Bailout bill failing in House

[Balt]

-675

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: senseamp

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: senseamp
Looks like GOP is on a suicide course.

Nope. Pelosi is.

I say that because today marks the day that finishes her in terms of remaining Speaker of the House during the 111th Congress.

Pelosi has been the most inept House Speaker in the modern era. She has time and time again failed to get the support needed before bringing a bill the the floor. She has embarrassed herself and her party one to many times. Sure blame the GOP for this. But its really poor management of the House. The Dems have a commanding majority in the House. If she had done her job this bill would not have failed. Her ineptness let this bill fail.

Good luck with that argument when the "My (Republican) opponent voted against this economic recovery bill" ads start rolling.

You need to go back to school and learn to read. No where did I say the GOP would take control of the House. I simply stated Pelosi's days as Speaker of the House are numbered. She will be challenged, and her challenger will win. My money is on Rahm Emanuel.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: LegendKiller

Originally posted by: brandonb

Originally posted by: jbourne77


You totally glossed over a question someone else posed to you: What happens when 95% of all potential car buyers cannot get loans? Mortgagees? Business expansion? Student loans?

I don't think people really understand the potential impact here.

I guess the banks will have to learn to adapt, like everybody else.

What type of job do you have?

I think we know what type of job you have (financial sector duh) due to your irrational, borderline hysterical posts that the sky is falling and we're all fcked.

What are the odds that you get that bonus in March, and be honest.

You didn't answer the question. Answer it.

Ok, we get it. You're pissed that you won't get your bonus.

Rest assured, my job is on a guaranteed contract until 2013 since you really wanted to know.

 

[badnewcastle]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon
:thumbsup:Thank God that some of those Repub's are voting true to their party. :thumbsup:

:beer::thumbsup:

 

[evident]

-700 points!

 

[BansheeX]

Originally posted by: Craig234
I'm not seeing an FDR figure who has much of a plan for how to fix both the need for the government to assist with liquidity and to address the systemic issues. Just chaos.

Good, the last thing we need during a market correction following an inflationary boom period is a socialist nationalizing industry, confiscating private property, sending tariffs and income tax rates to the moon, and paying government workers with those taxes to go around plowing under crops and slaughtering livestock to keep the price of food from going down. If you think we can continue to expand credit year over year and keep this charade going forever, you are sadly mistaken. Just pray to god that if the bailout doesn't happen, the politicians stay the hell away from the market and let the consequences fall squarely on those who risked them, and maybe, just maybe, we'll kill the socialist FED and the community reinvestment act type nonsense that led to all this abandonment of self-regulation.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: evident
-700 points!

The fit is hitting the shan.

 

[SunnyD]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: DomS
We need to make up our fucking minds here. Are we a free market or not? Pick one and stick with it.

we're not.

Nope, and for the first time in a long time, the government is showing it's not free to the highest bidder.

 

[galperi1]

Link to Roll Call

Looks like 94 democrats and 132 republicans can look forward to a world of hurt come election day

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: DrewSG3
Dow back down to 630.

700 now

 

[DrewSG3]

724 now

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: Stoneburner
Rahm Emannuel is no Tom Delay

Just let it all burn I still say.

Rahm is a son of a bitch who knows how to get shit done. Hes fourth in terms of Power. Hes the chairmen of the Cacucus. He doesnt have the power the three above him does. His job is mainly focused on policy development and election strategy. If he was Speaker I doubt this wouldve happened.

Pelosi has the bloody pulpit. Hoyer is the Whip. They are the ones to blame for the large chuck of Dems voting nay.

Rahm will be the next Speaker of the House.

Do you want members of congress voting how they think is right, or being forced to vote how the leadership wants them to vote, sort of defeatng the point of democracy?

The following are quotes from my Democratic Congressman and from a Republican, who each oppose the bill. How do you suggest the leadership get them to vote yes?

Democratic Rep. Pete Stark of Fremont, a former banker, said he probably will not support it, calling dire warnings of a credit meltdown "grossly overrated."

"I think we are being railroaded in the same manner we were to vote for Iraq," Stark said. "The banks of the Bay Area are in good shape, and they're bailing out Wall Street for $700 billion. It's irresponsible and reckless."

Stark said he has been working to get a third of that sum for universal health care, and that with $15 billion, all Californians could have health insurance.

He attributed at least part of the credit tightening that businesses and consumers are feeling now to the recession that economists believe has begun and the unwinding of easy credit that fed the housing bubble.

"I think people will have more trouble getting a mortgage," Stark said. "Auto dealers are going to have more trouble shedding their inventory, which isn't worth much anyway if it's all SUVs. If we found the whole Bay Area seeing the kinds of foreclosures, say that they have in Stockton, we'd probably react to that. But it's not been that way in Fremont and it's not been that way in Burlingame, or San Francisco. I think that $700 billion would hurt the value of the dollar, which would raise oil prices even further, and probably increase inflation. I think we're rushing this through too quickly."

Rep. Jeff Flake, R-Ariz., said conservatives have been burned by President Bush before on things such as the costly Medicare drug benefit and are in no mood to swallow such a large government intervention in the economy.

"This thing, 'We've got to get this done tomorrow, we can't deviate, it has to be exactly like this,' there were a lot of eyes rolling around the room, saying, 'We've heard this before,' " Flake said.

To many people dont understand how the House works. Thats why there is this thing called bargining. For the House to work and get things done, it requires the majority party to vote in lock step. To get this accomplished leadership offers carrots to its lower ranking members.

And that has - and should have - limited effect. When the Bush administration sells out the public with its big Medicare drug bill giveaway and tells house members to vote for it, they should say no, not say yes to screwing the taxpayer because of carrots. That's called 'corruption' that you're praising so highly.

Its not corruption. Its how Congress has worked since the inception of political parties.

You say that like they're mutually exclusive.

 

[IronWing]

When do automated trading restrictions kick in?

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: evident
-700 points!

The fit is hitting the shan.

and its not done yet.

the grandstanding, politics and bullshit is really really hurting us.

fuckign sick of the goverment.

 

[Wreckem]

Originally posted by: galperi1
Link to Roll Call

Looks like 94 democrats and 132 republicans can look forward to a world of hurt come election day

You are stupid if you think a bailout package wont be passed between now and then. They'll have one by the end of the week.

 

[ohnoes]

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: ohnoes

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Nobody is saying that lending hasn't been curtailed/tightened. And please tell us how another Great Depression will occur, this should be interesting.

Then you admit that there is a _real_ chance of businesses not being able to make payroll/expenses, which was your original point of contention.

No, my original point is that loans from the major banks who are doing fine (e.g. Wells, BoA, Chase, HSBC) aren't going deny them to small businesses who actually deserve them.

That depends on the amount of capital they have, and how many SB's 'deserve' loans as you put it. I.e. if they don't have the capital to support all of the 'deserving' SB's, some won't be able to secure credit lines, regardless of how 'deserving' they are.

 

[theeedude]

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: senseamp

Originally posted by: Wreckem

Originally posted by: senseamp
Looks like GOP is on a suicide course.

Nope. Pelosi is.

I say that because today marks the day that finishes her in terms of remaining Speaker of the House during the 111th Congress.

Pelosi has been the most inept House Speaker in the modern era. She has time and time again failed to get the support needed before bringing a bill the the floor. She has embarrassed herself and her party one to many times. Sure blame the GOP for this. But its really poor management of the House. The Dems have a commanding majority in the House. If she had done her job this bill would not have failed. Her ineptness let this bill fail.

Good luck with that argument when the "My (Republican) opponent voted against this economic recovery bill" ads start rolling.

You need to go back to school and learn to read. No where did I say the GOP would take control of the House. I simply stated Pelosi's days as Speaker of the House are numbered. She will be challenged, and her challenger will win. My money is on Rahm Emanuel.

You seem to have some sort of emotional involvement with taking down Pelosi. If GOP gets hammered for this, which it will, I don't really care if Pelosi is leader in November or not. I am fine with Rahm.

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: CADsortaGUY

Originally posted by: Drakkon
Now this isn't helpful - house republican leadership coming out and blaming the dems - namely Pelosi - for being partisan. If that is the case than it is truly a sad day in America. To let this partisan bickering ruin a solution that people had agreed on is just a pathetic and despicable. I'm going to be looking into seeing how my rep voted to make sure he acted his mind and not his party.

As opposed to Pelosi's bomb throwing on the floor this morning... :roll:

I agree. While its stupid for republicans to get all butt hurt over politics as usual and take their ball and go home when they thing the bill really needs to pass...its equally as stupid for democrats to risk derailing the same bill they think is important just so they can score some political jabs.

If the bill is really so important, you'd resist the urge...especially if its expected to be so close.

 

[SP33Demon]

Originally posted by: ohnoes

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Originally posted by: ohnoes

Originally posted by: SP33Demon

Nobody is saying that lending hasn't been curtailed/tightened. And please tell us how another Great Depression will occur, this should be interesting.

Then you admit that there is a _real_ chance of businesses not being able to make payroll/expenses, which was your original point of contention.

No, my original point is that loans from the major banks who are doing fine (e.g. Wells, BoA, Chase, HSBC) aren't going deny them to small businesses who actually deserve them.

That depends on the amount of capital they have, and how many SB's 'deserve' loans as you put it.

Can you prove that any of the major banks are hurting for capital (aside from the ones who drank the Kool Aid like Wachovia)? Can you explain why Wells Fargo is trading at a near all time high? Can you explain why you think a business who has been losing money but wants to upgrade its "latte machines" is not a smart loan?

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: BansheeX

Originally posted by: Craig234
I'm not seeing an FDR figure who has much of a plan for how to fix both the need for the government to assist with liquidity and to address the systemic issues. Just chaos.

Good, the last thing we need during a market correction following an inflationary boom period is a socialist nationalizing industry, confiscating private property, sending tariffs and income tax rates to the moon, and paying government workers with those taxes to go around plowing under crops and slaughtering livestock to keep the price of food from going down. If you think we can continue to expand credit year over year and keep this charade going forever, you are sadly mistaken. Just pray to god that if the bailout doesn't happen, the politicians stay the hell away from the market and let the consequences fall squarely on those who risked them, and maybe, just maybe, we'll kill the socialist FED and the community reinvestment act type nonsense that led to all this abandonment of self-regulation.

I need to go talk to a flat-worlder now for some relatively rational discussion.

FWIW I did not say someone to impliement the exact same policies, I said someone to determine what will work. FDR created the SEC - that helped reduce harmful manipulations.

Seems to me you sound like a cult member who is not being too rational in your view, simply ideological.

 

[Stuxnet]

Where are the two effing candidates in all of this? If someone wants to prove their leadership abilities, I'm all ears.

 

[theeedude]

I think Republicans wanted to vote against this bill so they can have their dignity but still have it pass so they wouldn't get beat up. Now they are gonna get hurt so bad, and yet so good

 

[badnewcastle]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Where are the two effing candidates in all of this? If someone wants to prove their leadership abilities, I'm all ears.

They are having coffee together right now trying to figure out what to do.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: jbourne77
Where are the two effing candidates in all of this? If someone wants to prove their leadership abilities, I'm all ears.

Doing something other than speeches and grandstanding? Oh the horros, they are getting work done!

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: galperi1
Link to Roll Call

Looks like 94 democrats and 132 republicans can look forward to a world of hurt come election day

For voting how their constituents apparently want them to by a 100 to 1 margin?