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Are the radicals in the middle east just that uncivilized?

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PhoenixOrion

Diamond Member
May 4, 2004
4,312
0
0
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: PhoenixOrion
Originally posted by: Ronstang
Originally posted by: PhoenixOrion
Originally posted by: Ronstang
Originally posted by: PhoenixOrion

You didn't see a high violent crime rate in _South America_??
not among the poor.

only what was shown on cnn ;), usually slaying of a politician or in-fighting among cartels, groups or govt related raids.
 

Atheus

Diamond Member
Jun 7, 2005
7,313
2
0
Originally posted by: jjessico
folks determined on killing others because of dumb things are heralded as heros and put in places of power
You mean like in the American war of independence?
 

PhoenixOrion

Diamond Member
May 4, 2004
4,312
0
0
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: jjessico
folks determined on killing others because of dumb things are heralded as heros and put in places of power
You mean like in the American war of independence?
Reminded me of the movie Cliffhanger:
Eric Qualen: Kill a few people, they call you a murderer. Kill a million and you're a conqueror.
 

m2kewl

Diamond Member
Oct 7, 2001
8,263
0
0
you know every once in a while, evolution gets a "reboot"



it's called a COMET the size of phucking TEXAS! streaking towards Earth!



and the next jew and muslim will look up and say, "we thought we got it bad..."
 

jjessico

Senior member
May 29, 2002
733
0
0
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: jjessico
folks determined on killing others because of dumb things are heralded as heros and put in places of power
You mean like in the American war of independence?
Right, which was 200+ years ago, after which (while a 'minor' bump of a civil war, yikes) the country and its people have stabilized. I don't mean to sound like a zealot or a jerk, I was just saying.
 

Injury

Lifer
Jul 19, 2004
13,066
2
0
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: jjessico
folks determined on killing others because of dumb things are heralded as heros and put in places of power
You mean like in the American war of independence?
You know, I hate posting in these threads because of the impending extreme opinions that always come up, but I'm tired of people comparing this war to the Revolutionary war.

Anyone that compares it in the light that terrorists and insurgents are just as right as the colonists doesn't know a freaking thing about the revolutionary war and what England was doing.

In fact, comparing the colonies and England to America and Iraq is practically the total f'ing opposite.

England was taxing the colonists unfairly, running a corrupt government, and giving the colonists no say in any of it. Any colonist who stood against the king was imprisioned, had their land seized and many other things. I can't even sum up in a paragraph the travesties against the colonists. They simply said we aren't going to take it anymore and declared independance.

In Iraq, the Iraqi government was the corrupt one. Why did Saddam Huessein have multiple palaces and all sorts of riches when the country was so poor? Saddam was giving his people no say in the governing of their country. The average Iraqi citizen has no way to rise up against the Iraqi military and its leaders. Iraqi lives by the rules that whoever has a gun makes the rules. Is it easy for you to sit at your computer as citizens of a nation where you can vote on your leader and say that this is fair?

So please, in all seriousness, explain to me how the colonists were savages. Yeah, by definition there were many acts of terrorism before and during the revolutionary war, but please explain how that compares to beheading travellers and civillians as an act of terror or humiliation is the same as throwing tea from a ship into the ocean. Please explain how a country fighting to give another country independence is so wrong that it justifies attacks on them. I'm not challenging you or anything, I really want to hear an opinion on this because I just can't grasp that viewpoint.

Should we really have sat back, watching... or lack therof, from the comfort of our thriving nation as Iraq constantly sets itself further behind? Should we stop sending aid to starving nations, stop giving support to countries that can't help themselves, or should we hold a double standard and refuse to help middle eastern nations because there are groups in that area that hate us, or because we needed to resort to force to solve a problem?

While I whole heartedly agree that we've been over there entirely to long, there's no point in packing up and leaving until the job is done. So many lives would have ended in vain if we just gave up. What members of the military joined under the precept that they would never have to go to war or die for a good cause?

Yeah, I'm 5 minutes from getting flamed to all hell by the dominant democratic and peace-loving force of this board, but I'm not kidding when I say I really can't grasp the concept and would like for you to explain it to me.
 

EGGO

Diamond Member
Jul 29, 2004
5,505
1
0
Originally posted by: Ronstang
Originally posted by: PhoenixOrion
switch your tv channel from cnn world news to 5PM local news.

some kid just shot another kid for their nfl jacket.

newsflash: suburban usa has not evolved either.

That sounds more like something that would happen in ghetto USA. Did it really happen in the burbs or did you simply make that part up?
No, I live in the suburbs and someone I know just got shot over some belongings. It happens.
 

Pikachu

Golden Member
Oct 10, 1999
1,178
0
0
Originally posted by: Ronstang

Their religion prevents them from evolving......and tell me it is not a control structure. You would think by now they would have come around to realize how things in the civilized world work but they don't want to have any of that. Those in control need to keep the masses dirt poor and they have to have a boogeyman to blame for it....Western Culture. You can't comprehend because it makes absolutely no sense to a human being with an IQ above 60 or someone who can see PAST his religion.
Originally posted by: jjessico

The difference, of course, between violence caused by stupid things is how the local power structure accomodates the perpetrators. In the US (and other 1st world nations) people who commit crimes such as shooting people for sneakers or what have you are looked at as criminals. In the Middle East it seems that the folks determined on killing others because of dumb things are heralded as heros and put in places of power, not state prisons.

Make sense?
Yep, it's the fact that our government and laws aren't tied to religion as theirs are. Our organized religion is pretty damn screwed up too. How else could you imagine circumcizing babies for an accepted ritual? How about brainwashing innocent kids into believing they'll suffer eternal damnation if they don't follow the script? Praying to saints? Shaming members into filling the basket?

We're not "above them" where religion is concerned. We simply have religion put in its place here.
 

Chris2wire

Senior member
Oct 20, 2004
419
0
0
Ive always wondered if these radicals were simply unevolved.. Its an interesting concept.

They remind of caveman days and things like that. The barbaric nature and the primitive actions.

Its quite possible that although mankind evolved, that certain races were left behind due to their lack of experience within society and civilization.

Perhaps our wars against them are pointless... Afterall, attacking a wolf may scare it off but its still an animalistic killer, no matter how hard you beat it or send it running, its primitive nature will bring it back for more.

Interesting concept.
 

walrus

Golden Member
Dec 18, 2000
1,544
13
81
If foreigners invaded the US and pushed us all into a few states where they controlled water supply, food, telephone, TV and everything else. Someone from another country speaking a different language living in your home without paying for it, taking over your job. Every year taking more land, bombing homes, cars, people walking on the street. What would you do?
 

Chris2wire

Senior member
Oct 20, 2004
419
0
0
Id sit back and let them have the country - Because the only way theyd do that to us is if we were animals.

Just like we're doing to them right now.

Notice no one is doing it to us? Because we aren't the animals.
 

walrus

Golden Member
Dec 18, 2000
1,544
13
81
Originally posted by: Chris2wire
Id sit back and let them have the country - Because the only way theyd do that to us is if we were animals.

Just like we're doing to them right now.

Notice no one is doing it to us? Because we aren't the animals.

If you believe that ,and i'm sure you do, then you are an animal. And you would sit back and let them have the country.
You'd probably do very well collaborating, make a lot of money.
 

SampSon

Diamond Member
Jan 3, 2006
7,160
1
0
Yes, isn't that painfully clear by now?

In a nutshell, Hezbollah was formed to fight israel and remove them from the gaza strip and that 20 mile tract of land in Lebanon. They finally get what they want with Israel withdrawing from these areas and Hezbollah goes and conducts another act of war. Yea, a truely civilized group of people there.

Worthless, ignorant people (radicals). If you disagree I don't give a sh!t.
 

walrus

Golden Member
Dec 18, 2000
1,544
13
81
They are very willing to die fighting to defend their country, must be a very foreign concept to you.
 

SampSon

Diamond Member
Jan 3, 2006
7,160
1
0
Originally posted by: walrus
They are very willing to die fighting to defend their country, must be a very foreign concept to you.
I would have addressed you post a couple spots above this one, but it wasn't anywhere near worthly of an intelligible response.

Why is it there is such a small fraction of them willing to do this "noble" defending of their "country"? Please, entertain me.
 

piasabird

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
17,168
60
91
Almost all the States in the Muslim or Arab countries are run by dictators who rule by cruel force. By force and by oppressing the people they keep under their thumb. People like Bin Ladin, if he is still alive, want us to be muslims his way or to be dead. He is or was a meglomaniac who wants to rule the world.

He makes hitler look like a simpleton.

The only good trait is that Muslims do not have the ability to be victorious in battle. They are only good at chopping heads off of people and killing innocent civilians.
 

walrus

Golden Member
Dec 18, 2000
1,544
13
81
All Bin Ladin wanted was the US out of Saudi Arabia. You have some strange over inflated opinion of yourself if you think he or all those peasant farmers in Afghanistan or elsewhere in the Middle East gives a rats #zz about you. As soon as we stop interfering in their countries they will go back to farming and raising their families peacefuly.
There's no Muslim desire of world domination. That's all Washington BS.
 

Eeezee

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2005
9,923
0
0
Originally posted by: Injury
Originally posted by: Atheus
Originally posted by: jjessico
folks determined on killing others because of dumb things are heralded as heros and put in places of power
You mean like in the American war of independence?
You know, I hate posting in these threads because of the impending extreme opinions that always come up, but I'm tired of people comparing this war to the Revolutionary war.

Anyone that compares it in the light that terrorists and insurgents are just as right as the colonists doesn't know a freaking thing about the revolutionary war and what England was doing.

In fact, comparing the colonies and England to America and Iraq is practically the total f'ing opposite.

England was taxing the colonists unfairly, running a corrupt government, and giving the colonists no say in any of it. Any colonist who stood against the king was imprisioned, had their land seized and many other things. I can't even sum up in a paragraph the travesties against the colonists. They simply said we aren't going to take it anymore and declared independance.

In Iraq, the Iraqi government was the corrupt one. Why did Saddam Huessein have multiple palaces and all sorts of riches when the country was so poor? Saddam was giving his people no say in the governing of their country. The average Iraqi citizen has no way to rise up against the Iraqi military and its leaders. Iraqi lives by the rules that whoever has a gun makes the rules. Is it easy for you to sit at your computer as citizens of a nation where you can vote on your leader and say that this is fair?

So please, in all seriousness, explain to me how the colonists were savages. Yeah, by definition there were many acts of terrorism before and during the revolutionary war, but please explain how that compares to beheading travellers and civillians as an act of terror or humiliation is the same as throwing tea from a ship into the ocean. Please explain how a country fighting to give another country independence is so wrong that it justifies attacks on them. I'm not challenging you or anything, I really want to hear an opinion on this because I just can't grasp that viewpoint.

Should we really have sat back, watching... or lack therof, from the comfort of our thriving nation as Iraq constantly sets itself further behind? Should we stop sending aid to starving nations, stop giving support to countries that can't help themselves, or should we hold a double standard and refuse to help middle eastern nations because there are groups in that area that hate us, or because we needed to resort to force to solve a problem?

While I whole heartedly agree that we've been over there entirely to long, there's no point in packing up and leaving until the job is done. So many lives would have ended in vain if we just gave up. What members of the military joined under the precept that they would never have to go to war or die for a good cause?

Yeah, I'm 5 minutes from getting flamed to all hell by the dominant democratic and peace-loving force of this board, but I'm not kidding when I say I really can't grasp the concept and would like for you to explain it to me.
Summary: We don't like to pay taxes at all, so we're going to start a big war for our freedom from these taxes. In 100 years we're then goig to devise a tax system that is 10x less efficient and wrought with as much corruptions. But at least we get to be represented by the governemtn... until about 50 years ago. Equal representation is nothing more than a fairy tale in modern America :p

I'm not complaining about the state of affairs, but merely pointing out that the colonists really didn't have it that bad. They weren't terrorists, obviously, because they were fighting FOR their own people instead of AGAINST them. The modern terrorist will terrorize just about anyone, including the people they claim to protect.
 

Eeezee

Diamond Member
Jul 23, 2005
9,923
0
0
Originally posted by: walrus
All Bin Ladin wanted was the US out of Saudi Arabia. You have some strange over inflated opinion of yourself if you think he or all those peasant farmers in Afghanistan or elsewhere in the Middle East gives a rats #zz about you. As soon as we stop interfering in their countries they will go back to farming and raising their families peacefuly.
There's no Muslim desire of world domination. That's all Washington BS.
walrus wins the award for most ignorant post. No, America could withdraw all troops back to the homeland and we would still be threatened by terrorists. It would decrease the number of terrorists without a doubt, but many of these people want to destroy our way of life because they see it as a source of evil and corruption. They fight because they believe their cause is just, and us leaving them alone would simply justify their conviction, giving them the sense of victory and the potential for MORE victory.
 

CanOWorms

Lifer
Jul 3, 2001
12,404
1
0
Originally posted by: walrus
All Bin Ladin wanted was the US out of Saudi Arabia. You have some strange over inflated opinion of yourself if you think he or all those peasant farmers in Afghanistan or elsewhere in the Middle East gives a rats #zz about you. As soon as we stop interfering in their countries they will go back to farming and raising their families peacefuly.
There's no Muslim desire of world domination. That's all Washington BS.
No, he did not only want the US out of Saudi Arabia (and that decision is not solely based upon his opinion). His list of demands is ridiculous.
 

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