Athlon XP 2800+ worth upgrading to 3200+

[Patt]

I am not in the market for a wholesale upgrade at the moment, and have an Athlon 2800+ in my rig right now. The question I have for you CPU gurus is: Is it worth it for me to upgrade to the best CPU my motherboard can handle, an Athlon 3200+ (Barton)? How can I compare the performance of the two, or where can I go to find such a comparison?

I've recently purchased a new video card (X850 Pro) and want to squeeze the best out of my system as I can. Incidentally, I also have PC3200 RAM (1 GB). Thanks.

 

[Doctorweir]

Is O/Cing the old CPU to 3200 levels an option?
<= has no idea about overclockability of this AMD series:roll:

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: Doctorweir
Is O/Cing the old CPU to 3200 levels an option?
<= has no idea about overclockability of this AMD series:roll:

It may be possible, I haven't really gotten into the O/C scene though. What I guess I'm really wondering is that since I already have the PC3200 RAM that could take advantage of the 400FSB of the CPU, is this a worthy upgrade?

 

[Doctorweir]

To overclock, you gonna raise the FSB anyway...there the memory comes in handy...
The 2800+ is FSB333?

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: Doctorweir
The 2800+ is FSB333?

Yeah, unfortunately it is. When I bought the gear I was under the impression that it wasn't. :thumbsdown: for my research before buying. It was nearly 2 years ago though, and I'm getting more into tweaking the system now.

 

[imported_Reck]

the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

 

[SynthDude2001]

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

I can't remember what frequency the XP 2800+ ran at (compared to the 3200+'s 2.2GHz), but I'd be very surprised if the difference was that much. Unless you could get the 3200+ for a really cheap price, I wouldn't really recommend throwing the money at that.

Edit: Take a look here. I can't tell exactly where the XP 2800+ would fall since it's not specifically listed on that page, but you'd probably get a noticeable little jump (actually a little more than I was expecting) - at least based on that one game. I still don't really think it would be worth the money though, especially with the prices I've seen for XP 3200+'s lately - unless of course you could get a really cheap used one.

 

[Spike]

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

You might as well try overclocking that cpu since your ram can handle it. Start moving the fsb up and see how the temps and stability looks. I am running a AXP 2500+ @ 3200+ (2.2ghz) as my main gaming rig and this combined with a 6800GT@ultra work wonders, even for the latest games.

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: SynthDude2001

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

I can't remember what frequency the XP 2800+ ran at (compared to the 3200+'s 2.2GHz), but I'd be very surprised if the difference was that much. Unless you could get the 3200+ for a really cheap price, I wouldn't really recommend throwing the money at that.

Edit: Take a look here. I can't tell exactly where the XP 2800+ would fall since it's not specifically listed on that page, but you'd probably get a noticeable little jump (actually a little more than I was expecting) - at least based on that one game. I still don't really think it would be worth the money though, especially with the prices I've seen for XP 3200+'s lately - unless of course you could get a really cheap used one.

After some more research, unless one falls into my lap, I'm probably not going to worry about it. Besides, with the leap in video card I'm getting, I should be satisfied for some time to come (Ti4200-->X850 Pro)

Edit: Thanks for the link though. I did find that earlier, but since it wasn't exact I kept searching. :beer: for all who helped.

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: Spike

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

You might as well try overclocking that cpu since your ram can handle it. Start moving the fsb up and see how the temps and stability looks. I am running a AXP 2500+ @ 3200+ (2.2ghz) as my main gaming rig and this combined with a 6800GT@ultra work wonders, even for the latest games.

What tools did you use to do this? I'm a total O/C noob. Is there a preferred guide to go about doing this sort of stuff?

 

[Spike]

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Spike

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

You might as well try overclocking that cpu since your ram can handle it. Start moving the fsb up and see how the temps and stability looks. I am running a AXP 2500+ @ 3200+ (2.2ghz) as my main gaming rig and this combined with a 6800GT@ultra work wonders, even for the latest games.

What tools did you use to do this? I'm a total O/C noob. Is there a preferred guide to go about doing this sort of stuff?

There are tools available as well as guides on the web but all I did was a simple FSB change. In my case the change was easy, my 2500+ has a barton core than I knew could handle 3200+. The 2500+ runs at 1826mhz on a 11multi x 166fsb. The 3200+ runs at 2200mhz on a 11x200. All I did was get 3200 ram (200fsb) and change my mobo fsb from 166 to 200 and I had a 3200+.

If your 2800+ is a t-bred core then you are looking at a stock speed of 2.25ghz running a 13.5 x 166fsb. If this is the case you might be near the top you can go but the best chance is to play with your fsb in your BIOS. It should have incrimental adjustments where you can increase 1-5fsb at a time. For example, if you go in and increase your FSB by 10 you would be at 13.5x176 = 2376 mhz.

Once you do this you need to watch your temps, run prime 95, and other testing programs to make sure your stable. Also don't be afraid to up your voltage sligthly, also through the BIOS.

If you have a Barton core AXP then you are in much better shape for overclocking as they were designed to run at 200fsb but where reduced to 166 in some cases to fill in the speed gaps. Do the same things suggested above (changing fsb, voltage, testing) but I bet your restults will be better.

Personally if I was in your shoes I would save a few $ and pick up a A64 3000+ venice and a Asrock board for ~$180ish and overclock that. The board can use your AGP card as well as gives you a PCIe slot for later and it can handle modest overclocks.

-spike

 

[ITPaladin]

Asrock doesn't do high overclocking though. It is limited on voltage.

I have NF7-S version 2 with AXP-M 2500+, the cadillac combo for OCing, but I could never get into understanding the process.
I have it running at 400 fsb but only 1.9 ghz. I just can't seem to have 11x200 even with upping cpu core to 1.65 and beyond.
I use Corsair value select RAM that I run dual channel. I let memtest86 run for 7 hours while sleeping with no errors.

I am on the fence of changing systems or just getting a new videocard as I have a 9600xt. I have an offer to buy for $100 a 3200+.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

Yeah, I disagree if he means 10-15 just with a cpu change.

I've got a 6800GT and I played D3, FarCry etc with it set at 11x166 (Barton 2500+ speed) and 11x215 (faster than a Barton 3200+), I could not really see a noticeable difference.

CPU bottlenecking is really only seen at very low resolutions. For almost all FPS games, the gfx card is the bottleneck. I say your cpu can handle that card.

Bottom line, I wouldn't waste the money on a 3200+ for gaming purposes right now.

Anyway, you can first drop in the new card. Check your fps at low rez and high rez in game benchies. You'll find the max fps your cpu "allows" at 800x600. The low rez pretty much takes the gfx card out-of-the picture. If those fps are acceptable, you can be sure taht the decrease in fps as you go to higher rez's are due to your gfx card. If the cpu can't put acceptible fps at 800x600, then you'll need to upgrade it. I'm betting it'll be "OK"

Fern

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: Patt

What tools did you use to do this? I'm a total O/C noob. Is there a preferred guide to go about doing this sort of stuff?

Your Barton 2800+ runs at 12.5 x 166. If you raise your FSB up to 176, you'll be at the same speed (2.2ghz) as a 3200+ cpu.

Check the sticky's at the top of cpu/OCing section here and at Tom's Hardware Guide forums. They are plenty of guides on how to OC these Barton's.

BTW: Keep you ram and cpu insynch (same FSB frequency) you'll get better perofrmance taht way.

Fern

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: Patt

Originally posted by: Reck
the jump would be somewhere between 10-15fps in games.

That much ... ? Any other opinions?

Yeah, I disagree if he means 10-15 just with a cpu change.

I've got a 6800GT and I played D3, FarCry etc with it set at 11x166 (Barton 2500+ speed) and 11x215 (faster than a Barton 3200+), I could not really see a noticeable difference.

CPU bottlenecking is really only seen at very low resolutions. For almost all FPS games, the gfx card is the bottleneck. I say your cpu can handle that card.

Bottom line, I wouldn't waste the money on a 3200+ for gaming purposes right now.

Anyway, you can first drop in the new card. Check your fps at low rez and high rez in game benchies. You'll find the max fps your cpu "allows" at 800x600. The low rez pretty much takes the gfx card out-of-the picture. If those fps are acceptable, you can be sure taht the decrease in fps as you go to higher rez's are due to your gfx card. If the cpu can't put acceptible fps at 800x600, then you'll need to upgrade it. I'm betting it'll be "OK"

Fern

Thanks for the info Fern! This was addressing what I was thinking about. I mean, I can play COD2 & FEAR with some setting scaled down on 1024 x 768 currently with my Ti4200, so I'm thinking I'm not CPU limited too badly at the moment.

I guess I just wanted to know if I bought too much GPU for my system? (or if there is such a thing )

 

[Fern]

I guess I just wanted to know if I bought too much GPU for my system? (or if there is such a thing )

If you're a FPS (fist person shooter) type-gamer, basically you can never get enough card, IMHO.

Geez, I'd love to move up even further, like a 7800GTX. They just don't make 'em in agp flavor though (yet).

Other than the gfx card, the next biggest impact I have found in my benchies is amount of ram. Not even speed of ram. I played with very loose and very tight timings, no diff here again. Course might be different on an Intel platform. But not the XP platform. The improvement is not with fps, it's with loading times. Loading times were slow, and in-game navigation crappy, with 2 x 256MB. Way better with 2 x 512MB like you've got.

Man, you're gonna enjoy that new card :thumbsup: That's a hella jump from a Ti4200. Hope the X850 pro has 256MB of vid ram? I went from a 9800p with 128mb to this 6800GT with 256MB. A fast gpu core with a big chunk DDR3 vid ram is really helpful in these new games. The additional vid ram eliminated stuttering and slow downs when entering a new room with lots of critters. Like in D3

Fern

 

[Patt]

Originally posted by: Fern

I guess I just wanted to know if I bought too much GPU for my system? (or if there is such a thing )

If you're a FPS (fist person shooter) type-gamer, basically you can never get enough card, IMHO.

Geez, I'd love to move up even further, like a 7800GTX. They just don't make 'em in agp flavor though (yet).

Other than the gfx card, the next biggest impact I have found in my benchies is amount of ram. Not even speed of ram. I played with very loose and very tight timings, no diff here again. Course might be different on an Intel platform. But not the XP platform. The improvement is not with fps, it's with loading times. Loading times were slow, and in-game navigation crappy, with 2 x 256MB. Way better with 2 x 512MB like you've got.

Man, you're gonna enjoy that new card :thumbsup: That's a hella jump from a Ti4200. Hope the X850 pro has 256MB of vid ram? I went from a 9800p with 128mb to this 6800GT with 256MB. A fast gpu core with a big chunk DDR3 vid ram is really helpful in these new games. The additional vid ram eliminated stuttering and slow downs when entering a new room with lots of critters. Like in D3

Fern

Sweet ... I'm so pumped. And yeah, I do play a lot of games, not exclusively FPS, but I've been languishing in low resolutions/textures/features etc. for a long time now and been putting up with low framerates. Plus apparently the card I bought is moddable-easily moddable- to an X850 XT PE

Might even extend the life of my system more than the 8-10 months I was anticipating.

 

[ITPaladin]

I just tried a run again ocing my 2500+ mobile. I still can't get Prime95 'blend' test stable with 1.75vcore and 11x200 (400 FSB from the stock 266 of the mobile).
DDR volt is at 2.6 (default).
I will run the test for up to 10 minutes then the computer reboots.
Maybe the best thing to do is just go back to 400 fsb at 1.8/1.9 ghz and get an x800xl/x850 agp.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: ITPaladin
I just tried a run again ocing my 2500+ mobile. I still can't get Prime95 'blend' test stable with 1.75vcore and 11x200 (400 FSB from the stock 266 of the mobile).
DDR volt is at 2.6 (default).
I will run the test for up to 10 minutes then the computer reboots.
Maybe the best thing to do is just go back to 400 fsb at 1.8/1.9 ghz and get an x800xl/x850 agp.

You cpu at 1.8 or 1.9ghz is not gonna bottleneck those cards in any meaningful way at all, so go for it :thumbsup:

As far as your OC, start a new thread (PM if I don't see it and post) and give us your specs. Ex, PSU, cpu cooling and so forth. Also would like to know your BIOS settings. And what steps are you doing in your OC efforts.

For example, what are your temps? Do you have MBM5 on there to monitor the PSU voltage rails etc?

Sounds like your getting about a zero OC? While every chip is different, that doesn't seem right. I'm doing FSB 215 x 11 at about 1.5vcore, rock solid.

I'm pretty sure it's my mobo that holds me back on the higher FSB. I've tried 220 x 10 (low multi took the cpu out of the equation) and failed memtest at the 24th hour. I've got some modded BIOS that should enable me to go higher, but haven't really bothered as my CPU isn't bottlenecking in games.

If I can ever get my hands on a 7800GTX with 512MB I'll really turn on the juice and shoot for 2.5ghz for my chip

Fern