Are the dual core patches still required for XP SP2?

[duragezic]

edit: Very odd. All I did was restart my computer (did not make install any drivers or make any changes) and now CPU-Z shows 2 cores/2 threads, I have Set Affinity options and two CPU usage graphs in Task Manager.

Since the information on the AMD dual core driver, AMD dual core optimizer, and MS hotfix are so conflicting, I'll try without all of them until I notice problems or sluggish performance. I hear BF2 uses the RDTSC so I'll try that first.

I got my Opteron 165 in today. I was already running the newest August 2006 BIOS for my Epox 9NPA3 so I just removed the old chip and put in the new one. The BIOS correctly detected it. Currently running it at 300x9 = 2.7 ghz @ 1.35 V.

In the System Properties (from control panel), it says

Computer:
_Dual Core AMD Opteron
_Processor 165

In the device manager under 'Processors':
Dual Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 165
Dual Core AMD Opteron(tm) Processor 165

However, in CPU-Z v1.40 under Selection,
Processor #1 is in the pull-down box but that box is grayed out. next to that it says:
Cores 1____Threads 1

(although everything else in CPU-Z detects a dual core 165, and the cache numbers are all x2)

And finally, in Task Manager, the Performance tab does not have two separate grids for CPU Usage, only one, just like when I was running my opty 146. In addition, it is my understanding that when I right-click a process in Task Manager, I should have Affinity options. I have none... only the Set Priority that has always been there.

So... seems like XP detects the dual core CPU yet doesn't.

1) I've searched many threads here, on AMDZone, and XtremeSystems. I read conflicting information on what, if any, patches/drivers I need. Some say that they are no longer necessary, others say they are. People link to different links to AMD's driver/utility page, yet the contents are pretty much the same. What exactly do I need?

AMD Dual-Core Optimizer - Novemeber 2006
AMD Athlon? 64 X2 Dual Core Processor Driver for Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 Version (x86 and x64 exe) 1.3.2.16 - July 2006

or something else?

2) I also loaded Windows Update, as people have said there is a MS hotfix in WU now, but there was no such update found for me. Do I need:

Update for Windows XP (KB896256)
Install this update to fix a situation where your Windows-based system that supports processor power management features, and is equipped with multiple processors, may experience decreased performance.

??

3) My retail 165 came with the AMD heatpipe heatsink/fan, but it only appears to have two heatpipes. I bought a stock AMD heatpipe heatsink/fan on Ebay in 2006 as a cheap HSF for overclocking my Opteron 146, but the older one has four heatpipes. Is the older one I have better than the new one they ship?

4) In Speedfan, is the higher temp between Core and Temp1 considered to be most accurate CPU temp? At idle, Temp1 = 30 C and CPU = 40 C. While under Orthos load, the max temps seen are Temp1 = 42 C and Core = 54 C. Does this sound right for my clock speed, voltage, and stock HSF? My Artic Silver Ceramique is quite old and didn't spread that well so I might get some AS5. Also, not sure which AMD stock HSF I have is better (see question 3).

5) When I added another stick of RAM for 4x512, I was no longer able to run mem at 200/400mhz DDR. I read the memory controller can't handle it and has to use 166/333mhz DDR. However, I read that newer chips (E6 rev perhaps) and newer mobos can run 4x512 at 200/400mhz DDR, at 2T still. My 165 is a E6, yet my computer wouldn't post or wouldn't boot windows when I tried to run my 4x512 PC3200 memory at 200/400mhz DDR.

 

[xtknight]

It doesn't have to do with patches to fix time desync between the two cores. You need to switch to a multiprocessor HAL. There are ways to do that without reinstalling.

 

[duragezic]

xtknight: From what I read, I can just right-click in device manager and choose ACPI multiprocessor under Update Driver.

I still don't get it. Everything I read just has people linking to that stupid Xtremesystems thread with 5 steps to do. No one can justify why this or that patch/driver/registry key is done, other than "OS takes full advantage of your dual core" or "you gotta do them all, i got major performance increase". WTF?

 

[lamere]

I dont have to read much of this to say that when you install a new CPU, you need to re-install winsucks to get the right performance out of it.
You CANNOT go from an fx2 CPU and then drop in an opty and not expect performance issues.
Thats if you did that, since you didnt state what CPU you had in there before the opty.

Go to the amd page and look for this heading under the drivers utilities and updates section near the bottom:

"AMD Opteron? Processor with AMD PowerNow!? Technology Driver for Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 Version (x86 and x64 exe) 1.3.2.16"

You need to download this driver and install it. If you uninstall the old CPU driver you still might have issues, thats why a full winsucks reinstall is recommended.

You also need the M$ dual core hotfix to install. Dont bother with the dual core optimizer unless you have issues with studdering in games, as that fix is mainly for the X2 line of CPU's.

Those 2 are all you need CPU wise, along with a fresh install of winblows

 

[Markbnj]

Originally posted by: lamere
I dont have to read much of this to say that when you install a new CPU, you need to re-install winsucks to get the right performance out of it.
You CANNOT go from an fx2 CPU and then drop in an opty and not expect performance issues.
Thats if you did that, since you didnt state what CPU you had in there before the opty.

Go to the amd page and look for this heading under the drivers utilities and updates section near the bottom:

"AMD Opteron? Processor with AMD PowerNow!? Technology Driver for Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 Version (x86 and x64 exe) 1.3.2.16"

You need to download this driver and install it. If you uninstall the old CPU driver you still might have issues, thats why a full winsucks reinstall is recommended.

You also need the M$ dual core hotfix to install. Dont bother with the dual core optimizer unless you have issues with studdering in games, as that fix is mainly for the X2 line of CPU's.

Those 2 are all you need CPU wise, along with a fresh install of winblows

You don't need to reinstall Windows to get proper performance out of a new CPU. If you switch to a dual core from a single core then you do need the right HAL installed, and in most cases Windows will take care of this automatically if the BIOS properly reports the multiple cores. In earlier 939 boards for AMD you sometimes had to update the BIOS so that it would recognize the CPU, and then Windows would do its thing. In rarer cases people have had to tell Windows explictly to use the proper HAL.

So all you need are the correct updated BIOS, the correct chipset drivers, and the optimize patch for AMD dual cores. This patch synchronizes the hi-res timers in the two cores, and affects many applications, not just games. For example, you may see stuttering when zooming in Google Earth, and you may have problems fast forwarding or rewinding in a video player application.

The MS hotfix referred to dealt with another problem, that involved the behavior of the two cores in specific power-saving modes. I doubt many people need it.

 

[lamere]

I'm just stating my own experience going from an AMD X2 4400+ to an opty 185
It does depend on the CPU you are replacing 100% because X2's require the X2 drivers which conflict with the opteron drivers.
I switched them out and got horrible performance from the opty and was immediately regretting the purchase.
I read up some and everyone said you need to reinstall winblows to get the best performance.
I did and havent looked back, now that i did that i dont regret anything.

 

[duragezic]

I upgraded from a Opteron 146.

Without doing anything on my behalf (except a restart after the initial boot with the new chip), XP detected two entries of Opteron 165 under Processors in Device Manager, under Computer in Device Manager I have 'ACPI Multiprocessor PC', and my task manager has a graph for each core. I did have the most recent BIOS (likely the last, as Epox is basically gone) so that could be part of the reason why it was painless.

I have the Opteron driver from AMD as well as the dual core optimizer patch. The optimizer patch is not listed under the Opteron, only the X2, but if they sync the hires timers, well it should apply to both as they are pretty much identical processors. I do not have either installed yet. Just as a test, I used the Speed Up Playback/Speed Down playback in Media Player Classic, and it started to struggle and freeze a bit. I never used that feature before, so it might just not work that well.

I'll test out some games or other apps and if I have any problems, I will install the driver and/or the optimizer. I don't get what those things do, as people also recommend the MS hotfix, the registry key added, and the /usepmtimer argument in boot.ini. Most people just tell you to do them all, but I have a feeling there is some overlap between doing all that or something.

 

[Markbnj]

Originally posted by: lamere
I'm just stating my own experience going from an AMD X2 4400+ to an opty 185
It does depend on the CPU you are replacing 100% because X2's require the X2 drivers which conflict with the opteron drivers.
I switched them out and got horrible performance from the opty and was immediately regretting the purchase.
I read up some and everyone said you need to reinstall winblows to get the best performance.
I did and havent looked back, now that i did that i dont regret anything.

Yeah, I'm not surprised that there are specific cases on specific combinations of hardware and drivers. But the general case is that XP figures out what the new setup is as long as the BIOS correctly reports the hardware. When I first put together my 939-based X2 system Windows showed only one core. I had to flash the BIOS to get it to recognize both cores.