athlon 64 2800+ vs athlon 3000xp (333)

sonoma1993

Diamond Member
May 31, 2004
3,410
19
81
is there a big diffrence between the performance of a athlon 64 2800 and the athlonxp 3000+, will I notice the diffrence?

current system spec
athlon 3000xp (333)
768mb 2700ddr
ati radeon 9500 pro
gigabyte via kt600-L
soundblaster audigy
 

Vette73

Lifer
Jul 5, 2000
21,503
9
0
Programs that run better on RAW mhz might do a LITTLE better with the 3000+ XP, BUT the 2800+ A64 would be better for most things. That and a good nForce3 250gb , like a Epox, will allow the 2800+ to overlcok well.

Or if oyu don;t need 64bit, get a Sempron 3100+. Same Mhz as a 2800+ but with less L2 cache and no 64bit. Will be cheaper and just as fast for the most part.
 

Jeff7181

Lifer
Aug 21, 2002
18,368
11
81
An AthlonXP isn't even an option anymore unless you MUST keep the price below $200 for a CPU and motherboard. If you can afford $300, the choice is clear, socket 754 Athlon-64.
 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
31,440
5
0
I don't think I'd upgrade from a 3000+XP to a 2800+A64.. just not a big enough jump.
 

AnonymouseUser

Diamond Member
May 14, 2003
9,943
107
106
Originally posted by: CraigRT
I don't think I'd upgrade from a 3000+XP to a 2800+A64.. just not a big enough jump.
Agreed. There is no doubt that the 2800+ A64 is faster, I just wouldn't upgrade from your setup unless I was moving to at least a 3400+ A64.
 

CeilingHoles

Member
Jul 19, 2004
171
0
0
I agree that the upgrade isn't worth it. I'd wait for CPU prices to go down, then maybe upgrade to a Socket 939 CPU.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Originally posted by: Jeff7181
An AthlonXP isn't even an option anymore unless you MUST keep the price below $200 for a CPU and motherboard. If you can afford $300, the choice is clear, socket 754 Athlon-64.

Lame car analogy: That's like saying because the hummers available to the public there's no need for jeeps anymore.:p

The XP mobiles still offer a superior price to performance ratio when both overclocked. With both a 2500 and a 2800 at 2.5 the newcastle will be only about 10% faster...even if I'm a little off...the performance increase certainly does'nt justify the newscastles 50% price increase.

Heck you could go below a $100 for CPU and mobo with XP and fullfill 95% of the publics computer needs... there are many reasons to get an XP. Prudent performance being number 1.

Anyway I would never recommend a over-priced A64 2800 unless someone really needs it. Far from clear IMO.
 

LocutusX

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
3,061
0
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Um, are the Newcastle 2800+'s even capable of a 700mhz overclock?

(1.8GHz -> 2.5GHz)
 

cremefilled

Golden Member
Mar 25, 2000
1,446
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Although it's just one benchmark, the Anandtech Doom3 CPU review shows at 800X600, HQ:

A64 2800+ (1.8 GHz)= 78.8 fps
XP 3000+ (2.18 GHz)= 61.2 fps
XP 2500+ (1.83 GHz)= 55.6 fps


Within a CPU-type, fps increases linearly with processor speed above those particular models. A performace increment of 42% from a 1.83 GHz XP-2500+ to the 1.8 GHz A64-2800+ shows just how efficient the memory controller on the A64 is.
 

DragonFire

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,042
0
0
I wish everyone would stop suggesting the skt754 when most should know by now that its a dead end road. Wait for skt939. Id upgrade your video card before upgrading your mobo and cpu.
 

ir0nw0lf

Senior member
Jul 11, 2001
409
0
0
Originally posted by: DragonFire
I wish everyone would stop suggesting the skt754 when most should know by now that its a dead end road. Wait for skt939. Id upgrade your video card before upgrading your mobo and cpu.

OK... Socket 478 and Socket A are essentially dead end roads as well. By your logic, we should stop suggesting those as well? There is nothing wrong with suggesting Socket 754 right now--the price is very very good for what you get. Some people can't or don't want to wait for Socket 939 to drop in price. That platform isn't going down in price very fast right now.

As for the OP, I don't think that kind of upgrade right now is really worth the $$$ you would have to put into it.
 

LocutusX

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
3,061
0
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Originally posted by: cremefilled
Although it's just one benchmark, the Anandtech Doom3 CPU review shows at 800X600, HQ:

A64 2800+ (1.8 GHz)= 78.8 fps
XP 3000+ (2.18 GHz)= 61.2 fps
XP 2500+ (1.83 GHz)= 55.6 fps


Within a CPU-type, fps increases linearly with processor speed above those particular models. A performace increment of 42% from a 1.83 GHz XP-2500+ to the 1.8 GHz A64-2800+ shows just how efficient the memory controller on the A64 is.

Yeah, that's what I thought as well. A64 tromps all over the AXP in D3. I have a feeling the same thing will happen in HL2. Hmm, wonder why Zebo would have said that an A64 is only 10% faster than an AXP of the same given clock speed.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Because it is around 10% on average more in games less in general apps. Still even at 22% better in doom it does'nt justify it's 100% price increase. If something costs double it better be twice as fast or it's a poor value by definition.

Here's a link comparing the two.
http://www.anandtech.com/printarticle.aspx?i=2038

Just got a $49 cpu/mobo combo from frys I'm setting up for a lady at work I'm going to give her. Scores 8670 sanda CPU alu marks. If something costs six times as much it better be six times better. Show me 48,000 for A64 and then you have a good argument, until then A64 has a horrendous price to performance ratio and is really only sensible if you need it.

As far as overclcoking, I hav'nt seen a AX newcastle fail to get 2500 on stock HSF.
 

LocutusX

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
3,061
0
0
I don't think anyone here NEEDS A64's Zebo - we just WANT 'em.

NEED vs. WANT... if it's a hobby, it's a "want". ;)


I like my A64's freshly cooked, with some bacon on the side.
 

DragonFire

Golden Member
Oct 9, 1999
1,042
0
0
Originally posted by: ir0nw0lf
Originally posted by: DragonFire
I wish everyone would stop suggesting the skt754 when most should know by now that its a dead end road. Wait for skt939. Id upgrade your video card before upgrading your mobo and cpu.

OK... Socket 478 and Socket A are essentially dead end roads as well. By your logic, we should stop suggesting those as well? There is nothing wrong with suggesting Socket 754 right now--the price is very very good for what you get. Some people can't or don't want to wait for Socket 939 to drop in price. That platform isn't going down in price very fast right now.

As for the OP, I don't think that kind of upgrade right now is really worth the $$$ you would have to put into it.


By my logic, yes. First there is no reason to upgraded an XP3000+ to A64 when there isnt even a OS out to use it. If he or anyone else for that matter would just wait anothe 6-12 months for skt939 to level off in price, I think they will be lot happier in the long run. At this time there is no mention of dualcore cpus being on the skt754 platform either. Its just what I think, I just know I'm not the only one that thinks going 754 is a mistake....

Originally posted by: 3chordcharlie
JUST BUY 1MB CACHE PENTIUM 4 IT'S BETTER In EVERYTHING THAN AMD. AMD SUCKS!

(/PeteRoy;))

And just think all it needs for it to be better is run 1Ghz+ faster then the fastest AMD cpu and if comparing to the XP, the P4 only needs a FSB 4x as fast. Neither is "better in everything" then the other.
 

Bypolar

Member
Jun 27, 2003
28
0
0
The 2800 will be faster no matter what.

And the guy who Posted amd sucks is stupid.

If you have the spare cash then doit , there is no time Like the present. The people that are waiting will still be waiting when the end comes.

Socket 754 will be around for a while it is posed as the socket A replacement in the distance future.
 

MrK6

Diamond Member
Aug 9, 2004
4,458
4
81
What the hell are all of you talking about?

First, never buy new hardware in the hope that it will be upgradeable in the future. Something newer/better/more powerful will be out and build a new comp surrounding that. Build a complete system that's what you want right now and enjoy and save your cash for your next system, instead of constantly upgrading. By people's logic here, when I built my 2GHz P4 Socket 478, I should have been set. Guess what, faster FSB's came out, better south bridges, etc etc. You can move up optical drives and hard drives if you want, but other components just turn obsolete.

Secondly, Socket 754 will become a great budget socket for AMD, and as of now it's still a great socket, especially for the price of components.

Thirdly, the new AMD64's beat out any and all of Intel's offerings. I don't think I've seen any benchmark where a P4 defintely beats an A64. Sounds like a fanboy is upset...

Anyways, to answer your question sonoma, you wouldnt see a worthwhile performance boost. If you wanted a free upgrade, you could try upping the FSB of your 3000+ XP from 333 to 400. However, as far as hardware goes, a socket 939 A64 should be the minimum for you.
 

cremefilled

Golden Member
Mar 25, 2000
1,446
0
0
If something costs six times as much it better be six times better.

No offense, but that is ridiculous. First of all, there are many component costs of a computer, of which a CPU is only one. Paying six times as much for a CPU doesn't make the entire computer 6x as expensive. Second, there has never been a time, and there never will be, when MHz are linearly related to price.

Taking the argument to the extreme, if you can find a Duron-600 for $5.00 on the used market, there is no need for anything more because that gives the highest CPUMark/price ratio. And when you overclock that Duron-600 inside the dinged-up E-Machine case you rescued from the trash, oh mama! What savings!

It all depends on your priorities. If you spend five or eight or ten hours per day in front of your computer, how much is your time, and the pleasurableness of that time, worth?

A more useful increment is to talk about "best buys" at a certain price level. I think that most people on this forum would say that for $150-200 for CPU+mobo, a Barton (prob. mobile) and an NForce2 is the best bargain. At $300, most, though not all, would point to the socket-754 A64.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Paying six times as much for a CPU doesn't make the entire computer 6x as expensive.
--------------------
I could make a 20X cost comp with little effort, the point is these unessesary costs add up, and most reasonable people would rather use that money for something more productive, like maturing assets instead of deprecating ones, such as the grand champion of depreciation, the computer. The differences between a $100 processor and a $1000 one are nothing to write home about and overclocked become miniscule.



Second, there has never been a time, and there never will be, when MHz are linearly related to price.
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Only because people leave logic at the door failing to do a cost/benefit analysis when computer shopping. See below. I would charge it too if people are willing to pay it.



Taking the argument to the extreme, if you can find a Duron-600 for $5.00 on the used market, there is no need for anything more because that gives the highest CPUMark/price ratio. And when you overclock that Duron-600 inside the dinged-up E-Machine case you rescued from the trash, oh mama! What savings!

It all depends on your priorities. If you spend five or eight or ten hours per day in front of your computer, how much is your time, and the pleasurableness of that time, worth?

A more useful increment is to talk about "best buys" at a certain price level. I think that most people on this forum would say that for $150-200 for CPU+mobo, a Barton (prob. mobile) and an NForce2 is the best bargain. At $300, most, though not all, would point to the socket-754 A64.
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The benefits and validity of value purchasing are well established and not really open to debate. The strategy? Simply identify your minimum requirements, then evaluate all suitable products, settling on the one with the highest price/performance ratio. It's only when you allow yourself to be clouded by emotion from feelings being refined, special, or a member of a select club do we allow ourselves to deviate from this model and buy products with a poor price to performance ratio. If that 600 Duron satisfies your minimum requirements, you're correct in recommending this outstanding value. But since 95% of the users here need a more powerful machine it's not even a factor in thier equation. Stay focued on th processors I was talking about in this thread and you'll begin to see the value for everyone because they are all top performers or can be made into top performers but at very different price points. Some have more VALUE than others.
 

LocutusX

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
3,061
0
0
I believe the recent Doom3 CPU tests by XBit labs provide a clearer picture on the perf. differences between K7 & K8 in the D3 engine.

While the K8 "only" achieves a 22% gain over the K7 in timedemo @ equal clock speeds, when real-world performance was examined using FRAPS, the K8 achieved a 50% gain over an equal-clocked K7! Something to consider if D3-engine performance is important to you.
 

CraigRT

Lifer
Jun 16, 2000
31,440
5
0
for the people not recommending S754, give your head a shake! :p
S754 is inexpensive, and still scale to decent levels with the current CPU lineup.. there is no reason to not buy S754 at this time IMO!