Anyone know where to buy a 1-user copy of Windows Server 2008?

Kumba

Junior Member
Aug 30, 2008
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I've already called Microsoft twice on this question, but I must be reaching the dimwits at the phones, because they don't seem to understand the question when I ask what I need to do to buy a 1-user copy of Windows Server 2008 Std.

I've easily found single User CALs on several reseller sites, but I still need the server license it self I believe, and I can't find these in anything less than 5-CAL quantities. Has anyone come across such a thing yet? I figure the price shouldn't be too bad. $200-$250 tops, especially considering 5 CALs + software is $999.

Going to use the trial anyways to start, just to make sure I actually like 2008 as a workstation OS (yes, going to convert it). If that fails, I'll try 2003 instead.
 

RebateMonger

Elite Member
Dec 24, 2005
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They aren't dimwits. Microsoft doesn't make single-user copies of its server operating systems. Most come with five CALs built in.
 

Kumba

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Aug 30, 2008
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Originally posted by: RebateMonger
They aren't dimwits. Microsoft doesn't make single-user copies of its server operating systems. Most come with five CALs built in.
They should be able to tell me that straight off the bat then. When I go "Do you sell 1-user copies of Windows Server 2008?", they should be able to immediately explain to me that they don't. Instead, I got stuck with a guy who needed the question repeated to him twice, then all he did was tell me to go to a webpage where I can buy Server 2008 standard. That's where the 5-license version was. I then had to inquire a again if there was a single license copy, and that's when he finally said "No".

I'll try again tomorrow during normal business hours and see if someone else there can offer actual advice. I did call at about 6:55pm, and probably just wound up with some poor guy at an after-hours call center whose not fielded a question like that before (I do have a penchant for asking the odd questions).

Equally, I don't suppose it's as easily as buying it in pieces, say buying 1 CAL, and then ordering a media kit, right? Is that method even possible, or does MS require a minimum number of CALs before you can order a media kit? I mean, as far as I know, a CAL == a license, correct? Or is there a separate server license?

I figure there has to be some legit way of buying Windows Server in 1-user configurations. It might just be non-standard and/or obscure.

 

drebo

Diamond Member
Feb 24, 2006
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If you buy a volume license version, you do not have to purchase any CALs to go a long with it. However, the minimum quantity to open a volume license agreement with Microsoft is 5 (they don't have to be 5 of the same thing, but you need 5 total volume licenses in your first order). For approximately the same price, you can obtain an OEM license for Microsoft Server 2008, which includes 5 CALs.

So...you pay the ~$700 for no CALs and have to buy 4 other things, or you pay the ~$700 for 5 cals. Either way, there is no point what so ever to using Server 2008 as a workstation OS.
 

RebateMonger

Elite Member
Dec 24, 2005
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Here's MS' price list for Retail Server 2008 packages

The other choices are OEM licenses (which also include 5 CALs) and Volume licenses, which require the purchase of at least five licenses minimum upon your first purchase.

Originally posted by: Kumba
I mean, as far as I know, a CAL == a license, correct? Or is there a separate server license?
There's a separate Server license. It gives you the right to run the Server and allows as many users/devices as are built into the Server license. CALS are for added users/devices beyond the built-in number of CALS.
 

Kumba

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Aug 30, 2008
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Originally posted by: RebateMonger
Here's MS' price list for Retail Server 2008 packages

The other choices are OEM licenses (which also include 5 CALs) and Volume licenses, which require the purchase of at least five licenses minimum upon your first purchase.

I see. I guess what I'm trying to achieve is back in the day when you walked into a store, and could grab a copy of Windows 2000 Pro off the shelf. What you installed was a "clean OS" - no wizards, no gunk, no fisher-price interfaces loading up.

In the XP family, the only way to achieve all of that still (and bypass having to "sanitize" an XP install) is to install Server 2003, follow a quick 9 step guide on turning off a few things, and turning on a few others. Takes 5mins tops on a decent box, and you have a very good workstation OS.

Having looked up the guide for Windows Server 2008 (http://www.win2008workstation.com), I wanted to try this on a new box I'm putting together. It's just finding the right way to do this without spending a gazillion on an OS is the hard part. Part of which, I understand, is because I'm one of those fringe users MS's marketing folks really can't account for, since my intention is a workstation, not a true server.

As for why I don't just buy and install Vista, call it a personal preference, but I've felt that MS has a bad habit of doing everything wrong on their "consumer" releases, post 1999 (Millenium, XP, Vista) and gets it all right on their power-user/server versions (2000 Pro, 2003, and maybe 2008). There's also incremental improvements in the core code for servers that gears more towards stability than I feel exists in the consumer realm. Not that I can actually back that statement up with proof, but it's based on my years of working with several of their OSes.

I am, however, having some hopeful vibes about Windows 7, but that's still too far off to see if they manage to release, in my opinion, an awesome consumer OS for once.



There's a separate Server license. It gives you the right to run the Server and allows as many users/devices as are built into the Server license. CALS are for added users/devices beyond the built-in number of CALS.

Ah ha, I figured there had to be something like that. I take it this only comes with OEM hardware, correct? And that these server licenses are not sold separately?

See, I figure that with all the options server licensing models give you, it should be possible, some how, to legally buy the right components for a one-user setup. My particular case is somewhat esoteric and eccentric, but lets paint a "what-if" scenario at my office, where I need a setup for testing server-side stuff. See, we're always a step behind in technology (Windows Server 2003 and NetWare 6.5 is *new* stuff to my office mates), due to small budgets and me being the only IT guy on servers and desktops. 2008 and Vista isn't something we're going to look at for 2-3 more years tops. I can't go to my manager and say that, for testing purposes, I have to spend close to a grand for 5 licenses. I should be able to say I need to spend $200-$300 for a single user setup, from which I can run tests on things, before committing to a real volume purchase.

So lets just scratch buying direct from MS out of the equation. How about resellers? Do they sell the necessary components that can legally be assembled into a proper, "genuine" (I hate that word nowadays) copy of Server 2008 that I can use in a workstation mode?

FYI, I'm also testing installing the trial into a VMware instance, and seeing what the activation thingy can do for me. Maybe it'll let me do something like pick what I want to buy and kick me to a webpage... who knows.
 

Kumba

Junior Member
Aug 30, 2008
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Originally posted by: KumbaFYI, I'm also testing installing the trial into a VMware instance, and seeing what the activation thingy can do for me. Maybe it'll let me do something like pick what I want to buy and kick me to a webpage... who knows.

Well, this is interesting.

Dug out the Activation feature of this Server 2008 Std trial copy (hiding as a link in system properties), hit the "Buy a new product key online", and I'm taken to a page that lets me buy a Vista product key. So, does this mean Server 2008 will take a Vista product key? Or is Microsoft's website confused and just sending me to where it thinks I need to go?

I mean, if Vista and Server 2008 product keys can cross-pollinate, I find that rather fascinating, but it doesn't make sense.

Thoughts?
 

RebateMonger

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Dec 24, 2005
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If you are really intent on exploring Microsoft's new servers for longer than six months (the length of each free trial version), then you should probably get a TechNet Plus subscription. That will give you copies of most of Microsoft's OSes on a yearly subscription basis.
 

QuixoticOne

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Nov 4, 2005
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I'd second RebateMonger's suggestion about looking into a TechNet subscription. If you're just personally testing / evaluating / learning about the product and don't need client licenses to put the thing into production, maybe it'll be a better deal for you. Last I heard they had a 40% off code published all over the web / MS blogs to make it something over $200 for the first year IIRC.

If you qualify for academic discounts / pricing or MSDN-AA then of course do that; even if you don't, it might be interesting to just enroll in the requisite classes so that you do qualify for them that way you get to take some classes you might want to take for continuing education or whatever and get a discount on the software as well (there are probably restrictions about how you can use the stuff in production, but if you're looking for a 1 user license I assume you're probably just personally learning / evaluating anyway).

Of course if you can get a time limited demo version that can be handy for personal learning / exploration as well.

Other than that, check out newegg, provantage, cdw, all the usual suspects for retailers with competitive prices on the retail set.

I suppose you might be allowed to sell off excess CALs if you don't need that many; I've no idea how that works.

 

Kumba

Junior Member
Aug 30, 2008
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Hmm, interesting tips from everyone.

Lets say there's a hypothetical situation where a 5-CAL license pack is found on an auction site for pretty cheap. The description says it's the full retail 5 CAL licenses. I assume this means one just gets a piece of paper that grants ownership rights, so from one of the earlier posts, can one then utilize eOpen and be sent a media kit?

I phrase it that way, because I know for years that MS has sought to tie the software license to hardware, and dislikes places like auction sites, because they usually don't make anything from the sale (same reason why the music industry hates second-hand stores).
 

RebateMonger

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Dec 24, 2005
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If you buy a 5-CAL User/Device license pack and get a media kit for Windows Server, you won't be able to do anything with it because you didn't purchase a license for Windows Server itself. You won't be able to install or Activate the Server. CALS give you the license to access a functioning Server, not the license to install the Server.

Microsoft's main objection to auction sites seems to be that many folks try to sell software in violation of the license (EULA) terms. Many offer opened OEM software that isn't supposed to be separated from the original motherboard it came with, or sell Not-For-Resale software that Microsoft has given them with the proviso that they won't sell it.

If you want, contact Eric Ligman, Microsoft's top licensing expert, and ask him your question.
 

Kumba

Junior Member
Aug 30, 2008
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Originally posted by: RebateMonger
If you buy a 5-CAL User/Device license pack and get a media kit for Windows Server, you won't be able to do anything with it because you didn't purchase a license for Windows Server itself. You won't be able to install or Activate the Server. CALS give you the license to access a functioning Server, not the license to install the Server.
Hmm, definitely keeps options limited, since all my searching thus far hasn't turned up a non-evaluation, non-academic, non-OEM, retail version of a single server license anywhere (without >1 CALs attached).

However, I am still perplexed why, when I followed their Activation Wizard in my trial install, it takes me to a Vista page and acts like buying a Vista license key is all I need. Personally, I think this hints at just how little separation there really is between a Desktop OS and a Server OS these days. Turn off server roles, turn on audio and DX9/10, tweak a few things, and the difference between the two is blurred, insofar as the core kernel of the OS (my understanding is Vista and Server 2008 share the exact same kernel, so this probably botches the detection algorithm they use).



Microsoft's main objection to auction sites seems to be that many folks try to sell software in violation of the license (EULA) terms. Many offer opened OEM software that isn't supposed to be separated from the original motherboard it came with, or sell Not-For-Resale software that Microsoft has given them with the proviso that they won't sell it.
Yeah, this I understand. In the past, I was cheaper and had fewer qualms, but having been a sysadmin for a few years, I'm a lot more selective and target retail software on auctions sites instead.


Edit: I suppose another option is to scour eBay for broken server hardware that just happens to have a Windows Server 2008 License tag stamped on it. Don't suppose Microsoft's ruled on that yet, have they?
 

DrGreen2007

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Jan 30, 2007
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If you find 'broken server hardware' on Ebay that has 2008 COA's on it...

1 - someone must have really had a bad day with the hardware to break it and not be under warranty

2 - you still couldnt use that license unless you repair the machine, since OEM = tied to original hardware it was sold on.
 

Kumba

Junior Member
Aug 30, 2008
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Originally posted by: DrGreen2007
If you find 'broken server hardware' on Ebay that has 2008 COA's on it...

1 - someone must have really had a bad day with the hardware to break it and not be under warranty

2 - you still couldnt use that license unless you repair the machine, since OEM = tied to original hardware it was sold on.

To the best of my knowledge, the act of tying the license to the hardware is a questionable practice anyways (i.e., it hasn't been tested in courts, and iirc, if it was, it wouldn't hold a lot of mustard). But, a quick search on eBay for kicks reveals lots of broken servers -- stripped (or never originally configured with) a server OS. I suppose if I had a lot more time to sit around and watch for stuff, maybe something would pop up.

So Technet looks like one way, and that 40% off promo code turns up several inquries I'll have to research more later. My only question on technect is, if I subscribe for one year, then about this time next year, quit, will the product key for that version of Windows deactivate itself? Or otherwise render that copy unusable, either by denying updates or just locking the system out?

How about thoughts on Server 2008's trial copy taking me to a webpage to buy a Vista product key? Has anyone else tried that before and determined whether Server 2008 accepts such keys? Or am I just looking at a bug in the particular trial copy I downloaded? (It seems like if it was a bug, it's a glaring one, because that affects potential revenue for MS).
 

QuixoticOne

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Nov 4, 2005
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Re: Technet:
http://technet.microsoft.com/e...riptions/bb404693.aspx
No Time Limits for Software Evaluations?

Yes! When customers subscribe to TechNet Plus Subscriptions they will get full-version software licensed for evaluation purposes. This includes a variety of Microsoft commercial software including Microsoft® Operating Systems (Windows Vista®, Windows Server® 2003, Small Business Server), Servers (e.g. Microsoft Exchange Server 2007 , SQL Server 2005, BizTalk® Server, Commerce Server, Live Communication Server) and Microsoft Office System (the 2007 Microsoft Office release, InfoPath®, OneNote®, Visio®, Project) software.

http://technet.microsoft.com/e...downloads/default.aspx

I believe the licence to continue to use products for which you've received keys during your active subscription never lapses even after your TechNet subscription ends. You may not be able to request NEW keys for new products after your subscription ends, though I seem to remember there's an exception about being able to continue to receive already earned / available keys even after the subscription period ends. It is possible that some of the software there is available for download through TechNet is offered with built in time limits but in general that is only for things like BETA / technology preview pre-release software, or things like the AppCompat testing VM image, or whatever that is basically ALWAYS time limited however you get it. Full version released products / keys should continue to be usable forever with the issued keys.


 

QuixoticOne

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There's also MSDN and something called "Action Pack" that you may be able to sign up for depending on your needs and qualifications that can help get you software for development / testing / evaluation or production purposes. IIRC Action Pack is specifically relevant to people wanting to use the software in commercial production environments whereas MSDN is for development / testing, and TechNet is more for evaluation testing / learning types of situations.

 

Kumba

Junior Member
Aug 30, 2008
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Originally posted by: QuixoticOne
Re: Technet:

I believe the licence to continue to use products for which you've received keys during your active subscription never lapses even after your TechNet subscription ends. You may not be able to request NEW keys for new products after your subscription ends, though I seem to remember there's an exception about being able to continue to receive already earned / available keys even after the subscription period ends. It is possible that some of the software there is available for download through TechNet is offered with built in time limits but in general that is only for things like BETA / technology preview pre-release software, or things like the AppCompat testing VM image, or whatever that is basically ALWAYS time limited however you get it. Full version released products / keys should continue to be usable forever with the issued keys.

Gotcha, so that sounds like one way then.


Anyone got ideas on the other question? All I'm doing is in this VMware copy I have setup for a little bit (which is the official Win2k8 Std Trial ISO that I downloaded off Microsoft's site), is going into system Properties, selecting to activate, and then in the dialog, where it asks for my product key, clicking on the "Buy a key" button (it says something to that effect). I want to say that's a bug in their web application doing the OS detection, because I don't know how a Vista key could activate 2008. It'd be a major loophole in their licensing model, and I don't think they'd leave it open that long. I figured people here may have run into that before and might know whether that's an option as well, or just a bug.
 

QuixoticOne

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Nov 4, 2005
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As the the "buy a key" thing.. well consider if the price is reasonable and go for it. The worst that could happen is it doesn't work with the product and you'd have to call Microsoft support to get them to give you a functional key for the purchase that you've already made or at least produce a full and immediate refund if they can't or won't get you the right key.

What is the quoted price anyway?

It wouldn't surprise me if the key sales page IS correct and it just uses the same key generator and online storefront for Vista and Server 2008 since they are very intimately related products which likely share the same authentication infrastructure / technology. Also S2K8 hasn't been released to the market for all THAT long, so maybe there are just a few rough edges in the web site maintenance for supporting it. I've seen other things that have been weeks or months out of date on Microsoft's web sites from time to time.
It is perhaps a bit of a marketing / sales / web design blunder to commingle the product pages like that, but that doesn't mean that it isn't intended to use the same back end key generator / license database / sales systems even if the page design and language should have been updated.

If you're concerned about it, you should go post a message on the Server 2K8 product team's Microsoft BLOG and I'm pretty sure you'd get an immediate response from one of their product managers / marketing people about the issue.

 

Kumba

Junior Member
Aug 30, 2008
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Originally posted by: QuixoticOne
As the the "buy a key" thing.. well consider if the price is reasonable and go for it. The worst that could happen is it doesn't work with the product and you'd have to call Microsoft support to get them to give you a functional key for the purchase that you've already made or at least produce a full and immediate refund if they can't or won't get you the right key.

What is the quoted price anyway?

It wouldn't surprise me if the key sales page IS correct and it just uses the same key generator and online storefront for Vista and Server 2008 since they are very intimately related products which likely share the same authentication infrastructure / technology. Also S2K8 hasn't been released to the market for all THAT long, so maybe there are just a few rough edges in the web site maintenance for supporting it. I've seen other things that have been weeks or months out of date on Microsoft's web sites from time to time.
It is perhaps a bit of a marketing / sales / web design blunder to commingle the product pages like that, but that doesn't mean that it isn't intended to use the same back end key generator / license database / sales systems even if the page design and language should have been updated.

If you're concerned about it, you should go post a message on the Server 2K8 product team's Microsoft BLOG and I'm pretty sure you'd get an immediate response from one of their product managers / marketing people about the issue.

Well, at first, the validator acts like I'm clean, because the trial key was active. So I ran "slmgr -upk" to remove it, then rebooted the VM, and the activation window blocked further access. So I try to validate again from there, and instead, it just takes me to the Vista stuff, letting me download and buy from the MS Digital locker. That seems really odd.

Here's a screen cap, btw:
http://i40.photobucket.com/alb...45/win2k8-is-vista.jpg

(FYI, I opened explorer.exe by running a command prompt from the help system. Neat trick, but closing the activation window logs you off the system).


I guess if they share the same kernel, they can can also share the same key system, but if this thing would validate a Vista key, that'd make no sense, and plus, I could envision where windows update might get confused and attempt to update such a system with Vista updates. That could be catastrophic. Maybe server 2k8 was more rushed than imagined, or it's the pinnacle of the true "one OS, multiple roles" MS has sought for the past 8 years, ever since they started to merge the Win9x and WinNT codebases.
 

QuixoticOne

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Nov 4, 2005
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Yeah just be careful and don't rely TOO much on the listed products for TechNet. A few months ago they re-did their web sites and they listed all the products combined that you could download with either one of TechNet or MSDN together. Some of the downloads were ONLY available for MSDN and not TechNet but they were listed anyway if you logged in under a technet account but you couldn't download them.

Generally anything that is a SDK / software programming type of tool isn't available from TechNet, but is available from some version of MSDN. Generally all the operating systems geared for business / enterprise use ARE available from TechNet, though the HOME USE operating systems may not be. I think Win98, Win2K are missing. I don't remember NT being there either but I could just be forgetting.

Yeah they have some versions of OS products that I hadn't even heard of / used on there.

 

tcsenter

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Sep 7, 2001
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Originally posted by: Kumba
I see. I guess what I'm trying to achieve is back in the day when you walked into a store, and could grab a copy of Windows 2000 Pro off the shelf. What you installed was a "clean OS" - no wizards, no gunk, no fisher-price interfaces loading up.
Windows 2000 Professional Workstation, not Windows 2000 Server. This is as close to the Vista Business or Enterprise Edition > Server 2008 analogy as it gets.

To the best of my knowledge, the act of tying the license to the hardware is a questionable practice anyways (i.e., it hasn't been tested in courts, and iirc, if it was, it wouldn't hold a lot of mustard).
There is nothing legally questionable about tying licenses to hardware, any more than it is legally questionable to disclaim or sever warranty or service obligations the moment the product is transferred from the original purchaser to any subsequent purchaser. The more fundamental question of whether software is licensed has been thoroughly tested and is no longer considered an open one.

There is legal support for being able to sell OEM software if you do not accept the EULA, but since nobody could purchase that software with the rights to use it left intact, thereby rendering it worthless in the process, 'freedom' to sell it becomes moot.