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Question Assistance Needed Dash Cam/ Deleting and/or Formatting (SDXC) ?

synoptic12

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Seeking any information regarding the deletion of files on memory cards, namely SDXC. However, SD properties work in the same manner. When inserting the memory card (SDXC) into PC, I can readily delete the files (video), no problem. However, once the files are deleted, "where do they wind up"? There is no recycle bin. The DCIM are namely a folder, holding the video files.

The dash cam overwrites the files but I have not allowed that process to take place yet. In general, once the vehicle is returned to the point of origin, I simply remove the SDHC and either keep some video or just delete the unwanted files from PC. I believe that the SDHX is good for about four (4) hours before being overwritten. I have not traveled that period of time to have allowed the files to be overwritten.

I've been using this method for about six (6) years with no issues, none; including the same memory card. Employing a 32GB Sandisk Ultra.
* In other words, is it necessary to format the memory card if no issues have been present for six years?

My question is, again, "Once the unwanted files are deleted from the SDXC or SD card," "Where do they go"? And, should the process of re-formatting the memory card be of any concern? Are the files that have been 'deleted' still stored somewhere? Any and all information regarding the aforesaid is truly appreciated.


Ambarella A7 Chip- Mini 0805 Dash Cam: ''None better" > Six years and still no problems_ 'Good video in 1080P.
 
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Soulkeeper

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The behavior would be similar to any system drive in which a file is deleted.
The filesystem handles it. You delete the file and, typically, the metadata is erased, the file's data may or may not still be present on the nand depending on if it is trimmed or if the blocks are used for writing another file or by the sd card's controller (ie: garbage collection, slc cache, etc.). It is harder to recover deleted files on nand based storage than traditional spinning disks. Attempting to undelete the file would require software that is aware of the filesystem type/behavior and may or may not work.
The idea of a "recycle bin" is somewhat windows specific, basically the file is not deleted when it is in there, it is just moved incase you change your mind. The SD card likely came preformatted with xfat, you can read up on that further for more details. It might be possible to adjust some behavior.
 

synoptic12

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The SDXC memory card (32GB) was pre-formatted to FAT32, not x-fat. All memory cards 32GB and under are formatted to Fat32. I'm not seeking to recover any files. I'm merely asking if the SDXC memory card should be formatted. As stated earlier, I insert the memory card into the adapter to the PC and delete all files (video). The memory card (32GB) still shows 29.7GB available. In other words, 'Is it necessary to format the memory card each month', contingent on the process I'm using? This is a dash cam whereby all videos are deleted, never looping or overwriting. My travel does not encompass that amount of time. Thanks very much for your input.
 
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Soulkeeper

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I just don't understand why you are confused over this. It's just a card that is partitioned. Nobody ever intended users to reformat/repartition their card everytime they used it. The only possible benefit I could see is maybe forcing the device to be trimmed for potentially faster writes when used by the camera.

* In other words, is it necessary to format the memory card if no issues have been present for six years? NO

'Is it necessary to format the memory card each month' NO

"Once the unwanted files are deleted from the SDXC or SD card," "Where do they go"? GONE, The controller chip can delay the actual delete or it can be instant.

fat32 or xfat, it don't matter. The os can optionally issue a trim command to the sd card for deleted file blocks, and the controller chip can optionally ignore/delay those.
 
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Soulkeeper

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Who cares ?
You don't know where files go when they are deleted, i'm trying to help you.
xfat, fat32, fat16, ntfs, ext4, etc. ... The files go to the same place when you delete them.

Why did you start this thread ? To argue with someone who forgot that some corps ship their SD cards with fat32 instead of xfat at a particular size ?
I doubt anyone cares if you repartition and format your SD card all day long. Go ahead ...
 

synoptic12

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Thanks very much for the courtesy. I'm not seeking to argue. Whether you're versed in 'dash cams' is somewhat questionable. However, the focal point remains on formatting an sdxc card when employing use in a dash cam. Accordingly, there are not any that state 'not' to allow the card to go past a month without formatting. There are even menu settings in dash cams (format) for this specific reason. There are numerous white papers associated with the aforesaid aspect.

To be more precise, when a dash cam records video, after a certain amount of time (number of hours), the loop recording overwrites the previous files and starts anew. To format is to allegedly remove any errors from the memory card in the dash cam. Again, my distances (driving) do not allow the dash cam to 'loop': going over the previous files. Whether looping has any effect as to format seems to be a possibility. I have not formatted my memory card (32gb.) in six years and the card is still working fine: 'no errors or missing files'. Apparently, there are some who state they've lost missing files from their dash camera. The recommendation is to format the memory card once a month. The dash camera would not employ this feature (Format) in the menu settings if it were not of significance.

I've posed this question on 'Bleeping Computer' in past years. There was a thread associated with the same content. If you're interested you can read the link here.

 

Soulkeeper

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You're right, I have no experience with dash cams. I only understand the basic ideas of the underlying hardware.
Periodically formatting an otherwise working SD card shouldn't need to be done. Saying this, It likely won't hurt either.
Although most SD cards come with fat32 or xfat already, it's possible there could be some out there that are not prepartitioned (or have been used or setup with a different filesystem).
I've also seen this option in digital camera menus. I seem to remember some cheap older ones that didn't come partitioned years back (due to royalty/time costs).

Maybe someone with more experience on this exact subject can weigh in. Good luck.
 
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synoptic12

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You're right, I have no experience with dash cams. I only understand the basic ideas of the underlying hardware.
Periodically formatting an otherwise working SD card shouldn't need to be done. Saying this, It likely won't hurt either.
Although most SD cards come with fat32 or xfat already, it's possible there could be some out there that are not prepartitioned (or have been used or setup with a different filesystem).
I've also seen this option in digital camera menus. I seem to remember some cheap older ones that didn't come partitioned years back (due to royalty/time costs).

Maybe someone with more experience on this exact subject can weigh in. Good luck.
I believe you have addressed the question. I'll just continue using the Micro Card without periodic formatting until an issue arises. Thank you very much for your assistance.
 

Insert_Nickname

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May 6, 2012
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Maybe someone with more experience on this exact subject can weigh in. Good luck.
Perhaps we should point the OP to anandtechs excellent primer on how an SSD work? The principle is the same with all flash based storage after all. Dashcam or no dashcam.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/2738

You're right, I have no experience with dash cams. I only understand the basic ideas of the underlying hardware.
That's all that is required. This isn't a filesystem question at all, it's a hardware question.

Periodically formatting an otherwise working SD card shouldn't need to be done. Saying this, It likely won't hurt either.
Unless you want to empty it, there is little reason to format an SD card. It just rewrites the clusters as it goes along. What's actually happening on the card is down to the on-card controller. If there is one. Older card sometimes write directly to NAND*. The filesystem the OS sees is an abstraction layer.

*Which means absolutely no wear levelling.

Although most SD cards come with fat32 or xfat already, it's possible there could be some out there that are not prepartitioned (or have been used or setup with a different filesystem).
What filesystem cards come with is defined by the standard. You can use whichever filesystem you want, but don't expect it to work in all devices.

SD >=2GB FAT12/16
SDHC >=32GB FAT32
SDXC >= 2TB ExFAT ("FAT64")

I've also seen this option in digital camera menus. I seem to remember some cheap older ones that didn't come partitioned years back (due to royalty/time costs).
The format option in cameras isn't so much format as a "please set up this card for this camera and make an image database on it" option. F.x. my old Sony camera will work fine with any SD card, but access is slow-as-molasses if it isn't formatted in camera.
 

synoptic12

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Perhaps we should point the OP to anandtechs excellent primer on how an SSD work? The principle is the same with all flash based storage after all. Dashcam or no dashcam.

https://www.anandtech.com/show/2738



That's all that is required. This isn't a filesystem question at all, it's a hardware question.



Unless you want to empty it, there is little reason to format an SD card. It just rewrites the clusters as it goes along. What's actually happening on the card is down to the on-card controller. If there is one. Older card sometimes write directly to NAND*. The filesystem the OS sees is an abstraction layer.

*Which means absolutely no wear levelling.



What filesystem cards come with is defined by the standard. You can use whichever filesystem you want, but don't expect it to work in all devices.

SD >=2GB FAT12/16
SDHC >=32GB FAT32
SDXC >= 2TB ExFAT ("FAT64")



The format option in cameras isn't so much format as a "please set up this card for this camera and make an image database on it" option. F.x. my old Sony camera will work fine with any SD card, but access is slow-as-molasses if it isn't formatted in camera.
*It's not a hardware question. And the link you provided on SSD's has nothing to do with my OP.
 

Insert_Nickname

Diamond Member
May 6, 2012
4,181
753
126
*It's not a hardware question. And the link you provided on SSD's has nothing to do with my OP.
Seeking any information regarding the deletion of files on memory cards, namely SDXC. However, SD properties work in the same manner. When inserting the memory card (SDXC) into PC, I can readily delete the files (video), no problem. However, once the files are deleted, "where do they wind up"? There is no recycle bin. The DCIM are namely a folder, holding the video files.

The dash cam overwrites the files but I have not allowed that process to take place yet. In general, once the vehicle is returned to the point of origin, I simply remove the SDHC and either keep some video or just delete the unwanted files from PC. I believe that the SDHX is good for about four (4) hours before being overwritten. I have not traveled that period of time to have allowed the files to be overwritten.

I've been using this method for about six (6) years with no issues, none; including the same memory card. Employing a 32GB Sandisk Ultra.
* In other words, is it necessary to format the memory card if no issues have been present for six years?
You asked if there are any ill effects from formatting an SD card. An answer has been provided, which is "no".

My question is, again, "Once the unwanted files are deleted from the SDXC or SD card," "Where do they go"? And, should the process of re-formatting the memory card be of any concern? Are the files that have been 'deleted' still stored somewhere? Any and all information regarding the aforesaid is truly appreciated.
The linked article is about how NAND flash works, which is the same whether it's used in an SSD or an SD card.

404 - problem not found.
 
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synoptic12

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Bits and Pieces:
However Protected footage is not overwritten in the same way. These can fill the card and reduce the quantity of normal footage saved on your SD card. It is essential that you format your SD card every 2-3 weeks to delete the Protected filed and free up space on your memory card for new recordings.


Dashcams usually perform read/write tasks extensively, which is why memory card errors occur after lots of use. For the best recording performance, we suggest that you format the memory card quarterly.

Why do I need to format the memory card of my dashcam regularly?

Dashcams usually perform read/write tasks extensively, which is why memory card errors occur after lots of use.

For the best recording performance, we suggest that you format the memory card quarterly. You can format the memory card on your dashcam, in the DrivePro App, or on your PC using a card reader. When formatting on a PC, please use FAT32 when the memory card is 8/16/32GB, please be sure to set the “Allocation Unit Size” to 32 KB, please use exFAT when the memory card is 64/128GB, please be sure to set the “Allocation Unit Size” to 128 KB.

Note:

1. All data stored in the memory card will be erased after formatting is complete. Please back up your data before formatting.

2. If the memory card uses a file system/format that is not supported by the DrivePro, your DrivePro may fail to record or file corruption may occur.

3. After formatting, the System folder will not be regenerated. You can place the firmware update file in the root directory for the update.
 

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