Assisted living facility with a "No CPR" policy.

[marvdmartian]

The no CPR policy is likely done solely to limit the cost of their liability insurance.

Doing CPR on an otherwise healthy middle aged person can cause cracked ribs, bruising, etc. On an 80-something year old woman, who likely suffers from serious calcium loss in her bones, it could lead to much, much worse. And that's even if she survives.

And you wouldn't believe how many otherwise rational people will turn around and sue a place like that, at the drop of a hat, simply because grandma suffered a crushed rib cage.

 

[SphinxnihpS]

The lady on the phone should hang herself as should all the board members of the "living" facility.

 

[Ns1]

well this was predictable:

http://www.yelp.com/biz/glenwood-gardens-bakersfield

 

[umbrella39]

Policy or not as far as I'm concerned this "nurse" has blood on her hands. Of course I'm biased I have dedicated my life to helping and saving lives....that's why I became a NURSE FFS. This woman is a shame to my profession.
Immediate CPR on a witnessed cardiac arrest has high survivability even in the elderly. I'm sorry that company has a shitty policy. Not helping someone like that is just horrid from an ethics/morality standpoint. Do no harm indeed.

Listening to that 911 call just made my insides scream.

Come on Trauma... this is a common policy in many assisted living facilities. Just like you wouldn't do compressions on someone with clear dnr orders... it's essentially no difference. We put my grandma in a facility that had an identical no cpr policy. We don't have the latitude to go rogue and against policy no matter how conflicted we might be as direct patient care professionals. The family that put her there signed off on the policy. I have also heard she was a DNI /DNR.

 

[Ns1]

Come on Trauma... this is a common policy in many assisted living facilities. Just like you wouldn't do compressions on someone with clear dnr orders... it's essentially no difference. We put my grandma in a facility that had an identical no cpr policy. We don't have the latitude to go rogue and against policy no matter how conflicted we might be as direct patient care professionals. The family that put her there signed off on the policy. I have also heard she was a DNI /DNR.

a DNR is not the same as a no CPR policy...

 

[waggy]

a DNR is not the same as a no CPR policy...

right.

so far there is no reports of her having a DNR. the nurse also didn't say she did on the phone. The manager did not in clearing the rules to the media.

 

[highland145]

The lady on the phone should hang herself as should all the board members of the "living" facility.

My Dad's been under hospice for months (he keeps exceeding expectations. Tough bastard. :biggrin It doesn't appear their primary concern is life saving. Understandable in his case, emphysema, 55+ years of smoking.

Step in front of a truck.....

 

[Wyndru]

well this was predictable:

http://www.yelp.com/biz/glenwood-gardens-bakersfield

And it looks like it's all college kids posting these comments. I don't trust yelp for this reason (or any online review sites for that matter). Nobody even has all the details of what happened but they are all experts that feel that they need to post bad comments about a place they have never been to.

 

[Red Squirrel]

This reminds me of those stories that come out once in a while involving a car accident where a guy is inside burning and someone tries to go save him and the cops tell him to stop and wait for the fire dept to arrive. Its sad when red tape and politics can be the cause of a death.

 

[NikolaeVarius]

This reminds me of those stories that come out once in a while involving a car accident where a guy is inside burning and someone tries to go save him and the cops tell him to stop and wait for the fire dept to arrive. Its sad when red tape and politics can be the cause of a death.

That situation is so damn different, I refuse to believe this is a serious post.

 

[Ns1]

And it looks like it's all college kids posting these comments. I don't trust yelp for this reason (or any online review sites for that matter). Nobody even has all the details of what happened but they are all experts that feel that they need to post bad comments about a place they have never been to.

the 911 call is pretty self explanatory imo.

 

[highland145]

the 911 call is pretty self explanatory imo.

The legalities are the problem.


Lawyers.......


Love you, Jeeebus.

 

[Wyndru]

the 911 call is pretty self explanatory imo.

Oh I didn't realize the 911 call explained exactly why the no CPR rule was put in place.

The problem is everyone is reacting to this story with emotion and anger, and there are bigger things in place that people are overlooking in their responses.

 

[Ns1]

Oh I didn't realize the 911 call explained exactly why the no CPR rule was put in place.

When I'm looking for a place to host my grandma IDGAF what the reason is.

 

[Wyndru]

When I'm looking for a place to host my grandma IDGAF what the reason is.

Then you better read the policies closely before signing, because this is not uncommon, and really only a news story because it generates hits based on emotion and anger.

 

[tcsenter]

And it looks like it's all college kids posting these comments. I don't trust yelp for this reason (or any online review sites for that matter).

Same thing happened to the university psychiatrist who had been seeing James Holmes before the Aurora shooting. It was suggested initially in the media that she may have failed to report him to campus police, then her professional listing on Yelp was inundated with hundreds of bad 'reviews' (prior to the shooting, there were only three or four, all were positive). As it turns out (and reported later in the media), she actually HAD reported her concerns to campus police that Holmes could be a danger to himself or others.

 

[Ns1]

Then you better read the policies closely before signing, because this is not uncommon, and really only a news story because it generates hits based on emotion and anger.

I'll keep that in mind for the future. Luckily social media has already crossed this place off the list.

 

[Ns1]

Toomer told KGET that residents of the home's independent living community are informed of the "no-CPR" policy and agree to it when they move in.

The policy does not apply at the adjacent assisted living and skilled nursing facilities. Those residents would have received CPR in identical circumstances.

Calls by USA TODAY to Toomer and parent company Brookdale Senior Living, which operates long-term care facilities in 36 states, were not returned. Glenwood Gardens' website says Brookdale facilities are listed among the top 2012 choices for senior living and nursing homes, on lists by CNN and U.S. News & World Report.

"This speaks to the fact that consumers have to be extremely vigilant when selecting independent living and assisted living care,'' Grant says. "It's really hard when you're looking for care and reading these contracts to understand every word. We suggest people take them to an attorney to understand the responsibilities of the facilities."

At many of the nation's retirement communities, the cost of the care is based on how much medical assistance is required. Both assisted living and skilled nursing care are more expensive than independent living.

Not all facilities have the same policy, however. At Erickson Living, an effort would have been made to save Bayless, says Dan Dunne, director of communications for the company, which has retirement facilities in nine states.

TMYK

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...p8LGRTM-M_IvzL_EJBnfUiQ&bvm=bv.43148975,d.aWc

 

[umbrella39]

a DNR is not the same as a no CPR policy...

That is why I said essentially. If u check gma into a facility that has a no cpr policy and gma is a full code... shame on you. As stated... its essentially the same thing since no one is going to do compressions bag intubate or push any acls meds.

 

[Red Squirrel]

That situation is so damn different, I refuse to believe this is a serious post.

They're both situations where someone can help save someone's life but because of some silly rule or policy, they have to stand back while that person is not getting any help. Now in this particular case the nurse refused vs being told not to, but the idea is the same. Red tape stopping someone from saving someone's life.

It's also odd to think that a nurse would not have proper CPR training.

 

[Peter Nixeus]

right.

so far there is no reports of her having a DNR. the nurse also didn't say she did on the phone. The manager did not in clearing the rules to the media.

CNN reported that the deceased patient did have a DNR on file, but were not allowed to make it publically available to the media due to HIPAA laws...

 

[NikolaeVarius]

They're both situations where someone can help save someone's life but because of some silly rule or policy, they have to stand back while that person is not getting any help. Now in this particular case the nurse refused vs being told not to, but the idea is the same. Red tape stopping someone from saving someone's life.

It's also odd to think that a nurse would not have proper CPR training.

No its not. The first instance involves a man also putting himself in danger in order to attempt to save someone. He could have easily made it so that firefighters then had to rescue two different people, which is pretty goddamn fucking annoying from the firefighters perspective.

This instance does not have that.

 

[Wyndru]

It's also odd to think that a nurse would not have proper CPR training.

That's the situation at one of the homes my wife works at. They have "nurses" with various job descriptions and responsibilities, and many of them are not required to keep their CPR training up to date. This might be why some of these facilities have these policies. If someone without proper training tried to perform CPR and broke a rib or something, or if they weren't even certified, they would be facing a lawsuit.

It sucks, but this stuff costs money, and these places are all about cutting costs.

 

[Wyndru]

CNN reported that the deceased patient did have a DNR on file, but were not allowed to make it publically available to the media due to HIPAA laws...

I just don't understand why the call was even made though if there was a DNR. Unless the nurse didn't realize.

 

[Paladin3]

Maybe grandma just wanted to pass on when her time came. Anyone think of that? Maybe she and her family were fully aware and supported the no-CPR policy. She was 87 y/o, after all.

I think this is the most plausible situation since the family seems to be the only ones not mad at the assisted living facility over her death.