Apple: We like that app so much we're going to BAN it and then copy it as a feature.

[MotionMan]

Why does apple? What special privilege does apple have to do something that MS cant. Why doesn't the FTC go after apple now like it went after MS?

Because, from the start, this is how Apple set up the iOS ecosystem. If Apple tried the same thing with OSX, they could find themselves in trouble. They have to tread lightly in the OSX App Store.

It's called Windows.

Been there. I still have to work there. Not the happiest place on earth, to be sure. But to each their own.

Correct.

They did not try probably because they never thought of it. Did anyone think of it before Apple?

Damn true. I blame the EU courts and korea for fucking up for the rest of us.

Because the system was not set up properly for MS to take the actions they tried. Apple seems to have nailed it with the iOS App store.

MotionMan

 

[YoungGun21]

They did not try probably because they never thought of it. Did anyone think of it before Apple?

MotionMan

This has to be my second favorite quote of all time.

I'll probably even quote this post several more times this thread.

Of course, nobody thought of it before Apple did, how could they? Apple hadn't invented stealing apps yet, so nobody could copy it. Right?

 

[MotionMan]

This has to be my second favorite quote of all time.

I'll probably even quote this post several more times this thread.

Of course, nobody thought of it before Apple did, how could they? Apple hadn't invented stealing apps yet, so nobody could copy it. Right?

I am not sure you understand what the "it" is referring to in my quote, Mr. Clinton.

MotionMan

 

[YoungGun21]

They did not try probably because they never thought of it. Did anyone think of it before Apple?


MotionMan

Oh, sure I know what was quoted. You are talking about how M$ could have never thought of anything before Apple did. Clear enough?

You seriously think that if they wanted to, they wouldn't be able to figure out how to do it?

The difference in MS coming out with their own AV and AAPL stealing apps from developers is that MS doesn't do it to make money. They didn't steal the idea from anyone. It isn't like they there aren't already a million other AV options out there. With Apple, they blocked the only other choice, then implemented the feature.

I hope there is a lawsuit here.

 

[cheezy321]

Do anyone on here believe that a company has a right to explicitly ignore the rules set up in the iOS developer agreement with no fear of repercussions? Everyone seems to be blatantly ignoring this gigantic piece of information.

The Camera+ app did something they were explicitly not allowed to do. Apple banned them. They removed the functionality that was explicitly not allowed. The app was allowed back on the App store. Plain and simple the Camera+ app did something that they specifically said the app would not do when they signed the developer agreement. Does anyone argue this fact?

Sure, apple stole that functionality and baked it right into the OS. Yes, that is fucked up. The only reason it got banned was not because apple was stealing it and putting it into their own OS. It was banned because it included functionality that was not allowed.

The only difference between apple and the others who do this (google, microsoft, etc) is Apple promoted it as a feature and the others did not. So, according to a lot of the apple haters in here, its ok to steal, as long as you don't promote it as a feature? Apple made no claims that they invented the functionality, they just promoted it as a feature. Apparently this is what most people have a beef with?

 

[you2]

Can't say if this is illegal or not as I'm not a lawyer; but it is a practice that I dislike and so I voted and choose to not use IOS devices. Luckily there are alternatives.
-
In microsoft case they broke the law (or so the court system has decided).
-
Anyways part of the problem here is the legal system has become excessively complex and often moves well beyond what a layman like myself would consider common sense.
-
Since there are currently viable alternatives; if you don't like how apple behaves vote with your wallet (btw: i think apple has nice devices: i just don"t like their practices; not to say that google is an angel; they aren't).

 

[cheezy321]

Oh, sure I know what was quoted. You are talking about how M$ could have never thought of anything before Apple did. Clear enough?

You seriously think that if they wanted to, they wouldn't be able to figure out how to do it?

The difference in MS coming out with their own AV and AAPL stealing apps from developers is that MS doesn't do it to make money. They didn't steal the idea from anyone. It isn't like they there aren't already a million other AV options out there. With Apple, they blocked the only other choice, then implemented the feature.

I hope there is a lawsuit here.

Jesus christ man, you try so hard to mock anyone who is even remotely seen as defending apple.

So the reason apple banned the app was because they wanted to bake it into their own OS? Not because it was blatantly doing something that was not allowed in the app store? Please tell me you actually think this. You are sounding like a 9/11 truther.

 

[MotionMan]

Oh, sure I know what was quoted. You are talking about how M$ could have never thought of anything before Apple did. Clear enough?

You got it wrong. That is definitely not what I said. You want to try again, or do I have to pull all the preceding quotes for you?

You seriously think that if they wanted to, they wouldn't be able to figure out how to do it?

I did not say that. Obviously, it is possible to do from a technical standpoint. I do not think MS could do it now because of the legal ramifications.

The difference in MS coming out with their own AV and AAPL stealing apps from developers is that MS doesn't do it to make money. They didn't steal the idea from anyone.

Really? Really? Wow. What color is the sky in your world?

MotionMan

 

[poofyhairguy]

So, according to a lot of the apple haters in here, its ok to steal, as long as you don't promote it as a feature? Apple made no claims that they invented the functionality, they just promoted it as a feature. Apparently this is what most people have a beef with?

You got it.

It is not Apple's actions that make them such a polarizing company. Many tech companies do the same or worse with much less scrutiny. The issue with Apple is that in its arrogance it cranks out copied functionality and treats it like some great idea they invented (implied never stated) or that didn't matter before they did it.

That is the fuel to the flamewars.

 

[smartpatrol]

Wow MotionMan. It's pretty hilarious that you would whine about how this thread belongs in the All Things Apple section, and in the very same post try to derail this thread and make it about Microsoft.

 

[MotionMan]

Wow MotionMan. It's pretty hilarious that you would whine about how this thread belongs in the All Things Apple section, and in the very same post try to derail this thread and make it about Microsoft.

No. I am pointing out that all the whining about Apple is ridiculous because other companies, like MS, do (or would do) the same thing. The thread is about Apple. My comparisons include MS (the company most like Apple in this regard).

MotionMan

 

[YoungGun21]

You got it wrong. That is definitely not what I said. You want to try again, or do I have to pull all the preceding quotes for you?



I did not say that. Obviously, it is possible to do from a technical standpoint. I do not think MS could do it now because of the legal ramifications.



Really? Really? Wow. What color is the sky in your world?

MotionMan

But... you did say that. Check it.

They did not try, because they either did not think of it or could not figure out how to do it. MotionMan

And last time I checked M$ Live Essentials was free. Not that I would recommend anyone actually use it.

@Cheezy, I mock people who make outrageous, idiotic, nonfactual statements. It just usually comes from people in the Apple cult. I also mock truthers, deathers, birthers, and people who like justin beiber.

 

[cheezy321]

Answer my question Youngun. I want to know if you actually believe this:

The reason apple banned the app was because they wanted to bake it into their own OS? Not because it was blatantly doing something that was not allowed in the app store? So do you believe this or not?

 

[MotionMan]

But... you did say that. Check it.

Originally Posted by MotionMan
They did not try, because they either did not think of it or could not figure out how to do it. MotionMan

Except that you misunderstood my quote. Check it:

Oh, sure I know what was quoted. You are talking about how M$ could have never thought of anything before Apple did. Clear enough?

I said that MS did not think of it before Apple did. Do you have any idea what "it" is? (I love how you keep using "M$".)

And last time I checked M$ Live Essentials was free. Not that I would recommend anyone actually use it.

MS created an open ecosystem where developers could develop basically anything they wanted and MS did little to allow or prevent any programs to be installed in Windows. Over time, MS took some of the better ideas and integrated them into Windows (and charged for updates to Windows). Because the ecosystem did not allow them to ban competing programs, in some cases, MS used underhanded or illegal means to try and promote their version of the idea in Windows. In one well-known example, MS added an anti-virus to Windows in direct competition to an entire software industry.

Apple created a closed ecosystem where developers could not develop anything they wanted because Apple had strict and well-known rules that limited the types of Apps that would be allowed in the App Store. Two of these limitations were that Apps could not copy a feature already in iOS and Apps could not alter how the hard buttons worked. Over time, Apple took some of the better ideas and integrated them into iOS (and provided iOS updates for free). Because the ecosystem allowed them to ban competing programs, Apple used straight-forward, contracted-for means to promote their version of the idea in iOS. In one well-known example, Apple made it so that one could use the hard button to take a picture in direct competition with one App that they required to remove that feature.

I am not for Apple or against MS. I am trying to show you that they are not that different. Again, I am not saying that Apple is "good". It is clear, however, that Apple is not nearly as "bad" as people are trying to make it out to be and certainly does not warrant this thread regarding Camera+.

MotionMan

 

[you2]

I think you are rewriting history as to what MS did; lets not forget the famous lines their applications displayed at startup if the os was not MS os; or the hidden apis that only MS applications could use; or ....
-
Anyways I find the discussion amusing and a bit tainted.

Except that you misunderstood my quote. Check it:



I said that MS did not think of it before Apple did. Do you have any idea what "it" is? (I love how you keep using "M$".)



MS created an open ecosystem where developers could develop basically anything they wanted and MS did little to allow or prevent any programs to be installed in Windows. Over time, MS took some of the better ideas and integrated them into Windows (and charged for updates to Windows). Because the ecosystem did not allow them to ban competing programs, in some cases, MS used underhanded or illegal means to try and promote their version of the idea in Windows. In one well-known example, MS added an anti-virus to Windows in direct competition to an entire software industry.

Apple created a closed ecosystem where developers could not develop anything they wanted because Apple had strict and well-known rules that limited the types of Apps that would be allowed in the App Store. Two of these limitations were that Apps could not copy a feature already in iOS and Apps could not alter how the hard buttons worked. Over time, Apple took some of the better ideas and integrated them into iOS (and provided iOS updates for free). Because the ecosystem allowed them to ban competing programs, Apple used straight-forward, contracted-for means to promote their version of the idea in iOS. In one well-known example, Apple made it so that one could use the hard button to take a picture in direct competition with one App that they required to remove that feature.

I am not for Apple or against MS. I am trying to show you that they are not that different. Again, I am not saying that Apple is "good". It is clear, however, that Apple is not nearly as "bad" as people are trying to make it out to be and certainly does not warrant this thread regarding Camera+.

MotionMan

 

[MotionMan]

I think you are rewriting history as to what MS did; lets not forget the famous lines their applications displayed at startup if the os was not MS os; or the hidden apis that only MS applications could use; or ....
-
Anyways I find the discussion amusing and a bit tainted.

I was purposely being generous with MS actions (or alleged actions).

MotionMan

 

[ultimatebob]

Hopefully, the Camera+ developer "saw the light" and started developing for the Android platform instead.

Sure, he'll have a whole bunch of additional platforms to support, but none of THOSE platform makers are going to outlaw his product just because it has a superior feature.

 

[RobertPters77]

They did not try probably because they never thought of it. Did anyone think of it before Apple?

Yes.

Xerox
Audio Highway
Nokia
Microsoft

The list goes on and on.

 

[RobertPters77]

I was purposely being generous with MS actions (or alleged actions).

That reminds me. Anyone heard any good crazy MS rumors lately?

I've got one.

Microsoft and the US Govt are in cahoots to develop a virus to take down Iran and NK's nuclear programs.

 

[Pliablemoose]

The WiFi sync app earned 500 K, the camera app folks earned 9 million iirc...

 

[MotionMan]

Hopefully, the Camera+ developer "saw the light" and started developing for the Android platform instead.

Sure, he'll have a whole bunch of additional platforms to support, but none of THOSE platform makers are going to outlaw his product just because it has a superior feature.

There is some irony in the fact that you do not know that the developer of Camera+ is a woman.

MotionMan

 

[MotionMan]

Yes.

Xerox
Audio Highway
Nokia
Microsoft

The list goes on and on.

What is the "it" of which you speak?

MotionMan

 

[kubani1]

Nope. If this was MS they'ed be sued and the goddamn apple zealots would preach over how apple is such an awesome company and would never do such a thing.

true, but instead apple got called out on shady standard practice and the Apple haters are trying to roast Apple alive. (pretty damn similar to those damn apply fanboys isn't it?)

but who really cares, believing that any successful company doesn't steal ideas, and doesn't give credit all the time means you are stary eyed and naive, grow up and welcome to the real world.

 

[YoungGun21]

Answer my question Youngun. I want to know if you actually believe this:

The reason apple banned the app was because they wanted to bake it into their own OS? Not because it was blatantly doing something that was not allowed in the app store? So do you believe this or not?

Basically, yes. Apple doesn't let devs remap buttons, but then when they see a remap that is good, they ban the app and put it in for themselves. Even if Apple thought of it first (lol thanks again MM for that quote), they banned the app to eliminate competition. Competition which probably would have done a better job at it, in my opinion anyway. Third party devs usually get things right, this is true for any platform and company.

It isn't allowed on the app store (sorry, should I capitalize that? I'm not sure if it is trademarked or not.), but it is perfectly ok for the company to do? There are problems when the features you implement in a new version of your OS would actually get that OS banned from your own app store.

 

[ChAoTiCpInOy]

Basically, yes. Apple doesn't let devs remap buttons, but then when they see a remap that is good, they ban the app and put it in for themselves. Even if Apple thought of it first (lol thanks again MM for that quote), they banned the app to eliminate competition. Competition which probably would have done a better job at it, in my opinion anyway. Third party devs usually get things right, this is true for any platform and company.

It isn't allowed on the app store (sorry, should I capitalize that? I'm not sure if it is trademarked or not.), but it is perfectly ok for the company to do? There are problems when the features you implement in a new version of your OS would actually get that OS banned from your own app store.

Is the fact that they banned easter eggs and remapping buttons and that Camera+ did both those things just being ignored by everyone?