Anyone here think McCain will actually win?

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Chaotic42
He's got a fighting chance. Remember that there are quite a few "middle Americans" who are fairly conservative. I try to avoid discussing politics in real life, but I don't know anyone who has said that they are voting for Obama.

Yes, your vague generalities and personal anecdotes certainly trump scientific polls.

Thanks, I try.

I just bring it up because you talk about how inaccurate polls are, but apparently base your guess on something even less accurate.

I still believe that there is no way to predict how people will vote. If this were a random sampling of car color, number of pets, or something else not subject to opinion, I'd be more inclined to believe polls.

The facts would suggest your belief is wrong. Polls, when properly evaluated, can tell you a number of interesting things, and are actually pretty accurate within the intended accuracy of the poll. They are not crystal balls, but they aren't meant to be.

 

[StageLeft]

Anyone who still supports mccaonis almost by definition not smart enough to debate the topic intelligently, esp. with their mind now full of the obama character attacks.

 

[Chaotic42]

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Chaotic42

Originally posted by: Rainsford

Originally posted by: Chaotic42
He's got a fighting chance. Remember that there are quite a few "middle Americans" who are fairly conservative. I try to avoid discussing politics in real life, but I don't know anyone who has said that they are voting for Obama.

Yes, your vague generalities and personal anecdotes certainly trump scientific polls.

Thanks, I try.

I just bring it up because you talk about how inaccurate polls are, but apparently base your guess on something even less accurate.

I didn't talk about how inaccurate I felt that polls are until after your post. Anyway, if I came across as thinking that my own personal experiences will predict the election, I'm sorry. Obviously that's not the case. My point is that there are a lot of people in the country who may say they support Obama, but when the time comes, will choose McCain.

The facts would suggest your belief is wrong. Polls, when properly evaluated, can tell you a number of interesting things, and are actually pretty accurate within the intended accuracy of the poll. They are not crystal balls, but they aren't meant to be.

I'd be interested to see a breakdown of how accurate various polls have been throughout the history of our country. I might look for one tonight. They've got to be out there. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but I remain skeptical of polls.

 

[Baked]

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
If we get voter fraud he will win.

His camp's working on that. Heard on NPR the republican camp's passing out flyers at low income minority neighborhoods with democrat voters that polling stations can't handle all the voters at once, so republican voters will vote on November 4th, while democrat voters will vote on November 5th. That's pretty messed up. More FL election fraud BS.

 

[woodie1]

Originally posted by: Baked

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
If we get voter fraud he will win.

His camp's working on that. Heard on NPR the republican camp's passing out flyers at low income minority neighborhoods with democrat voters that polling stations can't handle all the voters at once, so republican voters will vote on November 4th, while democrat voters will vote on November 5th. That's pretty messed up. More FL election fraud BS.

That tactic has been around for years. If you don't know where and when to vote should you be voting?

 

[ScottMac]

Originally posted by: Baked

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
If we get voter fraud he will win.

His camp's working on that. Heard on NPR the republican camp's passing out flyers at low income minority neighborhoods with democrat voters that polling stations can't handle all the voters at once, so republican voters will vote on November 4th, while democrat voters will vote on November 5th. That's pretty messed up. More FL election fraud BS.

Good grief, that old joke doesn't even make it to Urban Legend status.

It's been told and retold by both sides for DECADES. It's probably more like "people that think that really happened are too stupid to vote"

 

[Starbuck1975]

Nonsense. ACORN has been accused by the right wing of registration fraud, which has nothing to do with voter fraud (actually voting when when you're not legally qualified, or voting more than once).

ACORN is actually under investigation in several states for registration fraud. Registration fraud is not so much an issue unless it leads to voter fraud on election day. The former is easier to monitor, the latter not so much...but the latter can impact the results of an election, especially in closely matched states.

Our whole system is a mess...ACORN is part of the problem.

 

[destrekor]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Anyone who still supports mccaonis almost by definition not smart enough to debate the topic intelligently, esp. with their mind now full of the obama character attacks.

are you fucking retarded?

I'm a little too drunk to actually reply to this thread seriously, so I'll leave it for tomorrow if you still care enough to read a real reply.

Anyone who feels the need to resort to such bullshit attacks has their head too far up their own ass to realize they are huffing the typical noxious party-line shit, and thus have no useful input for clean and honest discussion.

All I'll say now, is that it's useless to debate politics, expecting any change in the opposition, because it all comes down to personal preference.

Do you want the Federal Government ruling over everything, with a touch of socialist-style intervention, or would you rather a politician desire less Federal power over issues?

Neither main-party Presidential candidate brings the desire for small Federal government to the table, but one definitely has the idea of less compared to the other, and that's as good of start as any.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: ScottMac

Originally posted by: Baked

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
If we get voter fraud he will win.

His camp's working on that. Heard on NPR the republican camp's passing out flyers at low income minority neighborhoods with democrat voters that polling stations can't handle all the voters at once, so republican voters will vote on November 4th, while democrat voters will vote on November 5th. That's pretty messed up. More FL election fraud BS.

Good grief, that old joke doesn't even make it to Urban Legend status.

It's been told and retold by both sides for DECADES. It's probably more like "people that think that really happened are too stupid to vote"

This time it's apparently real - Text

 

[GoingUp]

Election Day Bump

 

[351Cleveland]

Originally posted by: XZeroII
I hope they both lose. I would rather have no president than either of these clowns. I saw we nominate a bag of lettuce. All it will cost us is a new refrigerator in the oval office and disposal and cleanup fees after 4 years.

Amen brother!

 

[351Cleveland]

I do not expect Obama to lose... but I can hope for a change in that area

 

[WHipLAsh13]

Originally posted by: CellarDoor
Kerry was definitely not ahead by 8 points going into election day. The average of the polls going into election day was pretty much dead on if i remember correctly.

Kerry did not have an 8 point lead in the polls but he did have a 3 point lead on exit polls the day of the election.

 

[WHipLAsh13]

Originally posted by: Muse
If McCain wins I'm going to look into my options for moving to another country, becoming a citizen there. Maybe Canada, Australia, a European country. I will find it hard to consider the USA a civilized nation.

Good I hope you do that. The US will be better off without you.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Muse
If McCain wins I'm going to look into my options for moving to another country, becoming a citizen there. Maybe Canada, Australia, a European country. I will find it hard to consider the USA a civilized nation.

Good I hope you do that. The US will be better off without you.

Is he taking you wish him?

 

[ProfJohn]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: ScottMac

Originally posted by: Baked

Originally posted by: WaTaGuMp
If we get voter fraud he will win.

His camp's working on that. Heard on NPR the republican camp's passing out flyers at low income minority neighborhoods with democrat voters that polling stations can't handle all the voters at once, so republican voters will vote on November 4th, while democrat voters will vote on November 5th. That's pretty messed up. More FL election fraud BS.

Good grief, that old joke doesn't even make it to Urban Legend status.

It's been told and retold by both sides for DECADES. It's probably more like "people that think that really happened are too stupid to vote"

This time it's apparently real - Text

BTW officials found the source of that flyer and decided not to press charges.

And they won't identify the people either. Say it was a joke that got out of hand.

 

[ThePresence]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
Anyone who still supports mccaonis almost by definition not smart enough to debate the topic intelligently, esp. with their mind now full of the obama character attacks.

:roll:

Anyone who disagrees with me is stupid.

Yeah.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: extra

Originally posted by: Double Trouble

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: Double Trouble
Duuuuh, of course the republicans tried to gain control of government, that's what the parties do, they fight for more power for themselves. No matter what you think of the republicans or the democrats, you simply can't deny (at least not with any credibility) that McCain's actions would be more limited by congress than Obama. If Obama turns out to be a bad president, he could end up hurting the US as much as Bush has. McCain's "downside" is limited.

With Palin as his VP?

No.

Yes, even with Palin. Even if -- gasp -- something would happen with (president) McCain, Palin would still be effectively reigned in by a strong opposition congress. There is no limit to the damage Obama can do with free reign.

As an independant who voted for Obama, I do somewhat agree with the sentiment that we should have opposing parties in government to limit the possible damage. That said, I hope we can keep a democratic majority at this point, to get SOMETHING, god, ANYTHING, done about healthcare. (Though to be honest I did vote republican for my representative this year, but the chick running is more of a libertarian or oldschool republican than what people would associate with republicans these days).

Anyway though, if the dems do a good job in the next 2 years, I say give them a little more time, if they have done poorly then hopefully we'll get republicans (hopefully some REAL republicans, not the whacky ones that are in power now) in control of the senate. Historically, despite any hatred for clinton, our country's government did a good job in the 90's and ran fairly well and ran efficiently.

We seem to do fairly well when we've got a dem president and republicans in congress/senate. Shrugs.

Saw this on the news the other day, with pretty graphs too; local FOX O&O station showing a report from FOX Business channel. S&P 500 provided a 14.7% return under Dem Pres./Dem. Congress, and 7.4% under Repub/Dem. They said Democratic/Republican was a little higher than either, I forgot the numbers.

 

[tealk]

One can only pray that McCain will prevail. And God's Mercy shown to us as a nation who ask for it.

 

[WHipLAsh13]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Muse
If McCain wins I'm going to look into my options for moving to another country, becoming a citizen there. Maybe Canada, Australia, a European country. I will find it hard to consider the USA a civilized nation.

Good I hope you do that. The US will be better off without you.

Is he taking you wish him?

I wasn't the one saying I am going to consider leaving the country based on who wins the election. With either candidate, we will hopefully be better off than we are today with Bush. If you survived 8 years of Bush, I am sure you can sustain 4 years of either Obama or McCain. I just think its sad when people make comments like this especially people like Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey, who have both said this in the past couple of weeks. If McCain does win his first action as President should be to throw them out. Obama should do the same for anyone that makes those promises.

 

[mrSHEiK124]

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Muse
If McCain wins I'm going to look into my options for moving to another country, becoming a citizen there. Maybe Canada, Australia, a European country. I will find it hard to consider the USA a civilized nation.

Good I hope you do that. The US will be better off without you.

Is he taking you wish him?

I wasn't the one saying I am going to consider leaving the country based on who wins the election. With either candidate, we will hopefully be better off than we are today with Bush. If you survived 8 years of Bush, I am sure you can sustain 4 years of either Obama or McCain. I just think its sad when people make comments like this especially people like Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey, who have both said this in the past couple of weeks. If McCain does win his first action as President should be to throw them out. Obama should do the same for anyone that makes those promises.

Now now, that 1st Amendment means they can say they're moving wherever the hell they want.

 

[Muse]

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Muse
If McCain wins I'm going to look into my options for moving to another country, becoming a citizen there. Maybe Canada, Australia, a European country. I will find it hard to consider the USA a civilized nation.

Good I hope you do that. The US will be better off without you.

Is he taking you wish him?

I wasn't the one saying I am going to consider leaving the country based on who wins the election. With either candidate, we will hopefully be better off than we are today with Bush. If you survived 8 years of Bush, I am sure you can sustain 4 years of either Obama or McCain. I just think its sad when people make comments like this especially people like Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey, who have both said this in the past couple of weeks. If McCain does win his first action as President should be to throw them out. Obama should do the same for anyone that makes those promises.

Hitler didn't waste his country's time, energy and money throwing people out. He either herded them into concentration camps, later usually gassing them or just put a bullet in their head. Of course, he also stripped them of their jewelry and confiscated their money and businesses, etc. Be pragmatic, man!

 

[pstylesss]

I was thinking he was going to lose going on a month and a half now. I changed my mind 2 days ago. I think he'll pull it off.

 

[WHipLAsh13]

Originally posted by: Muse

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Muse
If McCain wins I'm going to look into my options for moving to another country, becoming a citizen there. Maybe Canada, Australia, a European country. I will find it hard to consider the USA a civilized nation.

Good I hope you do that. The US will be better off without you.

Is he taking you wish him?

I wasn't the one saying I am going to consider leaving the country based on who wins the election. With either candidate, we will hopefully be better off than we are today with Bush. If you survived 8 years of Bush, I am sure you can sustain 4 years of either Obama or McCain. I just think its sad when people make comments like this especially people like Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey, who have both said this in the past couple of weeks. If McCain does win his first action as President should be to throw them out. Obama should do the same for anyone that makes those promises.

Hitler didn't waste his country's time, energy and money throwing people out. He either herded them into concentration camps, later usually gassing them or just put a bullet in their head. Of course, he also stripped them of their jewelry and confiscated their money and businesses, etc. Be pragmatic, man!

Not a horrible idea. Strip Alec and Tina of their money and dump them in Canada.

 

[WHipLAsh13]

Originally posted by: mrSHEiK124

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

Originally posted by: WHipLAsh13

Originally posted by: Muse
If McCain wins I'm going to look into my options for moving to another country, becoming a citizen there. Maybe Canada, Australia, a European country. I will find it hard to consider the USA a civilized nation.

Good I hope you do that. The US will be better off without you.

Is he taking you wish him?

I wasn't the one saying I am going to consider leaving the country based on who wins the election. With either candidate, we will hopefully be better off than we are today with Bush. If you survived 8 years of Bush, I am sure you can sustain 4 years of either Obama or McCain. I just think its sad when people make comments like this especially people like Alec Baldwin and Tina Fey, who have both said this in the past couple of weeks. If McCain does win his first action as President should be to throw them out. Obama should do the same for anyone that makes those promises.

Now now, that 1st Amendment means they can say they're moving wherever the hell they want.

Yeah but say what you mean and mean what you say. You make threats of leaving the country if someone gets elected then do it if they do get elected. Be a man/woman of your word.