Apple patent games continue

[Brian Stirling]

Now that Apple appears to be getting ready to offer a phone with a curved screen they have been granted a patent for it.

http://venturebeat.com/2013/12/10/a...le-scores-a-patent-for-curved-touch-surfaces/

How long before they sue Samsung for having a phone with a curved screen? The SGNexus I had, still have actually, had a curved screen more than 2 years ago.

The patent appear to be for the curved touch screen, but of course, if you have a curved screen and it has a touch screen then it has a curved touch screen.

You gotta admit, Apple pioneers the most innovative tech around...


Brian

 

[openwheel]

You are just bitter that Samsung got spanked in the last round.

 

[foghorn67]

They won't get anywhere with it.

 

[Zaap]

How did Samsung get spanked? Public perception wise (really all that matters in the end) is that Samsung is #1 or #2 and that Apple is running scared of them. Even the 1bil payout was turned into something of a legend in favor of Samsung. Apple is seen by many non-rabid fans as the greedier company and all their legal shenanigans hasn't helped that image one bit.

 

[bearxor]

Yeah, dammit Apple! If you had filed this patent three years ago, maybe people wouldn't be up in such arms about it since there weren't any curved touchscreen devices on the market then!

Oh, wait...

 

[Brian Stirling]

You are just bitter that Samsung got spanked in the last round.

My current phones are an HTC One and ... wait for it ... an iPhone 5S.


Apple has a team of very clever lawyers and have managed to word the patent applications in a way that obscures what they're trying to do. More importantly, Apple has been exploiting their reputation for innovation and have been granted patents for things that should not be patentable. The courts that hear these cases seem to be smitten by Apple and not just in San Jose.


Samsung has, like just about every other company, seen what others are doing and jumped into the game with there version which, in the beginning, was very similar to the other guys. This is not new and not limited to handheld gadgets. Chrysler invented the minivan and every other car maker jumped in with there own versions of it. Same in every industry.

Apple doesn't mind borrowing other peoples ideas but they go the step further of attempting to patent the idea long after others have products based on the idea. Once again, Apple has exploited there reputation for innovation and seem to be able to convince courts that they invented an idea that's demonstrably been around for a long time before them.


Brian

 

[deathBOB]

Now that Apple appears to be getting ready to offer a phone with a curved screen they have been granted a patent for it.

http://venturebeat.com/2013/12/10/a...le-scores-a-patent-for-curved-touch-surfaces/

How long before they sue Samsung for having a phone with a curved screen? The SGNexus I had, still have actually, had a curved screen more than 2 years ago.

The patent appear to be for the curved touch screen, but of course, if you have a curved screen and it has a touch screen then it has a curved touch screen.

You gotta admit, Apple pioneers the most innovative tech around...


Brian

Did you bother to read your own article OP?

It describes a new way of building a touch panel that could eventually be used in future iPhones, iPads, touch mice, and other gadgets. According to the patent, one technique involves laying a touch panel over a flexible substrate while it’s flat, which is then joined together with a second, curved flexible substrate.

While the technique may be unique to Apple, both LG and Samsung have already released curved screen smartphones of their own. And, no, there’s still no clear reason why you’d want a curved smartphone.

Apple’s patent also shows a way that it can use a flat touch panel right under a curved glass display (which may be cheaper to produce, but likely won’t make for accurate touch interaction).

Unless their process is the same, LG and Samsung have nothing to fear.

 

[Ravynmagi]

I'm sure LG and Samsung have their own curved screen patents.

 

[openwheel]

My current phones are an HTC One and ... wait for it ... an iPhone 5S.


Apple has a team of very clever lawyers and have managed to word the patent applications in a way that obscures what they're trying to do. More importantly, Apple has been exploiting their reputation for innovation and have been granted patents for things that should not be patentable. The courts that hear these cases seem to be smitten by Apple and not just in San Jose.


Samsung has, like just about every other company, seen what others are doing and jumped into the game with there version which, in the beginning, was very similar to the other guys. This is not new and not limited to handheld gadgets. Chrysler invented the minivan and every other car maker jumped in with there own versions of it. Same in every industry.

Apple doesn't mind borrowing other peoples ideas but they go the step further of attempting to patent the idea long after others have products based on the idea. Once again, Apple has exploited there reputation for innovation and seem to be able to convince courts that they invented an idea that's demonstrably been around for a long time before them.


Brian

I am with you. Just wanted to give you a hard time

 

[PowerYoga]

Unless their process is the same, LG and Samsung have nothing to fear.

History says nope. I see apple using this against LG and Samsung and any other phone makers even when the processes are completely different, in hopes that another ignorant judge like koh will come along so they can regain their lost market share through litigation instead of innovation.

 

[Oyeve]

Yay. Apple will have a 4" curved screen. whoopdiefuckindoo. Still useless.

 

[Brian Stirling]

Did you bother to read your own article OP?



Unless their process is the same, LG and Samsung have nothing to fear.

Yes I did read the article wise ass...

The problem is no matter what the underlying tech is or how similar or different it may be from what Samsung/LG/Other has used, Apple will attempt to convince the courts that they own curved screen devices and, sadly, the courts tend to lap up whatever Apple says.


Brian

 

[poofyhairguy]

Yay. Apple will have a 4" curved screen. whoopdiefuckindoo. Still useless.

No way. They have to go bigger next round.

 

[Oyeve]

No way. They have to go bigger next round.

ok, ok, 4.3 inches. Because, well, just because. Actually, I bet they will have a 4.93" screen with the same width, so as to not have to make all of their followers have to buy all new bose speakers and such.

 

[deathBOB]

Yes I did read the article wise ass...

The problem is no matter what the underlying tech is or how similar or different it may be from what Samsung/LG/Other has used, Apple will attempt to convince the courts that they own curved screen devices and, sadly, the courts tend to lap up whatever Apple says.


Brian

So your argument is that no matter whether the patent is valid or invalid, Apple will use it to attack other companies and will win because the federal judiciary is in its pocket? The federal judiciary that handles millions of cases each year and decides on issues of national importance? And they're willing to ignore the rule of law just to help Apple (who you don't like) win patent cases against other companies (which you do like)?

I think you live in a fantasy world.

 

[cheezy321]

So your argument is that no matter whether the patent is valid or invalid, Apple will use it to attack other companies and will win because the federal judiciary is in its pocket? The federal judiciary that handles millions of cases each year and decides on incredibly important issues of national importance? And they're willing to ignore the rule of law just to help Apple (who you don't like) win patent cases against other companies (which you do like)?

I think you live in a fantasy world.

Don't try arguing with the Apple haters. They actually believe the stuff they say. Yep, Apple owns the entire court system in the whole world. Thats why Samsung still hasn't won any case of any significance against apple.

If you want to talk about being a dick company, why don't we talk about Samsung using standard-essential patents in their lawsuits against Apple and competitors? Talk about abuse of your position.

http://www.t3.com/news/eu-fires-warning-shot-across-samsungs-bow

Don't see any posts about this? Oh yeah, that's because it puts this forums favorite quasi-government corporation in a bad light.

 

[foghorn67]

Don't try arguing with the Apple haters. They actually believe the stuff they say. Yep, Apple owns the entire court system in the whole world. Thats why Samsung still hasn't won any case of any significance against apple.

If you want to talk about being a dick company, why don't we talk about Samsung using standard-essential patents in their lawsuits against Apple and competitors? Talk about abuse of your position.

http://www.t3.com/news/eu-fires-warning-shot-across-samsungs-bow

Don't see any posts about this? Oh yeah, that's because it puts this forums favorite quasi-government corporation in a bad light.

You have to admit both use the same shady East Texas circuit that is just dirty, dirty, dirty.

 

[Brian Stirling]

So your argument is that no matter whether the patent is valid or invalid, Apple will use it to attack other companies and will win because the federal judiciary is in its pocket? The federal judiciary that handles millions of cases each year and decides on issues of national importance? And they're willing to ignore the rule of law just to help Apple (who you don't like) win patent cases against other companies (which you do like)?

I think you live in a fantasy world.

It's not a question of whether the court is in Apples pocket it's that they've used their reputation as an innovator to bamboozle courts into thinking they invented stuff that's been around for a long time. How else do you explain Apple being granted a patent on rounded corners.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/7/3614506/apple-patents-rectangle-with-rounded-corners

Handheld devices have had rounded corners for, not years or decades but centuries yet a court granted them a patent on rounded corners.

This is no fantasy world -- and Apple has been the predominant predator of unjustified patents.

Other companies, like Samsung, have used what they had as a buttress against Apples monopolistic practices and have similarly abused the patent system. Samsungs defensively predatory legal moves are bad but are the result of Apples attempt to block them from being in the same sandbox.


Brian

 

[dguy6789]

Don't try arguing with the Apple haters. They actually believe the stuff they say. Yep, Apple owns the entire court system in the whole world. Thats why Samsung still hasn't won any case of any significance against apple.

If you want to talk about being a dick company, why don't we talk about Samsung using standard-essential patents in their lawsuits against Apple and competitors? Talk about abuse of your position.

http://www.t3.com/news/eu-fires-warning-shot-across-samsungs-bow

Don't see any posts about this? Oh yeah, that's because it puts this forums favorite quasi-government corporation in a bad light.

How can you defend Apple? They think they own pinch to zoom.

 

[cheezy321]

It's not a question of whether the court is in Apples pocket it's that they've used their reputation as an innovator to bamboozle courts into thinking they invented stuff that's been around for a long time. How else do you explain Apple being granted a patent on rounded corners.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/7/3614506/apple-patents-rectangle-with-rounded-corners

Handheld devices have had rounded corners for, not years or decades but centuries yet a court granted them a patent on rounded corners.

This is no fantasy world -- and Apple has been the predominant predator of unjustified patents.

Other companies, like Samsung, have used what they had as a buttress against Apples monopolistic practices and have similarly abused the patent system. Samsungs defensively predatory legal moves are bad but are the result of Apples attempt to block them from being in the same sandbox.


Brian

I think history actually has proven why apple is so adamant about the look and feel of their product. First off, lets not be dense about this conversation. It was never just about 'rounded corners'. Only people with blinders on think about this argument in those terms.

The iPhone has had basically the same look and feel since its inception 5.5 years ago. You can say it has pretty much the exact since look and feel since the iPhone 4. They had it planned this way from the start. That is why Apple got so pissed when Samsung came along and slavishly copied the look and feel of the iPhone. They had an iconic look that they were (and still are) going to stick with for the foreseeable future. Almost 6 years since the announcement the iPhone looks very similar to the first model.

I think samsung has moved on now and made their own unique phone with a unique look. However, you can't seriously look at touchwiz on the SGS and the SGS2 and say they didnt model it after the iPhone. You can't look at the SGS or the SGS2 and say they didn't try and copy the design of the iPhone. Their copycat style got their mobile products off to a great start. Now their products (SGS3, SGS4, Note2, note3) can stand on their own and are unique in their own way. They don't need to copy apple anymore. They are trying to innovate on their own instead of copying a market leader.

Samsung not only has abused the patent system, they have made a joke of FRAND patents and intentionally abused their position in the entire system. They have held their competitors for ransom. They have tried to charge intentionally ludicrous rates. They willfully do whatever the hell they want because they know nobody in their home country will ever turn on them. They own S. Korea and they know it.

I am not saying Apple is a saint in this. But what Samsung is doing and what Apple has done are entirely different things. Samsung is taking patents they agreed to share at a reasonable rate and using it to hold their competitors for ransom. Apple is telling their competitors not to copy their patents, no matter how dubious or broad they may seem.

 

[deathBOB]

It's not a question of whether the court is in Apples pocket it's that they've used their reputation as an innovator to bamboozle courts into thinking they invented stuff that's been around for a long time.

Please, show me where courts have cited Apple's "reputation as an innovator" to uphold their patents.

How else do you explain Apple being granted a patent on rounded corners.

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/7/3614506/apple-patents-rectangle-with-rounded-corners

Handheld devices have had rounded corners for, not years or decades but centuries yet a court granted them a patent on rounded corners.

This is no fantasy world -- and Apple has been the predominant predator of unjustified patents.

Other companies, like Samsung, have used what they had as a buttress against Apples monopolistic practices and have similarly abused the patent system. Samsungs defensively predatory legal moves are bad but are the result of Apples attempt to block them from being in the same sandbox.


Brian

Ah, I see the problem now: you don't know how patents work. Patents are issued by the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office, but that's not conclusive proof of their validity. Only when a company sues another for infringement and the defendant raises the defense of invalidity does a court weigh in on whether the patent was valid. So no, a court has not "granted" Apple a patent on rounded corners.

Given these basic misconceptions, how are we supposed to take your other claims seriously?

 

[WelshBloke]

I'm sure LG and Samsung have their own curved screen patents.

It'll be interesting because it would be LG or Samsung making the screens for Apple won't it?

 

[Oyeve]

Ug, this thread has been done to death many times over.

 

[Brian Stirling]

I think history actually has proven why apple is so adamant about the look and feel of their product. First off, lets not be dense about this conversation. It was never just about 'rounded corners'. Only people with blinders on think about this argument in those terms.

The iPhone has had basically the same look and feel since its inception 5.5 years ago. You can say it has pretty much the exact since look and feel since the iPhone 4. They had it planned this way from the start. That is why Apple got so pissed when Samsung came along and slavishly copied the look and feel of the iPhone. They had an iconic look that they were (and still are) going to stick with for the foreseeable future. Almost 6 years since the announcement the iPhone looks very similar to the first model.

I think samsung has moved on now and made their own unique phone with a unique look. However, you can't seriously look at touchwiz on the SGS and the SGS2 and say they didnt model it after the iPhone. You can't look at the SGS or the SGS2 and say they didn't try and copy the design of the iPhone. Their copycat style got their mobile products off to a great start. Now their products (SGS3, SGS4, Note2, note3) can stand on their own and are unique in their own way. They don't need to copy apple anymore. They are trying to innovate on their own instead of copying a market leader.

Samsung not only has abused the patent system, they have made a joke of FRAND patents and intentionally abused their position in the entire system. They have held their competitors for ransom. They have tried to charge intentionally ludicrous rates. They willfully do whatever the hell they want because they know nobody in their home country will ever turn on them. They own S. Korea and they know it.

I am not saying Apple is a saint in this. But what Samsung is doing and what Apple has done are entirely different things. Samsung is taking patents they agreed to share at a reasonable rate and using it to hold their competitors for ransom. Apple is telling their competitors not to copy their patents, no matter how dubious or broad they may seem.

I think Samsung didn't know how to deal with the aggressive patent trolling that Apple launched with prime focus on Samsung. What did they have to counter Apple -- yep, that's what they used. In most other industries against most other companies Samsung et al would not have had to deal with the monopolistic legal war Apple has waged.

The thing is, when Sammy uses those Frandish patents in the counter suits they almost always fail. Apples success in this game means they will continue doing it. The interesting thing is, although Apple has been granted patents for things that should not have been granted and they've won the majority of the suits they've filed, they haven't actually been able to push Samsung out of the handheld device market and that must really chap there *ss.


Brian

 

[Brian Stirling]

Please, show me where courts have cited Apple's "reputation as an innovator" to uphold their patents.



Ah, I see the problem now: you don't know how patents work. Patents are issued by the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office, but that's not conclusive proof of their validity. Only when a company sues another for infringement and the defendant raises the defense of invalidity does a court weigh in on whether the patent was valid. So no, a court has not "granted" Apple a patent on rounded corners.

Given these basic misconceptions, how are we supposed to take your other claims seriously?

Apple hasn't used their "reputation" in any legal filing, they don't have to, the effect of that reputation permeate the proceedings even though no briefs are filed stating it.

So Apple hasn't been granted a patent on rounded corners, what's this then?

Patent #: D670,286

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/1701443/USD670286S1.pdf


Brian