipped will be required.

I'm not a concrete expert by any stretch of the imagination. But I've done some concrete projects in the past. It may be crude and a poor choice of solutions, but a hammer would probably do that work for you in very little time. Hit the peaks, and they'll be gone.

I tried it with a 16oz hammer and didn't have much luck. Maybe I'll try the sledge hammer tonight...that could be fun!

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: Tifababy
I tried it with a 16oz hammer and didn't have much luck. Maybe I'll try the sledge hammer tonight...that could be fun!

A few wacks with a sledge and you'll crack all the way through the concrete. I would avoid that option. If a light hammer didn't do it, I wouldn't go for a sledge.

As Kntx said, is it minor enough that you can go right over it? Maybe make a notch or two in the bottom sill plate for the big concrete peaks.

 

[bctbct]

OP what type of flooring are you putting down, that would dictate what you need to do to prep the floor.

 

[Squisher]

I had the same problem with concrete being unlevel when I built a bathroom down my basement in July.

I used and small handheld air chisel and then smoothed it off with floor leveler. (keep everthing wet to keep the dust down!)

Area before on the right
After1
After2
That table covers up the pipe coming out of the floor for a shower (I deadended pipes in the wall for it if I ever go to install it).


It's so nice not to having to crawl up two flights of stairs everytime I have to hit the john.

 

[Tifababy]

we plan on having tile in the bathroom once it's finished. Most of the "ugliness" will end up being under the tub and will be broken up when the plumber breaks up the concrete to install the shower drain.

After the plumber came last week he told me to have a 60" opening for the tub and the walls have to be in place before he can do anything. He also told me that I should put the toilet vent in the wall.

I guess I was correct in my guesses of where the walls should go.

For the floor, I broke off the loose stuff with a hammer but there was still quite a few bumps...but I decided to start building over the concrete to see how it'd work and I think it went pretty well.

Here is a picture of part of the wall already up.

The plumber quoted $1225 to hook up the shower drain, run the water lines for the tub, toilet and sink and run the drain for the sink.

Then another $200 to move the toilet because the builder was dumb and only gave 15" of clearance from the wall to the center of the drain and 16" is required by code.

We have the option of buying our own fixtures or the plumber can provide a Kohler shower and toilet and a Moen faucet for $625.

So it'd be $2050 for the entire bathroom. I was expecting $1500 without the fixtures, so it was very close to what I was expecting. Now we're debating whether we want to get a second estimate or if we just hire the guy and get it done (although I have to finish the framing first.

Does $2050 seem like a reasonable esimate (with the fixtures)?

 

[dullard]

I can't say what plumbers cost in your area. But when I asked a plumber for my basement bathroom, he gave me a quick guess of $400 labor (one full day) + materials to hook up a shower, toilet, and sink (I didn't have the extra work that you had). It wasn't a real estimate, but just a quick guess.

I do have a question about your latest picture of the wall. I can't see things very well, and I don't know your plans, but I was thinking about how you will finish the walls and ceiling. I'm assuming you will drywall everything. If so, are you going to put in studs so that you can attach all the edges securely? You don't want to be able to push the walls/ceiling in on the corners. Look here. The x's are approximate places for screws (and/or glue) for the drywall. Blue for the ceiling, red for the wall. But what about the question marks? Are there studs in those locations to attach the edge of the drywall? Or do you have other plans?

 

[MikeyIs4Dcats]

Originally posted by: dullard
I can't say what plumbers cost in your area. But when I asked a plumber for my basement bathroom, he gave me a quick guess of $400 labor (one full day) + materials to hook up a shower, toilet, and sink (I didn't have the extra work that you had). It wasn't a real estimate, but just a quick guess.

I do have a question about your latest picture of the wall. I can't see things very well, and I don't know your plans, but I was thinking about how you will finish the walls and ceiling. I'm assuming you will drywall everything. If so, are you going to put in studs so that you can attach all the edges securely? You don't want to be able to push the walls/ceiling in on the corners. Look here. The x's are approximate places for screws (and/or glue) for the drywall. Blue for the ceiling, red for the wall. But what about the question marks? Are there studs in those locations to attach the edge of the drywall? Or do you have other plans?

yes, he definitely needs to add nailers at those locations

 

[Tifababy]

Originally posted by: dullard
I can't say what plumbers cost in your area. But when I asked a plumber for my basement bathroom, he gave me a quick guess of $400 labor (one full day) + materials to hook up a shower, toilet, and sink (I didn't have the extra work that you had). It wasn't a real estimate, but just a quick guess.

I do have a question about your latest picture of the wall. I can't see things very well, and I don't know your plans, but I was thinking about how you will finish the walls and ceiling. I'm assuming you will drywall everything. If so, are you going to put in studs so that you can attach all the edges securely? You don't want to be able to push the walls/ceiling in on the corners. Look here. The x's are approximate places for screws (and/or glue) for the drywall. Blue for the ceiling, red for the wall. But what about the question marks? Are there studs in those locations to attach the edge of the drywall? Or do you have other plans?

I'll be attaching another 2x4 on the wall and 2x2 on the ceiling so that I'll have a corner to screw into. I've had to do it for a few other walls already. It's a pain finishing a basement because of all the extra studs to form corners and all the extra framing to go around the HVAC stuff. Atleast in the family room section the builder was kind enough to put all the vents in between the rafters, but in the hallways, bedroom and bathroom I have to work around them.