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Attorney General Nominee Sends Letter to Dems

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Attorney general nominee Michael B. Mukasey told Senate Democrats today that a kind of simulated drowning known as waterboarding is "repugnant," but he does not know whether the interrogation technique violates U.S. laws against torture.
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If he's not sure then he should volunteer to try it, don't you think?
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That reminds me of the Fox News "journalist" who was going to get waterboarded to show that it wasn't really that bad, and he folded about 2 seconds into it.

Edit: As for the nominee's comments, I think they should instantly disqualify him from the job. Not because he supports what I'd consider to be torture, but because he supports the US engaging in activities he'd consider to be repugnant. We've had a long history of attorneys general who seem to have no moral compass to speak of, I'm not sure we need another one.
 
I was on board with Mukasey at first, but the more we get into these hearings... yeah, I think Bush needs to roll the dice and try again.

hopefully congress will find the stones to stand up to Bush.

with Hillary riding so high in the polls and beating the republican nominees, it's really a wonder that even the republicans would be so willing to cede even more power to the executive.
 
Originally posted by: Pabster
Originally posted by: loki8481
with Hillary riding so high in the polls and beating the republican nominees, it's really a wonder that even the republicans would be so willing to cede even more power to the executive.
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Is A Statistical Tie Your Idea Of "Riding So High In The Polls"? :laugh:
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sorry, I didn't word that correctly...

"with Hillary riding so high in the polls for the primaries and potentially beating the republican nominee..."

fixed.

but are you really ready for Madam President Clinton to have the same executive powers that congress rolled over and let Bush take?
 
Originally posted by: blackangst1
From a volunteer: ooowwwwiiieeeee that hurts!

OK. It's torture.:roll:
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Is that even an argument? What the hell are you trying to say? Learn to communicate, man.
 
Senators Say Mukasey's Words on Torture Raise Doubts

Two Republican senators said Attorney General nominee Michael B. Mukasey's refusal to define so-called waterboarding as torture raised doubts about whether he should become the nation's top law enforcement official.

Senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham criticized Mukasey for not ruling out use of waterboarding, which simulates drowning, by U.S. operatives during interrogations.

"Anyone who says they don't know if waterboarding is torture or not has no experience in the conduct of warfare and national security,'' McCain, a former prisoner of war in Vietnam
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Senator Christopher Dodd, a candidate for the Democratic presidential nomination, announced today he would vote against Mukasey's confirmation.

Dodd, of Connecticut, said that he opposes Mukasey because of the nominee's testimony that the president of the United States is not necessarily bound by federal law. ``That would have to depend,'' Mukasey said in response to a question.

Mukasey's answer ``disqualifies him from being the chief attorney for the United States,'' Dodd said in a written statement. Dodd said Mukasey, if confirmed, would run the Justice Department as a ``political wing of the White House.''
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Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Senators Say Mukasey's Words on Torture Raise Doubts

Two Republican senators said Attorney General nominee Michael B. Mukasey's refusal to define so-called waterboarding as torture raised doubts about whether he should become the nation's top law enforcement official.

Senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham criticized Mukasey for not ruling out use of waterboarding, which simulates drowning, by U.S. operatives during interrogations.

"Anyone who says they don't know if waterboarding is torture or not has no experience in the conduct of warfare and national security,'' McCain, a former prisoner of war in Vietnam
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The first hurdle Mukasey faces is getting a majority vote from the Senate Judiciary committee.
Graham is a member and McCain is not. And Biden, another member has likewise come out
against. Schumer, as far as I know is still a huge Mukasey fan, but this failure to label water boarding torture may doom what looked like certain confirmation a week ago.

I now hope that Mukasey does not make it out of committee and the message is sent to GWB&co. to find someone who understands torture is not acceptable and will be clearly outlawed in the USA.
 


Torture: Day of Reckoning At Hand?
Can there be any doubt, as I wrote not long ago, that there is no darker stain on the Bush presidency ? and on America at the start of the new millennium ? than the top-down approval of the use of torture and this secrecy-obsessed administration?s systematic efforts to justify its use on the one hand while denying that it approved its use on the other?

Actually, yes.

With too few exceptions, the silence inside the Beltway during years of torture revelations from Abu Ghraib to the Rumsfeld Gulag to Afghanistan has been one giant silent scream and has compounded the shame that I have felt over a country that I bleed red, white and blue for.

So what has now changed?

* The drumbeat in the American town square against torture has grown louder.

What looked like a slam-dunk nomination has instead become a long overdue moment of moral clarity as a small but growing number of senators say they are troubled by Michael Mukasey?s equivocating over a technique condemned by U.S. military leaders, human rights organizations and prominent Republicans including Senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham.

Mukasey?s waffling before the Senate Judiciary Committee came in response to a question from Dick Durbin, who then sent the nominee a follow-up letter with the signatures of all his fellow committee Democrats. Republican Arlen Specter then asked Mukasey to clarify his position, as did presidential candidate McCain and Graham, himself an Army lawyer.

Now four other presidential wannabes ? Senators Clinton, Obama, Biden and Dodd ? say they will vote against Mukasey if he doesn?t denounce waterboarding, and no amount of Rovian parsing on the part of the White House is going to bail out the nominee.

Congressional Democrats already have blocked confirmation of two other nominees to lesser posts ? John Rizzo, who had endorsed torture, as general counsel of the CIA, and Steven Bradbury, author of the secret legal opinions on interrogation, as head of Justice?s Office of Legal Counsel.
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Originally posted by: Rainsford
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Attorney general nominee Michael B. Mukasey told Senate Democrats today that a kind of simulated drowning known as waterboarding is "repugnant," but he does not know whether the interrogation technique violates U.S. laws against torture.
Click to expand...

If he's not sure then he should volunteer to try it, don't you think?
Click to expand...

That reminds me of the Fox News "journalist" who was going to get waterboarded to show that it wasn't really that bad, and he folded about 2 seconds into it.
Click to expand...

Regardless of what you think about torture, that was some of the greatest sensationalist journalism I've ever seen. Seriously funny stuff.

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit


Torture: Day of Reckoning At Hand?
Can there be any doubt, as I wrote not long ago, that there is no darker stain on the Bush presidency ? and on America at the start of the new millennium ? than the top-down approval of the use of torture and this secrecy-obsessed administration?s systematic efforts to justify its use on the one hand while denying that it approved its use on the other?

Actually, yes.

With too few exceptions, the silence inside the Beltway during years of torture revelations from Abu Ghraib to the Rumsfeld Gulag to Afghanistan has been one giant silent scream and has compounded the shame that I have felt over a country that I bleed red, white and blue for.

So what has now changed?

* The drumbeat in the American town square against torture has grown louder.

What looked like a slam-dunk nomination has instead become a long overdue moment of moral clarity as a small but growing number of senators say they are troubled by Michael Mukasey?s equivocating over a technique condemned by U.S. military leaders, human rights organizations and prominent Republicans including Senators John McCain and Lindsey Graham.

Mukasey?s waffling before the Senate Judiciary Committee came in response to a question from Dick Durbin, who then sent the nominee a follow-up letter with the signatures of all his fellow committee Democrats. Republican Arlen Specter then asked Mukasey to clarify his position, as did presidential candidate McCain and Graham, himself an Army lawyer.

Now four other presidential wannabes ? Senators Clinton, Obama, Biden and Dodd ? say they will vote against Mukasey if he doesn?t denounce waterboarding, and no amount of Rovian parsing on the part of the White House is going to bail out the nominee.

Congressional Democrats already have blocked confirmation of two other nominees to lesser posts ? John Rizzo, who had endorsed torture, as general counsel of the CIA, and Steven Bradbury, author of the secret legal opinions on interrogation, as head of Justice?s Office of Legal Counsel.
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I'm glad to hear this. Our moral high ground is what separates us from the people that condone torture for their own reasons (whatever those reasons are). Besides, I thought it was close to consensus among military and interrogation experts that torture techniques like water-boarding aren't any more effective at getting to the truth than other more creative techniques?
 
So wait, this guy wants to be the top lawyer in the country, and he can't look up if waterboarding is or is not torture?
 
Originally posted by: senseamp
So wait, this guy wants to be the top lawyer in the country, and he can't look up if waterboarding is or is not torture?
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Maybe Congress should clearly define it as such. Until then, it is not torture.
 
Torture is already defined in the Geneva convention that we are signatories to. If GWB or Cheney ever wind up in the Hague, the court won't waste even a few seconds entertaining
GWB&co's phony definitions of torture.
 
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: senseamp
So wait, this guy wants to be the top lawyer in the country, and he can't look up if waterboarding is or is not torture?
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Maybe Congress should clearly define it as such. Until then, it is not torture.
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Regardless of Congress, though, how can an aspiring AG seemingly not have an opinion on whether waterboarding is torture? Seems a little odd doesn't it?
 
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: senseamp
So wait, this guy wants to be the top lawyer in the country, and he can't look up if waterboarding is or is not torture?
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Maybe Congress should clearly define it as such. Until then, it is not torture.
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See, you are smarter than the attorney general nominee. At least you have an opinion and a supporting argument on the subject. This guy is supposed to be this country's top lawyer, and he can't do what it took you two sentences to do.
 
Originally posted by: Lemon law
Torture is already defined in the Geneva convention that we are signatories to. If GWB or Cheney ever wind up in the Hague, the court won't waste even a few seconds entertaining
GWB&co's phony definitions of torture.
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I laugh every time I see this trotted out. Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen.
 
Where were all you outraged Democrats when Bill Clinton was rounding up terrorists and turning them over to Egypt?

All of this stuff you complain about started under Clinton, with the possible exception of waterboarding.

As for Waterboarding = torture it seems that subject is still an open debate depending on who you ask. (It is interesting on how you all defer to McCain on this subject, but nothing else.)


Sadly it seems that Waterboarding is the only tactic that works on a lot of these people. So the choice is to continue to use it on high profile high value targets or just cross our fingers and hope that none of these guys has any useful information that might save the lives of some innocent people.

Ask the family of someone who died on 9-11 if they approve waterboarding if it might prevent another major terrorist attack.
 
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Where were all you outraged Democrats when Bill Clinton was rounding up terrorists and turning them over to Egypt?
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I for one was in high school, and all I knew about the world was pretty much centered around the spice girls and backstreet boys :heart:

Ask the family of someone who died on 9-11 if they approve waterboarding if it might prevent another major terrorist attack.
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I'd imagine their response would be the complete opposite of the family of someone who knew nothing and was subjugated to water boarding nonetheless.

the fact remains, gathering information through the use of torture is suspect at best... you only get to the point where anyone will say anything just to get it to stop.
 
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