Auto vs Stick vs Motorcycle

[punjabiplaya]

haha

 

[Fenixgoon]

haha that's pretty good!

love "heavy traffic" and "oral"

 

[Throckmorton]

Could that text be any smaller?? I had to strain to read

 

[MotF Bane]

Bahahahaha. Oral is great.

 

[Harrod]

Ha ha, that's so funny.

 

[DivideBYZero]

I don't get the steep hill reference.

 

[Kroze]

Yea, text are too small for my old age.

 

[JCH13]

:biggrin:

 

[PlasmaBomb]

I don't get the steep hill reference.

People that made it must be related to ShawnD1...

 

[Lotheron]

I don't get the steep hill reference.

Perhaps it has something to do with the extra skill required when stopped on a steep hill with a stick.

 

[DivideBYZero]

Perhaps it has something to do with the extra skill required when stopped on a steep hill with a stick.

Meh, it's not hard.

 

[Murloc]

it's not hard at all, it can be the first times you drive because you don't feel the car yet.

Heavy traffic is the only situation where an auto is definitely better than the stick because it's just boring anyway, so it better be boring but easy.

I think the image pretty much shows it:
if you use the car to move around like most people do (and you don't care about the driving experience, enjoying roads like this one: http://www.ski-epic.com/2007_europe_motorcycle_trip/p85b_grimsel_pass_and_furkapass_switzerland.jpg ), it just comes down to money.
In europe most cars are manuals because of the extra $4000 that you have to put in, which is mostly a waste of money because you learned to cope with the heavy traffic with a stick when you got your license anyway. In europe a lot of people have small cheap cars, and an auto is not cheap.

 

[Sunny129]

Meh, it's generally not hard.

fixed.

it all depends on the car. if the drivetrain is bone stock, then the clutch will more than likely feel as soft as butter and easy to operate...and yes, it should be relatively easy to get yourself moving from a dead stop on an uphill. then there's my car lol, which i guarantee you 99 out of 100 people would stall trying to get her moving from a dead stop on level ground, let alone on an incline. suffice it to say that, even in a car whose clutch is like a marshmallow and easy as hell to operate, it'll take some practice to learn how to get going on an incline without rolling too much first for those who are new to it. so from that point of view, the steep hill reference makes plenty of sense.

 

[ShawnD1]

I don't get the steep hill reference.

Me neither. It's only recently that some automatics have "grade logic" that will hold lower gears when going up hills instead of changing gears every 2 seconds.
edit: Toyota Corollas do not have grade logic so my car shuffles through gears

In europe most cars are manuals because of the extra $4000 that you have to put in

lol Europe. In North America the automatic is more like $1000 extra.

 

[Zap]

In europe most cars are manuals

It was that way in the Philippines too, when I visited last year.

 

[DivideBYZero]

fixed.

it all depends on the car. if the drivetrain is bone stock, then the clutch will more than likely feel as soft as butter and easy to operate...and yes, it should be relatively easy to get yourself moving from a dead stop on an uphill. then there's my car lol, which i guarantee you 99 out of 100 people would stall trying to get her moving from a dead stop on level ground, let alone on an incline. suffice it to say that, even in a car whose clutch is like a marshmallow and easy as hell to operate, it'll take some practice to learn how to get going on an incline without rolling too much first for those who are new to it. so from that point of view, the steep hill reference makes plenty of sense.

I doubt it. What's special about your car that makes it hard to move off on level ground? Paddle clutch?

 

[JCH13]

fixed.

it all depends on the car. if the drivetrain is bone stock, then the clutch will more than likely feel as soft as butter and easy to operate...and yes, it should be relatively easy to get yourself moving from a dead stop on an uphill. then there's my car lol, which i guarantee you 99 out of 100 people would stall trying to get her moving from a dead stop on level ground, let alone on an incline. suffice it to say that, even in a car whose clutch is like a marshmallow and easy as hell to operate, it'll take some practice to learn how to get going on an incline without rolling too much first for those who are new to it. so from that point of view, the steep hill reference makes plenty of sense.

What sort of clutch do you have?

I did fine my first time out with my Miata's 6-puck clutch and heavy duty pressure plate...

 

[Sunny129]

I doubt it. What's special about your car that makes it hard to move off on level ground? Paddle clutch?

WOTM clutch kit, which consists of:
- RPS max pressure plate (makes the clutch pedal in just about any traditionally stiff-clutched car feel soft, including all of those American muslce cars that feel like you have to literally stand on the clutch pedal to get it to go down)
- Arizona 6-puck solid (unsprung) hub

...in conjunction with:
- RPS light weight billet flywheel

add to it the fact that it is a single disk clutch (and not one of those multi-disk type clutches that are ever-so-slippable and easy to feather), and you can easily see that this formula makes for a drivetrain that is either "enaged" or "not engaged." there is no in between, there is no slipping this clutch. if you try to feather it, the whole drivetrain (and consequently the whole car) shudders and jerks. in other words, if i start to experience the shudder, i had better either depress or pop the clutch pedal fast, or else i'll wear the hell out of my clutch assembly very prematurely. if the revs aren't up, you can easily see how this can result in stalling, incline or not.

don't worry - this is not my daily driver, or else i'd go insane. i have such a setup for road racing and other HPDE's - it would be completely impractical on the streets, although i do occasionally street this car (with emphasis on "occasionally").

 

[Sunny129]

What sort of clutch do you have?

I did fine my first time out with my Miata's 6-puck clutch and heavy duty pressure plate...

you're clearly an automotive enthusiast who knows what to expect from such upgrades. don't get me wrong, i am too. and i'm not saying that its difficult for me to operate my car on level ground or an incline. but there was certainly a grace period where i had to get used to the new clutch & flywheel when i first installed it.

given that a majority of all drivers are not automotive enthusiasts, and given that a majority of those folks are automotively challenged to say the least, the steep uphill reference in the OP is crystal clear to me. the bottom line is that, regardless of whether you, i, and others in this thread may or may not have trouble with a manual tranny on an incline, cars with manual tranny's are generally going to be more diffucult to get moving from a stop on an incline than any car w/ an auto tranny or any bike.

 

[Toastedlightly]

you're clearly an automotive enthusiast who knows what to expect from such upgrades. don't get me wrong, i am too. and i'm not saying that its difficult for me to operate my car on level ground or an incline. but there was certainly a grace period where i had to get used to the new clutch & flywheel when i first installed it.

given that a majority of all drivers are not automotive enthusiasts, and given that a majority of those folks are automotively challenged to say the least, the steep uphill reference in the OP is crystal clear to me. the bottom line is that, regardless of whether you, i, and others in this thread may or may not have trouble with a manual tranny on an incline, cars with manual tranny's are generally going to be more diffucult to get moving from a stop on an incline than any car w/ an auto tranny or any bike.

My brother's car has one of these. The clutch pedal is very light but the engagement zone is about the width of a human hair.. cut in half.

I would wager many people would not be able to get his car moving w/o lighting up the tires.

 

[Sunny129]

My brother's car has one of these. The clutch pedal is very light but the engagement zone is about the width of a human hair.. cut in half.

I would wager many people would not be able to get his car moving w/o lighting up the tires.

that was exactly my point w/ an "on/off" clutch. you either light 'em up a bit, or stall out. the only thing that throws a monkey wrench into the comparison is that you're showing what appears to be an Exedy multi-disk clutch, which should be quite slippable, unlike my single disk clutch. nevertheless, i don't doubt what you say about it, as it is a high performance clutch that you wouldn't find in the typical car, and would therefore be difficult for most people to operate until they get very used to it.

 

[jlee]

that was exactly my point w/ an "on/off" clutch. you either light 'em up a bit, or stall out. the only thing that throws a monkey wrench into the comparison is that you're showing what appears to be an Exedy multi-disk clutch, which should be quite slippable, unlike my single disk clutch. nevertheless, i don't doubt what you say about it, as it is a high performance clutch that you wouldn't find in the typical car, and would therefore be difficult for most people to operate until they get very used to it.

I think two out of the last three times I've brought my car in for a state inspection, the mechanic promptly stalled it. Even after I warned him about the clutch...

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

i don't care how great you are at driving stick.
traffic going up a steep hill is a BITCH.

 

[DivideBYZero]

WOTM clutch kit, which consists of:
- RPS max pressure plate (makes the clutch pedal in just about any traditionally stiff-clutched car feel soft, including all of those American muslce cars that feel like you have to literally stand on the clutch pedal to get it to go down)
- Arizona 6-puck solid (unsprung) hub

...in conjunction with:
- RPS light weight billet flywheel

add to it the fact that it is a single disk clutch (and not one of those multi-disk type clutches that are ever-so-slippable and easy to feather), and you can easily see that this formula makes for a drivetrain that is either "enaged" or "not engaged." there is no in between, there is no slipping this clutch. if you try to feather it, the whole drivetrain (and consequently the whole car) shudders and jerks. in other words, if i start to experience the shudder, i had better either depress or pop the clutch pedal fast, or else i'll wear the hell out of my clutch assembly very prematurely. if the revs aren't up, you can easily see how this can result in stalling, incline or not.

don't worry - this is not my daily driver, or else i'd go insane. i have such a setup for road racing and other HPDE's - it would be completely impractical on the streets, although i do occasionally street this car (with emphasis on "occasionally").

That's what I thought. Although I thought you might have one of these:

Drove one of those in a Scooby once, much fun trying to not stall that fucker the first few times.

 

[punjabiplaya]

yeah, the ms3 clutch is pretty wonky too. engagement zone is teeny and there's a huge dead zone after like 50% of the pedal's movement range. It's pretty much either on or off, but now that it's got 30k miles on it, it's a lot less jerky.