are you for or against a fair tax?

[BlahBlahYouToo]

"The FairTax is what economists call a consumption tax, and the basic economic rationale for it is the same as for all such taxes. It is designed to make saving and investing more attractive to people and companies, which most economists think would spur economic growth as people plow more cash into starting businesses, building factories and so on. With the FairTax you'd get taxed only when you spend money on retail goods and services. "

it will basically do away with federal taxes, medicare, social security and estate taxes.
in its place, a proposed reform will introduce a national sales tax at ~30% (or 23% if calculated as percentage of spending, similar to how income tax is calculated).

 

[MrPickins]

<----P&N

 

[Deeko]

against

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Originally posted by: MrPickins
<----P&N

why, this is not p&n.

 

[Deeko]

It's very clearly P&N.

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: MrPickins
<----P&N

ack! back to P&N!!

 

[markgm]

I'm for whichever one lets me have more money than everyone else.

 

[rivan]

Originally posted by: markgm
I'm for whichever one lets me have more money than everyone else.

:thumbsup:

 

[kranky]

I'm for it because I'm a saver, and it would improve compliance.

 

[vi edit]

The idea of buying a $25,000 car and instead of paying $1700 for in sales tax for a total of $26,700 I now have to pay $7000 for a total of $31,000 does not sound appealing in the least bit.

Plus you are screwing people on lower incomes when it comes to basic household goods.

Their $100 a week grocery bill just went up to $130 a week. Clothes to put on your kids went up. Ect.

It sounds like a great way to dick over lower incomes and stifle the economy even more than it is.

 

[IceBergSLiM]

Im for whatever system doesn't jack 30% of my paycheck. And then comes back in april for more.

 

[Drako]

Fair Tax is an oxymoron. I'm for no taxes.

 

[PricklyPete]

There are certainly benefits:

1) Taxes are handled in a more fair manner (everyone purchasing items is affected...not just law abiding citizens who pay their taxes...of course people will figure out work arounds regardless...so this still isn't perfect).
2) Potentially this allows people better tools for managing their money and spending.

I still don't know if I'm fully for it though as it could certainly change our economic climate. Right now a lot of economic spending is related to avoiding taxes (from businesses to individuals). Suddenly spending is associated with Taxes and people will slow their spending...seems counter productive in a country defined by consumerism.

 

[amdhunter]

Originally posted by: Drako
Fair Tax is an oxymoron. I'm for no taxes.

/thread

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: vi_edit
The idea of buying a $25,000 car and instead of paying $1700 for in sales tax for a total of $26,700 I now have to pay $7000 for a total of $31,000 does not sound appealing in the least bit.

Plus you are screwing people on lower incomes when it comes to basic household goods.

Their $100 a week grocery bill just went up to $130 a week. Clothes to put on your kids went up. Ect.

It sounds like a great way to dick over lower incomes and stifle the economy even more than it is.

unless that $25,000 car becomes an $19,700 car because now no one in the supply chain has paid any taxes already. and you're buying it with 'pretax' dollars rather than dollars that have already had income and payroll taxes applied.

 

[PricklyPete]

Originally posted by: vi_edit
The idea of buying a $25,000 car and instead of paying $1700 for in sales tax for a total of $26,700 I now have to pay $7000 for a total of $31,000 does not sound appealing in the least bit.

Plus you are screwing people on lower incomes when it comes to basic household goods.

Their $100 a week grocery bill just went up to $130 a week. Clothes to put on your kids went up. Ect.

It sounds like a great way to dick over lower incomes and stifle the economy even more than it is.

Of course the flip side of that is that when Mr. CEO buys his 200million dollar yaght...60 million of that goes into taxes rather than being a 200 million dollar write-off for his company.

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: vi_edit
The idea of buying a $25,000 car and instead of paying $1700 for in sales tax for a total of $26,700 I now have to pay $7000 for a total of $31,000 does not sound appealing in the least bit.

Plus you are screwing people on lower incomes when it comes to basic household goods.

Their $100 a week grocery bill just went up to $130 a week. Clothes to put on your kids went up. Ect.

It sounds like a great way to dick over lower incomes and stifle the economy even more than it is.

unless that $25,000 car becomes an $19,700 car because now no one in the supply chain has paid any taxes already.

and you paycheck is XX% more each time because they stopped withholding FICA and everything

 

[Mo0o]

Have they figured out how this affects people at each income level? Would the poor end have having more or less money? What about the rich? Just curious, not meant to be leading

 

[AnyMal]

Originally posted by: Drako
Fair Tax is an oxymoron. I'm for no taxes.

"A nation that does not want to feed its own army will feed someone else's army"

Napoleon Bonaparte

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: Mo0o
Have they figured out how this affects people at each income level? Would the poor end have having more or less money? What about the rich? Just curious, not meant to be leading

the poor currently pay almost no income taxes, but they do pay the payroll taxes (for those who are employed). under the fair tax plan (which isn't a flat tax), everyone (including the poor) would receive a monthly prebate for consumption taxes on the basics. no idea if it's adjusted for regional housing cost differences.

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Originally posted by: vi_edit
The idea of buying a $25,000 car and instead of paying $1700 for in sales tax for a total of $26,700 I now have to pay $7000 for a total of $31,000 does not sound appealing in the least bit.

Plus you are screwing people on lower incomes when it comes to basic household goods.

Their $100 a week grocery bill just went up to $130 a week. Clothes to put on your kids went up. Ect.

It sounds like a great way to dick over lower incomes and stifle the economy even more than it is.

there is a rebate for those in low income brackets.

there's 2 other potential issues i can come up with.
a. tourism - it may affect the industry which in turn affects our economy
b. a lot of IRS employees and accountants will be out of jobs

 

[wyvrn]

Originally posted by: vi_edit
The idea of buying a $25,000 car and instead of paying $1700 for in sales tax for a total of $26,700 I now have to pay $7000 for a total of $31,000 does not sound appealing in the least bit.

Plus you are screwing people on lower incomes when it comes to basic household goods.

Their $100 a week grocery bill just went up to $130 a week. Clothes to put on your kids went up. Ect.

It sounds like a great way to dick over lower incomes and stifle the economy even more than it is.

The problem with this argument, and the counter arguments, is neither can be proved until we just do it. There are some examples in other countries, but our economy is different.

I want a 'fair' tax as well, and I do theoretically approve of a sales tax. But who knows, it could devestate our economy in ways we do not expect. This is a huge, major change that will have lots of unintended and unknown consequences.

 

[mugs]

I am for A fair tax, I am not for THE Fair Tax until someone can answer one question to my satisfaction - how does someone like me, who has a lot of money in the bank that has already been taxed, not get screwed by the Fair Tax? I've already paid income tax on that money, and now you want me to pay a huge sales tax on that same money. Fair Tax seems fine for any money made after its implementation, and it's fine for anyone who has no savings or negative savings (actually they make out pretty well). But what about me?

 

[techs]

The "fair tax" is a plan to shif the tax burden away from the rich

 

[BlahBlahYouToo]

Very good point mugs.