Anyone else find Morrowind massively over rated?

[UglyDuckling]

I understand nostalgia and rose tinted glasses and being blinded by memories.. but holy crap.. the only thing great about it is the music, music is phenominal, and it seems to have a lot of depth.. not played much because every attempt i just don't want to bother after 30 or so minutes.

The combat in this game destroys it all... hitting an enemy with any weapon is a bigger task than trying to climb MT Everest naked whilst being an amputee with 1 leg.

It's that bad.

Of course an opinion.

I do like Skyrim, i like Oblivion, i wanted to love Morrowind with all the hype.. it's bad and has aged really badly too.

I modded my game with a huge visual upgrade along with sound upgrades.. i gave this game a larger chance than i would most titles i don't like.


Opinions?

 

[UglyDuckling]

I streamed it.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/140039600

My internet upload speed is terrible so it is uploaded in 432p at 24FPS looks choppy and blurry, but gameplay.. it's great up until 29 minutes or so in when i encounter my first fight which by the way is the way i have to go to do a favor to progress the stupid game.

1 hit out of like 30 attempts hit's an enemy lol.

 

[Rebel_L]

The free magic sword that you can get early (I think from the guy who drops from the sky) can be helpful. Like whenever one plays a new game combat takes a little bit of time to get comfortable with. I didnt watch your video but I do remember you need stamina to fight effectively, if you were running around and reach an encounter with low stamina you can easily get in trouble, also if you dont pick your weapon skill as a major skill to start it can be so low as to give problems, or if you run into higher level mobs for your early fights you can die pretty quickly.

For me I find that adjustment period in new games to be one of the most enjoyable parts. I rather enjoy figuring out the combat system and learning a games quirks. After one is familiar with a game the only thing left to keep me going is usually the story or just stubbornness in wanting to finish it.

 

[BSim500]

Opinions?

Opinions are mixed as always. "Rose-tinted glasses" may overlook some faults out of nostalgia (ie, focus on happy memories of playing such an open-world game for the first time after a stream of 90's linear FPS's vs technical issues). OTOH, if this is your first time playing you will be obviously more critical of it vs release as you'll be unfairly subconsciously judging a 2002 game by 2012-2017 standards.

"Rose-tinted glasses" aside, it's still widely liked because it isn't dumbed down. There's no giant arrow pointing you where to go, you have to listen to instructions. One of the saddest things about Oblivion's hand-holding was it was a "response" to "I don't know what to do" of the first mission in Morrowind (suffered only by those not listening during the intro). There was no enemy level scaling - if you insisted on entering a "difficult" cave, too bad. Oblivion onwards tended to over-compensate on making every enemy exactly match your level no matter how much you levelled up. As for it ageing, all +15 year old games age, but it's more than playable as are many other early 2000's games, especially with a large modding community behind it. It's an Elder Scrolls game, which means both mods are a necessity and it'll always be "part-quirky" but once modded, it looks pretty good for a 2002 game, especially if you're comparing it to 9 years newer cr*p like DA2.

Some aspects of the Morrowind -> Oblivion -> Skyrim 'evolution' were improved. Eg, removing Medium armor and streamlining a few of the skills didn't bother me. Visibly flagging stolen items in the inventory was another welcome improvement. Others were downgraded (eg, the non SkyUI / DarnifiedUI modded stock Oblivion / Skyrim UI is fugly as hell consolization on a PC). Likewise, I found Morrowind highly atmospheric because you were in Dunmer-land, and treated with far more suspicion and hostility if not playing as a Dark Elf vs playing as a non-Imperial in Oblivion / non-Nord in Skyrim. Likewise, some Morrowind villages looked and felt really different as a culture in different geographical regions, eg, Tel Branora Telvanni architecture vs Vivec's canals vs the normal "generic Elder Scrolls stone houses". In Oblivion most diversity had to be modded in (Unique Landscapes) and much of that architectural diversity vanished in Skyrim where a house is a house is a house... And yes, that soundtrack is just magical.

Like all games, it has its goods and its bads, and compared to what it brought at the time vs almost entirely linear games only a few years older, no it really wasn't overrated for what it tried (and mostly succeeded) in doing. The only real problem for 2002 released games is that the late 90's / early 2000's were such damn fine years for games releases...

 

[UglyDuckling]

The free magic sword that you can get early (I think from the guy who drops from the sky) can be helpful. Like whenever one plays a new game combat takes a little bit of time to get comfortable with. I didnt watch your video but I do remember you need stamina to fight effectively, if you were running around and reach an encounter with low stamina you can easily get in trouble, also if you dont pick your weapon skill as a major skill to start it can be so low as to give problems, or if you run into higher level mobs for your early fights you can die pretty quickly.

For me I find that adjustment period in new games to be one of the most enjoyable parts. I rather enjoy figuring out the combat system and learning a games quirks. After one is familiar with a game the only thing left to keep me going is usually the story or just stubbornness in wanting to finish it.

Stamina was a non issue i had stuff that gives me great stamina when creating the character.

You know a game is terrible when you can only land 1 hit point blank out of around 30 swipes with a massive sword lol, and they can hit you as much as they like.

Almost like they did this purposely to inflate a sense of difficulty, it's just RNG.. useless and annoying.

 

[UglyDuckling]

Opinions are mixed as always. "Rose-tinted glasses" may overlook some faults out of nostalgia (ie, focus on happy memories of playing such an open-world game for the first time after a stream of 90's linear FPS's vs technical issues). OTOH, if this is your first time playing you will be obviously more critical of it vs release as you'll be unfairly subconsciously judging a 2002 game by 2012-2017 standards.

"Rose-tinted glasses" aside, it's still widely liked because it isn't dumbed down. There's no giant arrow pointing you where to go, you have to listen to instructions. One of the saddest things about Oblivion's hand-holding was it was a "response" to "I don't know what to do" of the first mission in Morrowind (suffered only by those not listening during the intro). There was no enemy level scaling - if you insisted on entering a "difficult" cave, too bad. Oblivion onwards tended to over-compensate on making every enemy exactly match your level no matter how much you levelled up. As for it ageing, all +15 year old games age, but it's more than playable as are many other early 2000's games, especially with a large modding community behind it. It's an Elder Scrolls game, which means both mods are a necessity and it'll always be "part-quirky" but once modded, it looks pretty good for a 2002 game, especially if you're comparing it to 9 years newer cr*p like DA2.

Some aspects of the Morrowind -> Oblivion -> Skyrim 'evolution' were improved. Eg, removing Medium armor and streamlining a few of the skills didn't bother me. Visibly flagging stolen items in the inventory was another welcome improvement. Others were downgraded (eg, the non SkyUI / DarnifiedUI modded stock Oblivion / Skyrim UI is fugly as hell consolization on a PC). Likewise, I found Morrowind highly atmospheric because you were in Dunmer-land, and treated with far more suspicion and hostility if not playing as a Dark Elf vs playing as a non-Imperial in Oblivion / non-Nord in Skyrim. Likewise, some Morrowind villages looked and felt really different as a culture in different geographical regions, eg, Tel Branora Telvanni architecture vs Vivec's canals vs the normal "generic Elder Scrolls stone houses". In Oblivion most diversity had to be modded in (Unique Landscapes) and much of that architectural diversity vanished in Skyrim where a house is a house is a house... And yes, that soundtrack is just magical.

Like all games, it has its goods and its bads, and compared to what it brought at the time vs almost entirely linear games only a few years older, no it really wasn't overrated for what it tried (and mostly succeeded) in doing. The only real problem for 2002 released games is that the late 90's / early 2000's were such damn fine years for games releases...

Been playing Tomb Raider 1 from 1996 that's on Twitch too... a well made game that still holds up thanks to my own nostalgia and patience with the archaic controls.

I have to admit, 50% of it is just pure nostalgia and reliving a moment from the past.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/140026722

It's not logic.

 

[Igo69]

It was fun back in the day but I would not play it now.

 

[ImpulsE69]

The combat in all of the ES series is horrid. MW was a great game for exploration. I can understand why people who never played it back then might not care for it. That being said Oblivion was 10x worse than MW

 

[DaveSimmons]

The landscapes were amazing for the time. It was worth going into the wilderness and watching a sunset just for the view.

Alchemy was interesting, as was crafting enchanted items using spells and soul gems.

Factions were reasonably well done, especially for the time.

Exploration was fun, and as mentioned already it was nice not to have everything raise or lower itself to your level. Wander into the wrong cave as a low-level and you're today's main dish.

Combat was a bit clunky but I'd say that about most real-time FPS-style sword-fighting games.

 

[Rebel_L]

Stamina was a non issue i had stuff that gives me great stamina when creating the character.

You know a game is terrible when you can only land 1 hit point blank out of around 30 swipes with a massive sword lol, and they can hit you as much as they like.

Almost like they did this purposely to inflate a sense of difficulty, it's just RNG.. useless and annoying.

I dont recall the names of all the stats, but I think it was a green bar, it depletes if you place your character in run mode and move or jump or fight. If the bar is empty at the start of a fight it can be rather rough as I believe low whatever its called greatly increases your miss rate, as does low weapon skill, fighting high level mobs, or a few other things. If your first response to having a hard time in a game isnt to try and figure out how to overcome the obstacle you are going to have a rather rough time with many older games in general as they tended to not have extensive tutorials at the beginning or the game, good game companies tended to include the information you needed in the manuals though, I always remember reading manuals before starting to play back then, installing did usually take a while

For some old games its really hard to find the information to learn about how the game works other than with a lot of trial and error, a game like morrowind though with its own massive wiki has an abundance of information available as to how the combat formulas work if you do not want to learn them from playing around in the game itself.

 

[Stuka87]

Its just yet another game that doesnt age well. Many 3d games from the early 2000's had pretty much mechanics. Back then we didn't know any better, now we do.

 

[UglyDuckling]

I dont recall the names of all the stats, but I think it was a green bar, it depletes if you place your character in run mode and move or jump or fight. If the bar is empty at the start of a fight it can be rather rough as I believe low whatever its called greatly increases your miss rate, as does low weapon skill, fighting high level mobs, or a few other things. If your first response to having a hard time in a game isnt to try and figure out how to overcome the obstacle you are going to have a rather rough time with many older games in general as they tended to not have extensive tutorials at the beginning or the game, good game companies tended to include the information you needed in the manuals though, I always remember reading manuals before starting to play back then, installing did usually take a while

For some old games its really hard to find the information to learn about how the game works other than with a lot of trial and error, a game like morrowind though with its own massive wiki has an abundance of information available as to how the combat formulas work if you do not want to learn them from playing around in the game itself.

One of the negatives of digital store fronts

If i come across a hard copy of Morrowind i will pick it up.

 

[snarfbot]

you can get a spell to conjure a sword in the first minutes of the game, smooth sailing from then on.

 

[frowertr]

Baulders Gate is even worse. Its a steaming pile of crap and people loved it back then too.

 

[DaveSimmons]

Not to mention Citizen Kane, Seven Samurai and Singin' in the Rain. Losers! SAD!

 

[BSim500]

Been playing Tomb Raider 1 from 1996 that's on Twitch too... a well made game that still holds up thanks to my own nostalgia and patience with the archaic controls.

I still replay a ton of old games myself (more than new ones). You have to remember though that Morrowind is Elder Scrolls 3. ES 1 & 2 (Arena and Daggerfall) were extremely primitive games whose gameplay was more in line with early dungeon crawler stuff like Eye of the Beholder. As others have mentioned, it was a huge leap forward for the time.

If you played these games when you were younger, you'll naturally pick up the game better than if you didn't. I've experienced exactly the same issue in reverse - I played all the Elder Scrolls from Arena, but didn't play any of the Tomb Raiders for years, and now I just can't play TR1 (or others like Bloodrayne or Shadow Man) as if they were new. Depending on personal taste, replaying some games simply requires a "nostalgia hook" (pre-existing familiarity) be present that if you missed them the first time around, will cause you to focus almost entirely on the problems instead of the memories. Biggest mistake I made RPG-wise was playing Neverwinter Nights before Baldur's Gate. It's nearly all nostalgia that overlooks the latter's "takes up half the screen" clunky interface, yet if I had played them the other way around I probably wouldn't notice it anywhere near as much...

Morrowind's combat was always clunky, the Cliff Racer's were annoying, and it had more than its fair share of bugs. But it was the other stuff, ie, "the ability to mod it as you please" that Oblivion / Skyrim are simply continuations of, the lack of levelling that really made you tread carefully going into a cave (something that's lost if no matter what level you are you know enemies will be the same in later games). It was also "gaming the game" that was fun, ie, finding exploits, pulling off stuff like this or seeing how high you could stack alchemy / enchantments (creating potions to create Fortify Alchemy enchantments used to create super potions to create super-mega enchantments, etc), which was heavily nerfed in Oblivion / Skyrim. More "balanced". Sure. More fun? Nah.

Really though, if you're not enjoying it don't force it. You may or may not come back to it later. No worries if you don't. We all get specific old games we can't pick up for the first time 15 years on yet have no problem with playing others for the first time of the same release year.

 

[Crumpet]

I can't say I particularly enjoyed Morrowind. I spent an awful lot of time being lost and then finally dying to something that flew.

Your system isn't holding up well in those twitch streams though...

 

[tamz_msc]

Morrowind isn't overrated. On the contrary, every Bethesda RPG since Morrowind is overrated, at least that is what I feel anyway. It was the last time Ken Rolston was fully devoted to an Elder Scrolls title, and ever since Oblivion, where he had a lot less significant role in its design, the sequels have degenerated and nowadays every Bethesda RPG just panders to the least common denominator.

Think about it: Grand Theft Auto is now synonymous with 'sandbox game where you use cheat codes to blow stuff'- nobody cares about the 80's vibe of Vice City or the storytelling of San Andreas.

Similarly, Elder Scrolls games, just like the new Fallouts, are synonymous with 'those games where there are a gazillion mods'. Everything is secondary, as long as Bethesda allows you to mod the game as you please.

I would like people to watch these videos to see where I'm coming from.

 

[UglyDuckling]

I can't say I particularly enjoyed Morrowind. I spent an awful lot of time being lost and then finally dying to something that flew.

Your system isn't holding up well in those twitch streams though...

Not my system that's the internet...

Game is solid and smooth on my end, my internet is crap.

 

[UglyDuckling]

Morrowind isn't overrated. On the contrary, every Bethesda RPG since Morrowind is overrated, at least that is what I feel anyway. It was the last time Ken Rolston was fully devoted to an Elder Scrolls title, and ever since Oblivion, where he had a lot less significant role in its design, the sequels have degenerated and nowadays every Bethesda RPG just panders to the least common denominator.

Think about it: Grand Theft Auto is now synonymous with 'sandbox game where you use cheat codes to blow stuff'- nobody cares about the 80's vibe of Vice City or the storytelling of San Andreas.

Similarly, Elder Scrolls games, just like the new Fallouts, are synonymous with 'those games where there are a gazillion mods'. Everything is secondary, as long as Bethesda allows you to mod the game as you please.

I would like people to watch these videos to see where I'm coming from.

Videos just make the game look like the be all end all like 99% of the fanbase around the game.

Looks great to watch, in reality a chore only masochists could enjoy.

Nothing is actually mentioned about just how badly some things in Morrowind cripple it's playibility.

The guy mentions it's "wonky combat" he don't put it down like he should be doing due to ass licking the community around him, it's a video, videos generate views, views generate pocket money from YouTube.

It's just a big circle jerk.

 

[DisarmedDespot]

Maybe I'm crazy, but... I actually prefer Morrowind's combat to Skyrim and Oblivion's. Combat in the new elder scrolls games really isn't any deeper outside of blocking being active. If anything, I find it more annoying since even a basic attack is some massive flourish that swings the player's view about. Then again, I'm coming from an older RPG background, so combat being basically a skill check isn't an issue for me.

 

[UglyDuckling]

Maybe I'm crazy, but... I actually prefer Morrowind's combat to Skyrim and Oblivion's. Combat in the new elder scrolls games really isn't any deeper outside of blocking being active. If anything, I find it more annoying since even a basic attack is some massive flourish that swings the player's view about. Then again, I'm coming from an older RPG background, so combat being basically a skill check isn't an issue for me.

VS

This is like having the opinion that square wheels are some how better than round ones...

A good job the people behind the idea are long dead and buried.

Skyrim video is my own, it was meant as a funny video, hence the sarcastic title.

 

[DaveSimmons]

I don't recall having problems with the combat, but it has been 15 years. You're making me want to reinstall it to see whether or not you just need to "git gud"

 

[sandorski]

Haven't played Morrowind, but some games are best played in the context of when they were released. I couldn't be bothered to play Wolfenstein 3D again, but at the time it was new it was the most awesome game ever.

 

[Crono]

There were a lot of flaws with the game (aforementioned cliff racers were the worst *shudder*), it's the story and atmosphere that made it worth it.