Attitude and Change in the Garage as of late

[speedy2]

Wow. This is a lot of talk over something very simple. You do something that you're not supposed to do. You go bye-bye. How hard is that? We're not preschool kids here.

 

[Gillbot]

But it isn't a handful. Go ahead and make a poll, in any social forum you want, on whether somebody should be banned. You're going to see 90%+ in favor of the two bans, without a doubt. It isn't a few people who want it, it's pretty much everyone. We can all tell they're trolls, and trolling is listed in the Forum Guidelines as verboten.

Then if you know they are trolls, why can't they be ignored? Don't fed the troll and they'll go away right?

Wow. This is a lot of talk over something very simple. You do something that you're not supposed to do. You go bye-bye. How hard is that? We're not preschool kids here.

You'd think, but by the way everyone whines and complains I'm not so sure sometimes.

 

[MotF Bane]

Then if you know they are trolls, why can't they be ignored? Don't fed the troll and they'll go away right?

Only works if people actually do that.

If it is widely known they are trolls, then why don't they just get banned as per the rules?

 

[jlee]

Then if you know they are trolls, why can't they be ignored? Don't fed the troll and they'll go away right?

Sometimes they keep returning to threads they need to stay out of. Sure, you can ignore them, but they don't go away. Not lately, anyway.

 

[Gillbot]

Only works if people actually do that.

If it is widely known they are trolls, then why don't they just get banned as per the rules?

The problem is usually, what one considers a troll, another may not. We have a fine line we need to walk, as do the trolls. As stated before, if they are a good troll, they know the limits and stay just within them. If they stay within the "posted guidelines" then it's nearly impossible for us to ban them, because they aren't technically doing anything wrong. They post, everyone else jumps in to attack them and the troll sits back and smiles.

Now, if everyone was smart and they ignored the trolls like we would prefer, the troll would likely become more and more bold. Sooner or later they would make the mistake of posting outside the guidelines and then it makes it easier for us to remove them.

Sometimes they keep returning to threads they need to stay out of.

Ignore them.....

There are plenty of replies in this thread that I didn't specifically respond to. Others can just as easily do the same. Then, as I stated above, the troll would mess up and we'd get em. BUT, when everyone goes on the offensive, they end up getting in trouble for attacking while the troll sits back and smiles because you foolishly took the bait.

 

[jlee]

Ignore them.....

There are plenty of replies in this thread that I didn't specifically respond to. Others can just as easily do the same. Then, as I stated above, the troll would mess up and we'd get em. BUT, when everyone goes on the offensive, they end up getting in trouble for attacking while the troll sits back and smiles because you foolishly took the bait.

I think everyone eventually goes on the offensive because nothing has been happening. A mod recently put the hammer down in OT for a Garage-related thinly veiled troll thread, so hopefully we're in a new era.

 

[Sulaco]

The problem is usually, what one considers a troll, another may not. We have a fine line we need to walk, as do the trolls. As stated before, if they are a good troll, they know the limits and stay just within them. If they stay within the "posted guidelines" then it's nearly impossible for us to ban them, because they aren't technically doing anything wrong. They post, everyone else jumps in to attack them and the troll sits back and smiles.

Now, if everyone was smart and they ignored the trolls like we would prefer, the troll would likely become more and more bold. Sooner or later they would make the mistake of posting outside the guidelines and then it makes it easier for us to remove them.



Ignore them.....

There are plenty of replies in this thread that I didn't specifically respond to. Others can just as easily do the same. Then, as I stated above, the troll would mess up and we'd get em. BUT, when everyone goes on the offensive, they end up getting in trouble for attacking while the troll sits back and smiles because you foolishly took the bait.

That can be easier said than done when the troll is posting oh...let's say...nearly 15 times a day, on average.
When their posts pervade the forums, in most open, highly trafficked threads, that becomes no easy feat. Especially when abrasive language, insults, etc are flung your way for having a differing opinion or view.

And of course, it begs the question, should we all really have to?

 

[HarryLui]

That can be easier said than done when the troll is posting oh...let's say...nearly 15 times a day, on average.
When their posts pervade the forums, in most open, highly trafficked threads, that becomes no easy feat. Especially when abrasive language, insults, etc are flung your way for having a differing opinion or view.

And of course, it begs the question, should we all really have to?

That user has nothing I want to read from, I added him to my ignore list.

Add the users to ignore list.
Using Gillbot as example...

 

[Gillbot]

I think everyone eventually goes on the offensive because nothing has been happening. A mod recently put the hammer down in OT for a Garage-related thinly veiled troll thread, so hopefully we're in a new era.

Trust me, we are trying.

That can be easier said than done when the troll is posting oh...let's say...nearly 15 times a day, on average.
When their posts pervade the forums, in most open, highly trafficked threads, that becomes no easy feat. Especially when abrasive language, insults, etc are flung your way for having a differing opinion or view.

And of course, it begs the question, should we all really have to?

Should you have to? No... Will it make it easier for everyone in the LONG term? Yes. I'm not going to go over it again and again. Everyone knows where we stand, they know the deal. If you don't help us help you, it will only take longer. Simple.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Then if you know they are trolls, why can't they be ignored? Don't fed the troll and they'll go away right?


You'd think, but by the way everyone whines and complains I'm not so sure sometimes.

Gill as we've explained already, in the garage they derail threads too much to ignore them. In OT there is typically enough traffic within a single thread to where ignoring a user is effective. In the garage threads tend to follow one topic, so if that one topic is derailed and you've ignored the user doing the derailing then he's essentially "ruining" the thread for the decent members that are trying to help or discuss a topic.

In other words, by ignoring them in these circumstances it's hindering the good users and supporting the troll users. You can tell from the way many of our regulars (jlee, dunlop, datt to an extent, certainly myself) have basically backed out of these threads. They've backed out of ATG lately to try and circumvent any action getting taken against them, but as recently as a week ago literally 90%+ of threads in ATG were derailed or trolled to the point where there was no point in even coming here.



...and I'm not sure how to take your whine and complain comment, as I think it's evident that these are justified issues. Some of us care about how things are handled in ATG and obviously there are issues with a few users, perhaps indicating by the 'whining and complaining'. It's a bigger problem than something you can just "go bye-bye" over and you turning around to point at the people trying to fix it is interesting to me. That being said, I'm glad to hear you all are working on a solution.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Trust me, we are trying.


Should you have to? No... Will it make it easier for everyone in the LONG term? Yes. I'm not going to go over it again and again. Everyone knows where we stand, they know the deal. If you don't help us help you, it will only take longer. Simple.

Tell us how to help you help us, please. We've been reporting posts and done all that you've asked so far.

 

[Gillbot]

Tell us how to help you help us, please. We've been reporting posts and done all that you've asked so far.

Except for ignoring them. They can't derail a thread if nobody even acknowledges their posts.

 

[SparkyJJO]

Except for ignoring them. They can't derail a thread if nobody even acknowledges their posts.

Some people do have a hard time not feeding the trolls. I know I've fallen to that on occasion because I get so annoyed at them. Yes, that's my fault.

However, I guess I don't understand why a troll can't be banned at least from the subforum they cause trouble in. It seems like it would make more sense to kick out the guy who is knocking over everyone's beer at the bar instead of telling every one else to ignore him. Honestly it just doesn't work to simply ignore him because there will always be someone who will react to his beer getting splashed in his face. Far simpler and more efficient to boot the troublemaker, IMO.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Howard]

Anybody see any changes recently?

 

[Sulaco]

Anybody see any changes recently?

I thought I did, but it looks like it's going back to normal. Fingers crossed though...

 

[MotF Bane]

Anybody see any changes recently?

Yes and no. Direct changes by the mods? No. Has the heavy trolling stopped? Yes. So my best guess is something was done behind the scenes, i.e. PM's from the mods to the trolls.

I'm content with this.

 

[amish]

I thought I did, but it looks like it's going back to normal.

yup, looks like it is slowly devolving back to what it was earlier...

some people have stopped posting in response to certain agitators, but other are getting right back at it.

i'm looking for a new garage forum to be honest. unfortunately the garage forum at toms hardware is a joke. i really liked the build threads, the insight we had from people that actually work on cars, and the discussion of new cars. i'm just tired of things coming down to "what do you drive?".

 

[Ferzerp]

yup, looks like it is slowly devolving back to what it was earlier...

some people have stopped posting in response to certain agitators, but other are getting right back at it.

i'm looking for a new garage forum to be honest. unfortunately the garage forum at toms hardware is a joke. i really liked the build threads, the insight we had from people that actually work on cars, and the discussion of new cars. i'm just tired of things coming down to "what do you drive?".

What Amish said.

 

[Howard]

yup, looks like it is slowly devolving back to what it was earlier...

some people have stopped posting in response to certain agitators, but other are getting right back at it.

i'm looking for a new garage forum to be honest. unfortunately the garage forum at toms hardware is a joke. i really liked the build threads, the insight we had from people that actually work on cars, and the discussion of new cars. i'm just tired of things coming down to "what do you drive?".

You're obviously in a position where you aren't able to appreciate certain things because you can only afford a base model econocar.

 

[alkemyst]

Well asking what one drives is useful when you are getting crap and simply 'magazine specs'

 

[amish]

Well asking what one drives is useful when you are getting crap and simply 'magazine specs'

do you garage your vehicle every night?

 

[FuzzyDunlop]

holy cow its even happening in this thread.

Im almost at the same point as Amish. I like the regulars here and the discussion/help that can be had, but lately most of the regulars have been avoiding ATG and things are slowly reverting back to crap.
The only reason Im still here is because this is where I began my "Garaging". In the meantime Im still searching for a new home. I really wish I didnt feel the need to.

It is like having a noisy, partying, neighbor that lets their dog bark at all hours of the night while the police are just watching, piecing together evidence for an arrest. Its frustrating and nothing can be done because you cant ignore it, and telling them to shut up only instigates further noise. If only the police were allowed to beat people relentlessly, THEN maybe we'd have some peace.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

holy cow its even happening in this thread.

Im almost at the same point as Amish. I like the regulars here and the discussion/help that can be had, but lately most of the regulars have been avoiding ATG and things are slowly reverting back to crap.
The only reason Im still here is because this is where I began my "Garaging". In the meantime Im still searching for a new home. I really wish I didnt feel the need to.

It is like having a noisy, partying, neighbor that lets their dog bark at all hours of the night while the police are just watching, piecing together evidence for an arrest. Its frustrating and nothing can be done because you cant ignore it, and telling them to shut up only instigates further noise. If only the police were allowed to beat people relentlessly, THEN maybe we'd have some peace.

Fantastic and accurate analogy.


I agree with the others, something was very clearly said to the 1 or 2 trolls who backed off for about a month.. They are now back, and things are going downhill very quickly.

 

[jlee]

Well asking what one drives is useful when you are getting crap and simply 'magazine specs' preparing to insult the financial situation of (insert AT member).

If you don't care about 'magazine specs', you should've taken me up on an offer of a race. But you don't care about that either - so if you don't care about specs or real numbers, clearly your only intent is to troll around and stir people up. It's getting tiresome.

 

[Sulaco]

holy cow its even happening in this thread.

Im almost at the same point as Amish. I like the regulars here and the discussion/help that can be had, but lately most of the regulars have been avoiding ATG and things are slowly reverting back to crap.
The only reason Im still here is because this is where I began my "Garaging". In the meantime Im still searching for a new home. I really wish I didnt feel the need to.

It is like having a noisy, partying, neighbor that lets their dog bark at all hours of the night while the police are just watching, piecing together evidence for an arrest. Its frustrating and nothing can be done because you cant ignore it, and telling them to shut up only instigates further noise. If only the police were allowed to beat people relentlessly, THEN maybe we'd have some peace.

More accurately, for making that analogy, or asking for their help in the first place, they come and arrest you.

I feel the same way. I like the AAT garage because it's diverse. The forums I visit for my cars are far larger, but since almost everyone frequenting it owns and drives the same car(s), it can be rather one-sided. This is an interesting mix of different car owners.

That said, I avoid the "OT and Politics" forums for exactly the reason I'm starting to get burnt out on the garage; the drama, trolling, and antics. Yeah, it's basically only one person, but they're allowed to get away with pretty much everything (seemingly), and that can ruin everyone's experience.