apoppin re-evaluates nvidia [Formerly nm] ... back to x1950p

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Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
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0
Originally posted by: CaiNaM
Originally posted by: Gstanfor
You can try putting nvidia's G7x and nv4x AA modes down some more when ATi actually delivers supersampling AA (without resorting to backfire) and Transparency AA that uses SS that actually works...

apparently you're once again having a different conversation that i am. this isn't about ati vs nvidia, nor was i putting nv's AA down at all.

you, otoh... sure.

lets watch the slideshow if FEAR when running SSAA at any res - let alone "hi res" as you claim. useful for a laugh, perhaps.

8800GTX/GTS is another story entirely, which is my point.

slideshow this!
Thats 7900 GT 512mb 8xS @ 1280x960 - the native resolutions of most 19" crt's & lcds...

Granted the nv40 will not perform well at all at the same resolution (bear in mind it is in a socket a system with half the memory also)
nv40 1280x960
But at 800x600 it is very playable. There is no shame in reducing resolution on older cards, especially when the game is younger than the card. The 8xs grants better IQ than 1024x786 with 4xAA.
nv40 800x600
 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
3,261
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I am continually amused by people who like Sapphire products and talk them up...
Then apparently you're amused by Anandtech for "talking up"' the Sapphire card in this article - Click
Anandtech
For those who absolutely must have an X1900 XTX, their choice should be fairly clear. At $580, the Sapphire X1900 XTX is the cheapest, and also gets more-or-less the highest overclock of the three.
A quick look at their tables here show that the Sapphire cards out-performed other brands.

So if the people you're seeing "talk Sapphire products up" are Anandtech's own reviewers, then perhaps you should include the reasons as to why they are doing so.
70% of all ATi cards manufactured are manufactured in factories a lot worse than most nvidia cards are buiolt in...
I don't remember a recent ATi refresh having artifacts at stock frequencies. (a.k.a. The 7900's when they first arrived.) Their cards are typically solid. The way they launch them...not so much. Every manufacturer has their bad apples. As does every forum... *cough*
 

postmortemIA

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2006
7,721
40
91
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: postmortemIA
appopin,

sorry for your luck.

My Sapphire X1950Pro works just fine.

If you have to buy PSU, wouldn't it be cheaper to get 939 mobo + CPU + 7600GT PCI-e?

bastage !

:p

rub it in
:confused:


then throw salt into the *wound*
:Q

and snicker
:evil:


:shocked:

you sure know how to hurt a guy by stating the *obvious* :p




sure ... 20/20 HINDsight ;)

:laugh:

but NOW ... i am 'in' too *deep* :(
:brokenheart:




Seriously ... i can only try and rescue the situation

IF i keep my x1950p - and there is a GOOD chance i will sell it when it comes back from Sapphire IF the 7800GS works at least as well as my x850xt - then i will buy a beefy PS for my NEXT rig right away ... something to run sli next year

. . . and i will use it NOW to power my x1950p when i return my GS for $210 "credit" toward a PS

OK?


it makes sense to me
:confused:

You see, next year i am doing the *complete makeover* ... so it doesn't matter which GPU i keep or if i upgrade the PS now or later ... it ALL *depends* on what i think of the 7800gs [and you gotta remember it is $210-$50MIR=$160, if i keep it]

and i was kidding about the *B* nonsense word ... i remember a movie with it

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I have fine and spare 6800 Ultra (AGP of course) by BFG. I tried to sell it locally, no luck.

:D

Based on your luck, I guess it could come handy if Sapphire craps on me too.

Yeah, mine has two minor issues: with cold booting, won't bot every once in a while. And when I run 1600x1200 1:1 mapping on my 1920x1200 monitor, colors are way too saturated.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
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alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: postmortemIA

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I have fine and spare 6800 Ultra (AGP of course) by BFG. I tried to sell it locally, no luck.

:D

Based on your luck, I guess it could come handy if Sapphire craps on me too.

Yeah, mine has two minor issues: with cold booting, won't bot every once in a while. And when I run 1600x1200 1:1 mapping on my 1920x1200 monitor, colors are way too saturated.

welcome to the *F*d'up x1950p Sapphire Club*, buddy ... that "cold boot" issue is well noted on their forums ... and if your colours are oversaturated as well, you better start your RMA process ... now. :p

i don't think it gets better over time ...
... if you bought it less than a month ago ... RMA it now ... don't wait. ;)

keep that 6800u handy



 

Stumps

Diamond Member
Jun 18, 2001
7,125
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Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: postmortemIA

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I have fine and spare 6800 Ultra (AGP of course) by BFG. I tried to sell it locally, no luck.

:D

Based on your luck, I guess it could come handy if Sapphire craps on me too.

Yeah, mine has two minor issues: with cold booting, won't bot every once in a while. And when I run 1600x1200 1:1 mapping on my 1920x1200 monitor, colors are way too saturated.

welcome to the *F*d'up x1950p Sapphire Club*, buddy ... that "cold boot" issue is well noted on their forums ... and if your colours are oversaturated as well, you better start your RMA process ... now. :p

i don't think it gets better over time ...
... if you bought it less than a month ago ... RMA it now ... don't wait. ;)

keep that 6800u handy

hmmm judging by the way that the Sapphire X1950Pro's are dying, maybe it is a good thing that I hung on to my 7800GS then...

*fingers crossed* Hopefully the fear of going back to my 7800GS will keep my Sapphire in line...*fingers crossed*
 

postmortemIA

Diamond Member
Jul 11, 2006
7,721
40
91
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: postmortemIA

Sorry, I forgot to mention that I have fine and spare 6800 Ultra (AGP of course) by BFG. I tried to sell it locally, no luck.

:D

Based on your luck, I guess it could come handy if Sapphire craps on me too.

Yeah, mine has two minor issues: with cold booting, won't bot every once in a while. And when I run 1600x1200 1:1 mapping on my 1920x1200 monitor, colors are way too saturated.

welcome to the *F*d'up x1950p Sapphire Club*, buddy ... that "cold boot" issue is well noted on their forums ... and if your colours are oversaturated as well, you better start your RMA process ... now. :p

i don't think it gets better over time ...
... if you bought it less than a month ago ... RMA it now ... don't wait. ;)

keep that 6800u handy

Saturation happens only on DVI on non-native resolution...

This mobo had 9700pro before..it would never boot right first time, so nothing new.

I've had it over month.

You know, computer today has become sum of unfinished products.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
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alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: postmortemIA
Hey at least I have spare card :D

you would have spare one too if you weren't that uhm... greedy :D

ahem ... i will have a spare card tomorrow ...
nicer than your spare, i believe :p

:D

and i sold my x850xt for $100 plus shipping from a Video thread ... the buyer got a very good deal

of course ... 20/20 hindsight ... i would have NEVER upgraded to that flashy and cheap Sapphire Whor....
... uh, whorrible card ...

:laugh:

 

Gstanfor

Banned
Oct 19, 1999
3,307
0
0
Originally posted by: josh6079
I am continually amused by people who like Sapphire products and talk them up...
Then apparently you're amused by Anandtech for "talking up"' the Sapphire card in this article - Click
Anandtech
For those who absolutely must have an X1900 XTX, their choice should be fairly clear. At $580, the Sapphire X1900 XTX is the cheapest, and also gets more-or-less the highest overclock of the three.
A quick look at their tables here show that the Sapphire cards out-performed other brands.

So if the people you're seeing "talk Sapphire products up" are Anandtech's own reviewers, then perhaps you should include the reasons as to why they are doing so.
70% of all ATi cards manufactured are manufactured in factories a lot worse than most nvidia cards are buiolt in...
I don't remember a recent ATi refresh having artifacts at stock frequencies. (a.k.a. The 7900's when they first arrived.) Their cards are typically solid. The way they launch them...not so much. Every manufacturer has their bad apples. As does every forum... *cough*

You'll never catch me talking up Evga, XFX or MSI josh, in fact, a fair while ago I compared photos of the evga 7900 pcb with my xpertvision (gainward) card in this very forum and pronounced evga's workmanship shoddy.

Back to Sapphire though, are you not aware that most BBA (built by Ati) cards are actually built by Sapphire and have been for a very long time? Did you not also know that Sapphire makes most 3rd party ATi cards and other manufacturers contribute only a sticker and maybe a heatsink/fan unit? Do you remember the R300 review where the heatsink was poorly machined? That was a Sapphire board, I'll bet they are responsible for the 9800 heatsink problems too. See Sapphires problems aren't isolated events, but anyone at all who kew of Sapphires PC-Chips past could tell you exactly what problems you are likely to get without even looking...

Says a lot for ATi that they preach quality but partner with PC-Chips...
 

josh6079

Diamond Member
Mar 17, 2006
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Did you not also know that Sapphire makes most 3rd party ATi cards and other manufacturers contribute only a sticker and maybe a heatsink/fan unit?
And that shows that they are shotty how? By being responsible for more ATi boards than other brands?

:roll:
Do you remember the R300 review where the heatsink was poorly machined? That was a Sapphire board, I'll bet they are responsible for the 9800 heatsink problems too.
Did I say Sapphire was perfect?
See Sapphires problems aren't isolated events, but anyone at all who kew of Sapphires PC-Chips past could tell you exactly what problems you are likely to get without even looking...
Like what? A bad HSF? Such has been the attribute for most stock video cards until just recently.

First you claim that nVidia makes their cards better cause they use better factories and now you're pinning that level of superiority on a simple HSF? At least I can change a HSF if I didn't like it. A card artifacting at stock frequencies is a more difficult problem.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
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alienbabeltech.com
i went to UPS tracking:
Your package is on time with a scheduled delivery date of 02/13/2007.

that's today :Q

frankly i am a little *nervous*


ATi *gone* from my rig ... first time ... in years ... and 3 sets of nvidia ForceWare and RivaTuner ... are ... 'waiting'
:confused:

... actually ... i AM gonna play Fable first
[i am having the fabled withdrawels]

this addiction to gaming is kinda expensive ... especially looking forward to my next rig :p
:shocked:

 

chizow

Diamond Member
Jun 26, 2001
9,537
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Originally posted by: apoppin
this addiction to gaming is kinda expensive ... especially looking forward to my next rig :p
:shocked:

Hope you enjoy your new card. :)

But ya, I originally wanted to spend @$1500 on a new rig and maybe a cheap widescreen LCD and salvage as many old parts as possible from my old rig. I think I'm around the $2500 mark now though lol. I've replaced pretty much everything but the upgrade shakes are finally subsiding and I'm getting back into just enjoying my new rig instead of constantly changing parts out. Not much else to upgrade, although I may pull the trigger on an X-Fi w/ face plate if the price is right. :)
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
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how *thoroughly* does ATi need to be removed?
:confused:

i still see bits of it left as dlls in conjunction with some games as application extensions ... and in Creative folders

do a clean Win2K install? :p

[probably on another HD --if necessary] ;)

 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Originally posted by: chizow
Hope you enjoy your new card. :)

But ya, I originally wanted to spend @$1500 on a new rig and maybe a cheap widescreen LCD and salvage as many old parts as possible from my old rig. I think I'm around the $2500 mark now though lol. I've replaced pretty much everything but the upgrade shakes are finally subsiding and I'm getting back into just enjoying my new rig instead of constantly changing parts out. Not much else to upgrade, although I may pull the trigger on an X-Fi w/ face plate if the price is right. :)

I just end up replacing everything. I hate how trying to nickel and dime a PC ends up degrading its performance. It may cost a lot, but after spending a lot, you don't have to worry about wanting to upgrade anything... sometimes ;). I'll probably end up building another machine this December or so to try to keep up with the times. But that all depends on the state of computing at that time =/.
 

Mem

Lifer
Apr 23, 2000
21,476
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Originally posted by: apoppin
how *thoroughly* does ATi need to be removed?
:confused:

i still see bits of it left as dlls in conjunction with some games as application extensions ... and in Creative folders

do a clean Win2K install? :p

[probably on another HD --if necessary] ;)

Yes use Driver Cleaner Pro and welcome back to Nvidia ;) ,I may be going back to AMD/ATI if they hurry up with their DX10 cards,the BFG 8800 GTS OC is at a tempting price and I don't know how much longer I can hold off from buying it.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
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alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Mem
Originally posted by: apoppin
how *thoroughly* does ATi need to be removed?
:confused:

i still see bits of it left as dlls in conjunction with some games as application extensions ... and in Creative folders

do a clean Win2K install? :p

[probably on another HD --if necessary] ;)

Yes use Driver Cleaner Pro and welcome back to Nvidia ;) ,I may be going back to AMD/ATI if they hurry up with their DX10 cards,the BFG 8800 GTS OC is at a tempting price and I don't know how much longer I can hold off from buying it.
thanks

i have recommended it ... without using it .....

of course ...
:eek:

and it's IS fast and easy ... but doesn't seem to get *everything* ... probably everything 'important'


btw, have you played Fable yet?
it's the *reason* i am so impatient to get back to it ... 'why' i bought the GS
... after work ... IMMEDIATELY after installing my GS :p


 

Mem

Lifer
Apr 23, 2000
21,476
13
81
Originally posted by: apoppin
Originally posted by: Mem
Originally posted by: apoppin
how *thoroughly* does ATi need to be removed?
:confused:

i still see bits of it left as dlls in conjunction with some games as application extensions ... and in Creative folders

do a clean Win2K install? :p

[probably on another HD --if necessary] ;)

Yes use Driver Cleaner Pro and welcome back to Nvidia ;) ,I may be going back to AMD/ATI if they hurry up with their DX10 cards,the BFG 8800 GTS OC is at a tempting price and I don't know how much longer I can hold off from buying it.
thanks

i have recommended it ... without using it .....

of course ...
:eek:

and it's IS fast and easy ... but doesn't seem to get *everything* ... probably everything 'important'


btw, have you played Fable yet?
it's the *reason* i am so impatient to get back to it ... 'why' i bought the GS
... after work ... IMMEDIATELY after installing my GS :p

Not yet,I'm busy playing UFO-Afterlight at the moment,I like the research and production control I have in the game ,as well as the usual fighting in real time with the pesky aliens.
 

gsellis

Diamond Member
Dec 4, 2003
6,061
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Apoppin, I am going to get you a 103 key keyboard. The one missing the semi-colon/colon key. It is like trying to read a post by someone who stopped too often at the little roadside stop a couple miles past Honolua Bay (Maui). ;)

Since you need so much assistance, I will teach you how to paddle out to a reef break with a strong side current. :p
 

Slaimus

Senior member
Sep 24, 2000
985
0
76
Anyone get a G71 based 7800GS from newegg/outpost? Those are supposed to be cooler and better overclocking.
 

nitromullet

Diamond Member
Jan 7, 2004
9,031
36
91
how *thoroughly* does ATi need to be removed?

The only reason I would remove any portion of the ATI drivers is in the event that you are using the CCC and have no other need for .NET.

Contrary to popular belief, un-used video drivers don't need to be removed at all, as a matter of fact there are a bunch of un-used video drivers on your machine already just from installing Windows. I have often had both ATI drivers and NV drivers installed on the same machine, and I have just swapped out hardware with no issues whatsoever. If you use ATI Tray Tool, it will bark at you that you don't have an ATI card installed everytime you boot, so I would remove that.

I'll take this even further... Any video card driver issue I've ever had, has also never been solved by removing the other's drivers. While a neat program, Driver Cleaner has NEVER once solved a problem for me. I imagine the reason for this is not because DC isn't a fine program, but just that having un-used drivers on your computer doesn't do a damn thing except take up space.

... and 3 sets of nvidia ForceWare and RivaTuner ... are ... 'waiting'

some thoughts on thig as well... If you truely want to evaluate, why not initially try out the most recent WHQL drivers from NVIDIA as they are? I'm not saying to never use RiveTuner or toy around with drivers from Guru3D, Tweaks'R Us, etc... But, just that if you really want to give NVIDIA and their hardware a fair shake, run your card as they intended you to for a few days. It will take some gettting used to the interface, as the way ATI and NVIDIA do things is quite different sometimes.
 

apoppin

Lifer
Mar 9, 2000
34,890
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alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: gsellis
Apoppin, I am going to get you a 103 key keyboard. The one missing the semi-colon/colon key. It is like trying to read a post by someone who stopped too often at the little roadside stop a couple miles past Honolua Bay (Maui). ;)

Since you need so much assistance, I will teach you how to paddle out to a reef break with a strong side current. :p

try it brah ... shoots ... i tink you *like* it

and does 10-12' Pipeline, Oahu [Hawaiian ... 20'-25' feet in the rest of the world] have a strong enough side current for you?

i found it *refreshing* .... and i was 'regular' there for da Kine Winter swell ... for years

:p

Geev um awready!
============================================

OK ....


i got my 7800GS and have been playing the last few hours.

the card looks and feels *solid* --unlike that cheap and flash Sapphire whor ...

the heat sink is heavy and fan is QUIET

installation was routine and the drivers installed without a hitch - latest Certified Drivers 93.71 ... love NOT having CCC ... and played around with the basic settings ... nice ... no Net 2.0 and more streamlined
:thumbsup:

3DMark05 was a hair under 6K ... totally stock and my CPU still running at only 3.01Ghz [instead of the usual 3.2 or 3.31Ghz] .... seems a little low ... but performance was *excellent* in games ...

i played Fable at identical setting to the x1950p and gameplay is as smooth as butter

FEAR's x-pack actually was more stable with nvidia drivers than ATi's with either the x850xt or x1950p ... it was *buggy* and would hang or hitch and sometimes crash ... so far ..... no prob with the GS
:Q
but slightly lower settings for smoothness

Oblivion was on a par with my x850xt's performance -- with the exception that it would allow for *grass* [and HDR] and still be smooth ... the x1950p is definitely faster [but i am 'done' with Oblivion, anyway]


i haven't installed RivaTuner yet ... so don't know about the core or o/c'ing

and i can't see ANY *shimmering* :p

so far ... really nice video card ... kinda like a slightly beefier x850xt with SM3.0 and a better IQ ... probably very close to the x1950p's IQ [excellent] ... but i don't have it to compare anymore ... colors are vibrant too
both card's IQ are 'top notch' in my book ... and a big improvement over what i remember of nvidia cards.

so far for $160 after MIR ...
[i saw it yesterday *on sale* at Best Buy for $250 .... no rebate ... "marked down" from $379 :p]

a *solid* :thumbsup:

and 'recommended' by apoppin
:Q

you can quote me
["so far", is my only disclaimer]

no one hijacked my account
:shocked:

--or is paying for my testimonial

:D

 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
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Is the 1950 Pro a DX10 card? If not, does anybody know if they are going to make a decent AGP DX10 card?