ATI Preps New Dual-Chip Flagship Graphics Card - Rumours.

[Skurge]

So you're saying Nvidia won't come out with a new card because ATI is going to come out with a faster one in the future? I don't think the market works that way...

The key part there was 2 months.

 

[Skurge]

Yeah until they get out a new architecture they are going to struggle to keep up with NVIDIA.

You live in your own world don't you?

 

[Wag]

The key part there was 2 months.

Even then I doubt it matters much to Nvidia because they don't base their release schedule around their competitor's and they have no idea whether a competitor's final product will be faster or not (and doubt they care). It's quite possible a dual-GF104 based card will be faster than a dual-GPU Southern Islands just because SLI scales much better than Crossfire. If you ran your business around what your competitors did or didn't do you'd never release anything.

 

[GaiaHunter]

The article states..........

As reported previously, ATI Radeon HD 6000-series graphics boards will become available in late October or early November, 2010

I'd be willing to bet thats gonna be a mid range card.
It does not say high end , it does not say dual chip.

Previous news on this subject has been mid range first, high end should be by the end of the year.

When was the last time ATI and especially AMD/ATI released a new generation of cards by releasing the mid part first by several months?

 

[Skurge]

Even then I doubt it matters much to Nvidia because they don't base their release schedule around their competitor's and they have no idea whether a competitor's final product will be faster or not (and doubt they care). It's quite possible a dual-GF104 based card will be faster than a dual-GPU Southern Islands just because SLI scales much better than Crossfire. If you ran your business around what your competitors did or didn't do you'd never release anything.

Crossfire scaling with 4xxx was better than it is with 5xxx (Look at 4870X2), who is to say SI crossfire won't scale batter than the current implementation?

Nvidia would have their time better spent on optimizing GF100 to go against SI.

 

[Skurge]

When was the last time ATI and especially AMD/ATI released a new generation of cards by releasing the mid part first by several months?

I don't remember a single time.

9700, X800, X1800, 2900, 4870, 5870. They all went high end first.

 

[ronnn]

When was the last time ATI and especially AMD/ATI released a new generation of cards by releasing the mid part first by several months?

Wasn't the 4770 on a new process?

 

[Skurge]

Wasn't the 4770 on a new process?

Yeah, but it wasn't a new generation.

 

[golem]

Yeah, but it wasn't a new generation.

but isn't SI a half generation with NI being the full generation?

 

[GaiaHunter]

Wasn't the 4770 on a new process?

That was a different thing.

New process - start with smaller card of the old generation.

New gen - start with high end card.

In this case it is the same process.

 

[tweakboy]

I think the best nvidia will do is come out with the 490 GTX by december. thats all were getting and retarded lower models fine but this gen is 490GTX , then next year they will slowly prep up the 5xx series and the dual gpu 5xx card, that crushes anything in its existense. I hope so...

 

[sxr7171]

Crossfire scaling with 4xxx was better than it is with 5xxx (Look at 4870X2), who is to say SI crossfire won't scale batter than the current implementation?

Nvidia would have their time better spent on optimizing GF100 to go against SI.

Given what you said who's to say it won't be worse? 2 regressions in a row are not impossible. Sad to even think that would regress like that.

 

[Skurge]

Given what you said who's to say it won't be worse? 2 regressions in a row are not impossible. Sad to even think that would regress like that.

True, I am known to be a bit bias, but their whole philosophy with the high end is 2 smaller chips working together, I'm sure they would try to improve the scaling this time round.

 

[SHAQ]

I thought the part about supporting ultra high definition decode was interesting.

Then I read about the timeline involved.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/monito..._Due_in_2017_2022_Timeframe_Say_Analysts.html

"As originally proposed, UHD comes in two levels of resolution: 7680x4320 pixels (33.1MP), and 3840x2160 (8.2MP), which is considerably higher than full-HD resolution (1920x1080 or 2MP) today. In addition, UHD may improve audio dramatically and enable 22.2 multi-channel three-dimensional sound."

What was the limit of eyesight again? I thought it was 5000 pixels? 22.2 channel sound. Yeah right. A room full of speakers sounds nice but...

 

[happy medium]

When was the last time ATI and especially AMD/ATI released a new generation of cards by releasing the mid part first by several months?

They say they have confirmation......

Quote:
Our further investigation also led us to find two codenames Turks and Caicos as these two cards should replace Radeon HD 5670 and Radeon 5550 and 5400.
Cayman (Southern Islands should be a group codename for Radeon 6000 series) should be the codename for the product that replaces Radeon HD 5800 series, but as far as we know this chip might actually not make it to market this year"

http://www.fudzilla.com/graphics/graphics/atis-next-generation-to-come-in-october

I think mid range first (Oct./Nov.), high end at the end of the year.

 

[PingviN]

Yeah until they get out a new architecture they are going to struggle to keep up with NVIDIA.

Yeah, because Fermi has been such an immense success so far. AMD is reeeeeally breathing heavy trying their best not to get smashed by the oh-so-awesome Fermi GPUs showing up everywhere, from low-end to high-end.

Oh wait. I just remembered, Fermi STILL isn't available at anything below ~$180 and AMD are selling MORE GPUs than Nvidia. Yepp, they're fighting for their lives, I sure hope they get that new architecture out very soon or they might end up getting eaten by the green giant.

To be honest: Nvidia are in trouble here, not the other way round. AMD has it's ENTIRE HD5*** series out and S. I. scheduled before the end of the year. What does Nvidia have? It has nothing (interesting) below $180, it has (fairly certainly) higher production costs, has missed out on a big bunch of OEM deals and just can't seem to sell their cards without massive price cuts.

 

[Tempered81]

Yeah until they get out a new architecture they are going to struggle to keep up with NVIDIA.

Ati's Radeon HD5970 trumps Nvidia's fastest production video card. Ati owns the performance crown, and has had it for a year now. Good luck with your trolling arguments elsewhere.

 

[Wreckage]

They say they have confirmation......

Quote:
Our further investigation also led us to find two codenames Turks and Caicos as these two cards should replace Radeon HD 5670 and Radeon 5550 and 5400.
Cayman (Southern Islands should be a group codename for Radeon 6000 series) should be the codename for the product that replaces Radeon HD 5800 series, but as far as we know this chip might actually not make it to market this year"

http://www.fudzilla.com/graphics/graphics/atis-next-generation-to-come-in-october

I think mid range first (Oct./Nov.), high end at the end of the year.

If the 6xxx series won't have a high end part until next year (as the article suggests) That could really hurt AMD for the holiday sales season. NVIDIA will more than likely have it's full range of 4xx series out by then, not to mention a high end or even dual chip GF104.

I guess we can start talking about AMD delays now and what's causing problems with their designs. I think we might see them in a worse position than Fermi had if they are trying to move to 28nm.

 

[Skurge]

If the 6xxx series won't have a high end part until next year (as the article suggests) That could really hurt AMD for the holiday sales season. NVIDIA will more than likely have it's full range of 4xx series out by then, not to mention a high end or even dual chip GF104.

I guess we can start talking about AMD delays now and what's causing problems with their designs. I think we might see them in a worse position than Fermi had if they are trying to move to 28nm.

Apart from all the nonsense you are writing there. You do realize the article I linked to was published yesterday and the one your referring to is from last month.

 

[nyker96]

with GTX 460 taking away sales they have to make a move soon.

 

[AtenRa]

With double the Shaders (100%) (800 vs 1600) (HD5770 vs HD5870) we have 74% more Power Consumption (108W vs 188W)

If you take an HD5850 (1440 shaders) and OC to 5870 clocks (850MHz) then the performance deference between a 5850 (850MHz) and a 5870 (850MHz) is only 3-4% with 11% more Shaders.

If ATI keeps the same Architecture with Evergreen and add 20% more Shaders (1920) then the Power Consumption will go 15% up to 188+15% = 216W and performance will go up 6-8%.

Die Size will be in the area of ~400mm2

If they want to make a dual chip Card they better keep the TDP bellow 200W

So I believe SI will not be more than 10% faster than 5870 at best, actually I don’t think ATI really tried to make it faster in the first place, they wait for 28nm.

 

[RussianSensation]

Die Size will be in the area of ~400mm2

So I believe SI will not be more than 10% faster than 5870 at best, actually I don’t think ATI really tried to make it faster in the first place, they wait for 28nm.

Your argument makes no sense at all. If ATI is going to increase die size 18-19%, you think performance will go up only 10%? You didn't account for the increased efficiency of shaders? or other aspects of the GPU? You are assuming that all things will remain equal and they will simply add extra shaders of the same complexity?

We have already seen NV shrink the size of Fermi into GTX460 while producing superior texture fill-rate to GTX470. Therefore, trying to predict performance based on die size alone is not sufficient unless you know the architectural internals of the GPU.

 

[AtenRa]

If ATI keeps the same Architecture with Evergreen and add 20% more Shaders

Your argument makes no sense at all

I believe it makes a lot of sense

 

[bryanW1995]

ATI has announced several times in 2010 that they plan to keep the performance crown for most of 2010. This means it has been known for a while that a high end SI varient was going to be released. I think you meant we didnt know if a dual-chip high end would appear until 2011. In that case I agree.

I hope SI is 20% or more faster than 5870 though. The faster the performance increase over current gen, the better it is both for prices of current tech and for upgrade prospects down the line ^_^

well, if they go from 1x4 to 2x2 and go to 400mm2 as rumored then I think you'll see a similar jump to 4870-5870. I think we might see just as much performance bump now as when we make the 28nm transition, but the 28nm transition will make the companies more money b/c of the process improvements.

 

[PingviN]

with GTX 460 taking away sales they have to make a move soon.

Not for as long as they don't lose sales. AMD currently sells what's being produced with no stocks being built, that means that they can't really lose customers as there are not enough GPUs to go around.