ATX or mini-ATX?

[wannakatana]

What am I "giving up" with mini-ATX? What can't I do for example or what is the tradeoff?

If I want a system with 1 probably large graphics card, TV tuner, sound card (maybe), will mini-ATX handle that?

Thanks,

Joel

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Depending on what motherboard you get, the only thing you're giving up for sure is the ability to have more than 2 GPUs installed.

You can definitely get a GPU (2-slot) a TV tuner and a sound card in a mini-ATX case, (most are 4-slot) but most TV tuners anymore are USB, and onboard sound is so good an additional sound card is kind of a silly holdover that people buy because they think they need it.

 

[voodoo7817]

Dave is right that performance-wise and major feature-wise you're not giving up much at all by moving to mATX. However, it's worth noting that ATX mobos sometimes/often have better/more features for the same price, such as additional SATA ports, USB headers, dual Gigabit Ethernet, or an M.2 slot in the case of my Extreme6. I've also found that mATX boards can't actually fit into much smaller cases than ATX boards, so unless you've found a creative case solution you're still likely having a midtower case of some kind next to your desk.

Personally, I like regular ATX cases/mobos for my main builds (easier to build and easier to find sales) and true SFF mini-itx for smaller builds. mATX tries to play goldilocks and for some that might be the best fit but it hasn't been the best option for me recently.

 

[wannakatana]

Great, thank you. I guess I will just stick with the ATX.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

I've also found that mATX boards can't actually fit into much smaller cases than ATX boards, so unless you've found a creative case solution you're still likely having a midtower case of some kind next to your desk.

There are a lot of creative case solutions out there. :thumbsup:

 

[Charlie98]

Personally, I don't know why so many people are drawn to ATX boards, costs aside. For a basic single GPU build why not go mATX? Granted, the case size differences are minimal, but they are there and I think mATX cases will only get better as the demand for mATX goes up (same with mITX.)

As far as 'giving up' with mATX, you need to check the specs and make sure you are getting everything you want on the board, but that goes for any board. No reason to 'give up' anything...

 

[Carson Dyle]

First, you need to clarify what you're talking about. Do you mean microATX or mini-ITX? (I believe there may be a motherboard form factor called" mini-ATX", but it's not very common.)

 

[Carson Dyle]

Personally, I don't know why so many people are drawn to ATX boards, costs aside. For a basic single GPU build why not go mATX? Granted, the case size differences are minimal, but they are there and I think mATX cases will only get better as the demand for mATX goes up (same with mITX.)

I'm not so sure that many people are drawn to ATX, except for gamers and those looking for the most in expandibility (slots). But like you say, the difference in case dimensions are minimal, so that's why microATX is only minimally more attractive. Basically, a microATX board is the exact same depth as an ATX board, and 3" less wide. So all things being equal, a microATX case with the same design as an ATX one will be 3" shorter. That's a minimal to non-existent difference in case size when the case is likely to be sitting on the floor beside a desk.

 

[Charlie98]

I'm not so sure that many people are drawn to ATX, except for gamers and those looking for the most in expandibility (slots). But like you say, the difference in case dimensions are minimal, so that's why microATX is only minimally more attractive. Basically, a microATX board is the exact same depth as an ATX board, and 3" less wide. So all things being equal, a microATX case with the same design as an ATX one will be 3" shorter. That's a minimal to non-existent difference in case size when the case is likely to be sitting on the floor beside a desk.

No, I agree... especially when case builders insist on packing 57 HDDs in every case. There is a potential to build a small mATX case that could hold maybe 2 drives, with 1 OD slot. The Node 804 was a great idea... until they designed it to hold 8 HDDs... *sigh*

The Core1000 is a step in the right direction, it's even smaller than the Define Mini.

 

[Puffnstuff]

I only build with atx or extended atx but I can see using matx for a media center build.

 

[you2]

My last few builds have been mini-itx; but one thing I dislike about the mini-itx form factor is lack of led diagnostics which my regular atx boards have. micro-atx is sort of middle of the road - but presonally i let the case pick for myself.

 

[evident]

no reason to not go micro ATX or smaller with a one vid card setup. I've hardly ever needed to use expansion slots in my motherboards as many peripherals are now USB.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I rely less and less on the comfort of extra PCI/-E slots these days. In my flagship sig-rig, I only have a tuner-card and a USB3 Hoo-too card.

If the onboard features all work properly the way you want, you'd at most need the extra slots for something like my tuner card.

I can see picking an mATX board for a "mainstreamer's build" like my old mom's system. We don't need massive RAID arrays on desktops anymore; most mainstreamers may be happy with iGPU video; many more can't see beyond a single PCI-E dGPU, or don't need anything more.

Case and cooling strategies can influence your choice. You can build a pretty good high-end system with a compact footprint. The number and size of intake fans scales down nicely with reduced volume of a case interior. So an mATX board may fit well in that scenario.

I guess that means I would consider a "high-end" mATX board for an otherwise "high-end" build.

 

[Carson Dyle]

I can see picking an mATX board for a "mainstreamer's build" like my old mom's system.

Actually, I'd wager that the overwhelming majority of such systems can easily be built on mini-ITX motherboards. With integrated graphics, onboard audio and networking, it's only when you get into more specialized needs that you may find a need for more slots. Even low to mid-range gaming systems can be based on mini-ITX with the addition of a GPU card.

 

[Charlie98]

Actually, I'd wager that the overwhelming majority of such systems can easily be built on mini-ITX motherboards. With integrated graphics, onboard audio and networking, it's only when you get into more specialized needs that you may find a need for more slots. Even low to mid-range gaming systems can be based on mini-ITX with the addition of a GPU card.

I agree as well... it's just that pesky cost premium for mITX.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

No, I agree... especially when case builders insist on packing 57 HDDs in every case. There is a potential to build a small mATX case that could hold maybe 2 drives, with 1 OD slot. The Node 804 was a great idea... until they designed it to hold 8 HDDs... *sigh*

The Core1000 is a step in the right direction, it's even smaller than the Define Mini.

You can leave out the HD brackets if you need room to mount water cooling hardware.

There are also people who actually do want that many HDDs in a single system, and still want something that looks nice in a quiet room.

/Node804 :wub:

 

[Charlie98]

You can leave out the HD brackets if you need room to mount water cooling hardware.

There are also people who actually do want that many HDDs in a single system, and still want something that looks nice in a quiet room.

/Node804 :wub:

Great... then Fractal needs to make a 804 Mini... for those of us who want a true small cube, mATX case... with no need for multiple HDDs and/or water cooler support. I would say the same for the Node 304/mITX as well.

And, don't get me wrong... the concept of the Node is correct, they just don't need to try to cover all the bases with one case.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Great... then Fractal needs to make a 804 Mini... for those of us who want a true small cube, mATX case... with no need for multiple HDDs and/or water cooler support. I would say the same for the Node 304/mITX as well.

And, don't get me wrong... the concept of the Node is correct, they just don't need to try to cover all the bases with one case.

Can't disagree with that.

Although I'm a little bit... well.. geometry. Like, if you have a flat 10x10" motherboard, and then as little extra stuff as possible, wouldn't you end up with a relatively rectangular case? (Like a minitower or any of a ton of slim uATX designs.)

But you say you want a cube.

Making a cube to fit a uATX board means at least a 12" cube, since you need a little room around the edges. The 13x12x15" 804 isn't all that much bigger than the minimum.

So if you want a uATX cube, which has gotta be at least 12x12x12, what do you want to do with the extra 8x12x12 of empty space? Or do you really just want a slim desktop style case like the InWin I linked? I guess I'm having trouble visualizing. Unless you mean you just would be happy with the 12x12x12 and some internal expansion, but the 13x12x15 is oversized?

The HD-less version of the 304 is called the Silverstone SG05.

 

[Charlie98]

Can't disagree with that.

Although I'm a little bit... well.. geometry. Like, if you have a flat 10x10" motherboard, and then as little extra stuff as possible, wouldn't you end up with a relatively rectangular case? (Like a minitower or any of a ton of slim uATX designs.)

But you say you want a cube.

Making a cube to fit a uATX board means at least a 12" cube, since you need a little room around the edges. The 13x12x15" 804 isn't all that much bigger than the minimum.

So if you want a uATX cube, which has gotta be at least 12x12x12, what do you want to do with the extra 8x12x12 of empty space? Or do you really just want a slim desktop style case like the InWin I linked? I guess I'm having trouble visualizing. Unless you mean you just would be happy with the 12x12x12 and some internal expansion, but the 13x12x15 is oversized?

The HD-less version of the 304 is called the Silverstone SG05.

That SG05 is very close to what I have invisioned, I'll have to take a second look at that (the other one I've found, oddly enough, is the Rosewill Legacy series...) I guess my Utopia case is the SG05 with the build quality and features of the Define series (like sound damping and a non-Swiss cheese-like case) with the slicked-down look of the Node.

...and, please excuse me... I've derailed the OP's thread enough.

 

[Carson Dyle]

Great... then Fractal needs to make a 804 Mini... for those of us who want a true small cube, mATX case... with no need for multiple HDDs and/or water cooler support. I would say the same for the Node 304/mITX as well.

And, don't get me wrong... the concept of the Node is correct, they just don't need to try to cover all the bases with one case.

The Node cases are intended either for small file servers, all-in-one HTPCs (where there is no network file server or NAS) or as desktops for users who need a lot of local file storage (again, when there is no network storage). There are many people who have no need for centralized network file storage, so they want four, six or more hard drives in their desktop computers.

Likewise, Fractal Design's microATX towers don't try at all to minimize size. Not when they support things like 120mm fans, very long GPUs and water cooling. Fractal Design obviously isn't trying to build small cases. If you want a minimally sized microATX case, you're going to have to look to someone else.

I still think one of the smaller microATX towers made may have been the old Antec NSK3480, which is no longer in production. It had just 3 drive bays, but was missing some of the amenities of newer cases, like great cable routing and water cooling support.

To get much smaller than this you need to do things like place the PSU over top of, or in front of the space occupied by the motherboard, which limits the use of some slots. You could make it a little narrower, but you lose the 120mm rear exhaust fan and the ability to use full-height CPU tower heatsinks.

 

[Charlie98]

The Node cases are intended either for small file servers, all-in-one HTPCs (where there is no network file server or NAS) or as desktops for users who need a lot of local file storage (again, when there is no network storage). There are many people who have no need for centralized network file storage, so they want four, six or more hard drives in their desktop computers.

Likewise, Fractal Design's microATX towers don't try at all to minimize size. Not when they support things like 120mm fans, very long GPUs and water cooling. Fractal Design obviously isn't trying to build small cases. If you want a minimally sized microATX case, you're going to have to look to someone else.

I still think one of the smaller microATX towers made may have been the old Antec NSK3480, which is no longer in production. It had just 3 drive bays, but was missing some of the amenities of newer cases, like great cable routing and water cooling support.

No, again, I agree... the Node is trying to cover a few more bases than my limited needs. Just wishing...

That Antec is almost exactly what I was thinking about... :awe:

 

[dave_the_nerd]

That SG05 is very close to what I have invisioned, I'll have to take a second look at that (the other one I've found, oddly enough, is the Rosewill Legacy series...) I guess my Utopia case is the SG05 with the build quality and features of the Define series (like sound damping and a non-Swiss cheese-like case) with the slicked-down look of the Node.

...and, please excuse me... I've derailed the OP's thread enough.

*cough*

https://www.ncases.com/

 

[Charlie98]

*cough*

https://www.ncases.com/

...it's still a little bit Swiss-cheezy... but... :awe::awe::awe::awe:

 

[Carson Dyle]

And it's mini-ITX, not microATX.

 

[you2]

If you go with mini-itx then elite 130 and corsair 250 are worth a peak; if micro-atx then I guess the sg05. A bit depends on if you want/need a full size 5 1/4; the first two have support for such but the sg05 does not.