Any reason why Apple's mobile products don't support drag and drop?

[poofyhairguy]

Jailbreaking is just as easy as rooting your device if not easier.

No way. I have done both on a lot of different devices and rooting is easier to manage.

With Jailbreaking, if the current version of iOS doesn't have a Jailbreak is not easy its impossible because you can't install old firmwares. Meanwhile on Android either root exploits cover many firmware versions, or the actual devices themselves allow you to rollback to an earlier firmware update that is rootable.

With rooting you can keep the root when you get software update with OTA rootkeeper. Imagine if in the Jailbreaking world there was a way to plant a Jailbreak trojan on the device so even after you updated to the firmware version that "just exists to screw jailbreakers" you still have jailbreak. You can do that with root and Android. WAY WAY better then having to wait for the Jailbreak windows.

I won't argue that the Jailbreak development community isn't larger and they probably have some cool tricks Android doesn't have, but when comparing Jailbreaking and rooting Jailbreaking is by far a bigger pain in the ass.

 

[ControlD]

Well there you go

lol.

Don't get me wrong, I am quite happy with my jailbroken iPhone I just wish I could do things like add home screen widgets or set my default apps without needing it.

Out of curiosity and a bit more back on topic you mentioned that nobody in the jailbreak community uses iTunes. How are you managing your media without iTunes (music, videos and books)?

**Edit: Missed the iTools suggestion. I will check that out. ***

 

[pm]

iTunes blows. But for the most part you don't need to use iTunes. I've had iPods and iPhones and iPads and rarely had to use iTunes. iTools is one of the latest and greatest in a long line of iTunes alternatives that make the grief of using iTunes a non-issue.

iTools does everything iTunes does and more

http://itools.hk/en_index.htm

I tried iTools last night and you are right - it's awesome. It's fast, it's easy, it works really well. I plan on using it instead of iTunes from here on out. Thanks for the suggestion!

That said, I really don't agree that iTunes "blows". It's not my favorite piece of software, but I'll still use it to buy stuff and it looks like if you want to do a iPhone/iPad back up, iTools just launches iTunes. iTunes is ok... but iTools is better.

 

[AMDZen]

lol.

Don't get me wrong, I am quite happy with my jailbroken iPhone I just wish I could do things like add home screen widgets or set my default apps without needing it.

Out of curiosity and a bit more back on topic you mentioned that nobody in the jailbreak community uses iTunes. How are you managing your media without iTunes (music, videos and books)?

You can do what you are talking about in that first sentence, its called "Dreamboard" and is an alternative to "Winterboard" which you are obviously using. Dreamboard can configure the iPhone a miriad of different ways but some of the themes are buggy. There are several themes that are not buggy though and if you want widgets I suggest installing one of the several that support them. Then widgets are found to support that dreamboard theme, there are several with tons of widgets already written for them.

This is the best forum with all of that information

http://modmyi.com/forums/new-skins-themes-launches/

I have used a miriad of different apps over the years but currently the best one IMO is iTools. I referenced it earlier in this thread.

Can be found here

http://itools.hk/en_index.htm

In the past I have also used SharePod. This one allows you to just manage music and is really useful but again, iTools does everything now which has made a lot of the other tools unneeded any longer. iFun-box is a tool you should also get to know but again, really all you need is iTools now

 

[AMDZen]

I tried iTools last night and you are right - it's awesome. It's fast, it's easy, it works really well. I plan on using it instead of iTunes from here on out. Thanks for the suggestion!

That said, I really don't agree that iTunes "blows". It's not my favorite piece of software, but I'll still use it to buy stuff and it looks like if you want to do a iPhone/iPad back up, iTools just launches iTunes. iTunes is ok... but iTools is better.

I honestly think that iTunes is one of the single worst pieces of software on the PC today. On a Mac it runs great. On my hackintosh it runs great, in OSX. In windows it runs terribly and I don't understand what Apple did to code it so poorly for the windows OS.

But any way. That is a personal preference and one that is echoed by so many - I honestly think its a huge problem for Apple and I think they should put some better coders on it as I think that is a reason why a lot of people hate Apple.

Luckily there has always been tools like iTools which is just the latest in a long line that are alternatives to iTunes

 

[AMDZen]

No way. I have done both on a lot of different devices and rooting is easier to manage.

With Jailbreaking, if the current version of iOS doesn't have a Jailbreak is not easy its impossible because you can't install old firmwares. Meanwhile on Android either root exploits cover many firmware versions, or the actual devices themselves allow you to rollback to an earlier firmware update that is rootable.

With rooting you can keep the root when you get software update with OTA rootkeeper. Imagine if in the Jailbreaking world there was a way to plant a Jailbreak trojan on the device so even after you updated to the firmware version that "just exists to screw jailbreakers" you still have jailbreak. You can do that with root and Android. WAY WAY better then having to wait for the Jailbreak windows.

I won't argue that the Jailbreak development community isn't larger and they probably have some cool tricks Android doesn't have, but when comparing Jailbreaking and rooting Jailbreaking is by far a bigger pain in the ass.

Again, you are clearly not nearly as familiar with the Jailbreak world as you think you are. If you accidently update to a version of iOS that you can't jailbreak and you were jailbroken before, you can go back to the last version that is "jailbreakable" with the SHSH blobs that cydia saves for you.

We will just agree to disagree on your last sentence. It is not more of a PITA and frankly, I have no idea why you are arguing that it is. I think a lot of people will have to wait to root android devices too. The SGS4 is supposedly locked on AT&T and you will have to wait until its hacked.

 

[poofyhairguy]

Again, you are clearly not nearly as familiar with the Jailbreak world as you think you are. If you accidently update to a version of iOS that you can't jailbreak and you were jailbroken before, you can go back to the last version that is "jailbreakable" with the SHSH blobs that cydia saves for you.

Yeah, but imagine instead of having to go back you could stay on the newest firmware version AND keep jailbreak.

We will just agree to disagree on your last sentence. It is not more of a PITA and frankly, I have no idea why you are arguing that it is. I think a lot of people will have to wait to root android devices too. The SGS4 is supposedly locked on AT&T and you will have to wait until its hacked.

Yeah, but once that SGS4 exploit is found those users will be able to install every firmware upgrade (without wiping) and still keep root. Not having to avoid updates is why I say rooting is less of a PITA.

Part of it is, they are on a different level.

Rooting is simply getting complete control of your Android device. It doesn't unlock new app stores or install new software repositories you couldn't.

 

[ControlD]

You can do what you are talking about in that first sentence, its called "Dreamboard" and is an alternative to "Winterboard" which you are obviously using. Dreamboard can configure the iPhone a miriad of different ways but some of the themes are buggy. There are several themes that are not buggy though and if you want widgets I suggest installing one of the several that support them. Then widgets are found to support that dreamboard theme, there are several with tons of widgets already written for them.

I ran Dreamboard for awhile before going back to Winterboard.

What I meant in my earlier post was that I wish I could add widgets and do things like set my default browser or maps program without the need of a jailbreak in the first place. I realize that is just wishful thinking, but at the same time I find myself wondering if it is all worth it. I have to believe there will be a day, probably not too far in the future, when Apple has closed enough loopholes to prevent successful jailbreaks. When I got my 4S there was a decent period of time (a few months) before any jailbreak was available for it. If I ever have to go back to stock iOS on my phone that is probably the last time I will be using it.

 

[Zaap]

And android doesn't allow you to do everything you want to do without rooting it. It goes both ways.

It's been addressed, but the things I mentioned are BASIC computing functions and don't require root on Android devices to accomplish.

Apple's on the wrong side of even what their own hype promotes: if mobile devices are going to further replace desktop computers, then they need more (not fewer) desktop-like features.

 

[AMDZen]

I ran Dreamboard for awhile before going back to Winterboard.

What I meant in my earlier post was that I wish I could add widgets and do things like set my default browser or maps program without the need of a jailbreak in the first place. I realize that is just wishful thinking, but at the same time I find myself wondering if it is all worth it. I have to believe there will be a day, probably not too far in the future, when Apple has closed enough loopholes to prevent successful jailbreaks. When I got my 4S there was a decent period of time (a few months) before any jailbreak was available for it. If I ever have to go back to stock iOS on my phone that is probably the last time I will be using it.

First bold: And I find that argument rediculous. Especially when used as a comparisson between iOS and Android. People out there wish they could run a custom rom without having to root too. I don't because I understand that manufacturers will always try to lock me down and I have fun hacking everything and playing with everything. That is part of the thrill for me.

I love tinkering with everything and most techy people do. Why you would want that is beyond me. Frankly, it just makes zero sense. I'm not sure how you can be a tech nerd on a forum talking about this all day and not be the same person that enjoyed messing around with your iPhone jailbreak and all the themes and things. In fact I know you did because you would have had to or you wouldn't have done it.

To the 2nd bolded part: I also find that preposterous. The hacking community and people like me are simple too prevalent. They may be able to be ahead of hackers at some time, but hackers will eventually catch up. I know for an absolute fact that there are 2-3 holes in current iOS software that Apple doesn't know about, and as I said earlier in this thread - the jailbreak community is simply saving for iOS 7 because there is absolutely NO REASON TO show Apple their cards right now with a new iOS revision expected this summer. It makes no sense.

My Xbox is JTAG'd my PS3 is jailbroken, newly on ReBug BTW, all fresh and awesome. My Nintendo DS is hacked. I've hacked every console I've owned since the PS1 and I will hack every one in the future most likely. Hackers and tweakers will always persist, even when manufacturers have an advantage as Sony did for a while there after the initial period of time when hackers were two steps ahead of them.

 

[Red Storm]

Wanting to be able to change the default apps and utilize widgets is ridiculous?

 

[AMDZen]

Wanting to be able to change the default apps and utilize widgets is ridiculous?

I honestly don't think you understand what I was saying. Functionality wise, of course that isn't rediculous. But for people like me, and him too as he proved he is the same - it doesn't make a difference. There will always be something that we want default that isn't there. Whether its android or iOS. That is why the hacking community is there, for both OS's, and why they will always be there. To get functionality we want that isn't included.

 

[ControlD]

I honestly don't think you understand what I was saying. Functionality wise, of course that isn't rediculous. But for people like me, and him too as he proved he is the same - it doesn't make a difference. There will always be something that we want default that isn't there. Whether its android or iOS. That is why the hacking community is there, for both OS's, and why they will always be there. To get functionality we want that isn't included.

Yeah, you do have a point. I have so many tweaks to my phone right now I suppose simply getting a few features gifted from Apple probably wouldn't remove my desire to jailbreak. I hadn't really thought of it that way before.

 

[poofyhairguy]

People out there wish they could run a custom rom without having to root too.

If the bootloader isn't locked you can skip root and jump straight to ROM. That is really nice to do, its like OSes are on a real computer.

To the 2nd bolded part: I also find that preposterous. The hacking community and people like me are simple too prevalent.

Very true.

My Xbox is JTAG'd my PS3 is jailbroken, newly on ReBug BTW, all fresh and awesome. My Nintendo DS is hacked. I've hacked every console I've owned since the PS1 and I will hack every one in the future most likely. Hackers and tweakers will always persist, even when manufacturers have an advantage as Sony did for a while there after the initial period of time when hackers were two steps ahead of them.

Amen I love my hacked devices and consoles.

 

[Zaap]

Please, I don't buy the "gee, I'm so glad it's limited and locked down so I can have fun hacking it" line of reasoning for one minute.

Personally, I don't like the fact that my Galaxy phones have been more locked down on Verizon than on other carriers. There's been nothing particularly fun about having to wait longer for exploits when others haven't had that. It'd be even worse if I had to wait for exploits for what should simply be standard features.

Everyone enjoying the challenge of your locked down devices, I want to see your unlocked ATV3. I know quite a few people that want to know how you did it, and how much fun it was.

 

[ControlD]

Please, I don't buy the "gee, I'm so glad it's limited and locked down so I can have fun hacking it" line of reasoning for one minute.

I agree with you. I do wish that Apple was more open with their platform, and I especialy wish that many of the features I jailbreak for were standard or at least options from third-party developers. If nothing else I have to think that the quality of things like widgets would go up if it was an officially supported feature with real hooks into the operating system. At the same time, I do find the hacking to be fun for the most part and I would probably still jailbreak in any case.

 

[ChAoTiCpInOy]

The way I think of it is. They don't support drag and drop because of the sandbox nature of apps on the App Store. If they allowed full drag and drop, any apps could drop anything into other applications which may cause problems.

 

[ponyo]

Again, you are clearly not nearly as familiar with the Jailbreak world as you think you are. If you accidently update to a version of iOS that you can't jailbreak and you were jailbroken before, you can go back to the last version that is "jailbreakable" with the SHSH blobs that cydia saves for you.

We will just agree to disagree on your last sentence. It is not more of a PITA and frankly, I have no idea why you are arguing that it is. I think a lot of people will have to wait to root android devices too. The SGS4 is supposedly locked on AT&T and you will have to wait until its hacked.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2313675
Saved SHSH blobs don't work on A5/A6 devices with iOS6. So you can't go back unless you're using iPhone 4, iPad1, or Apple TV2 with A4.

 

[QueBert]

Why should they? It isn't necessary. You can use whatever media management software you wish or just a simple file manager.

I echo what has been said already. If you know you want to do things that require a jailbreak, just forget it and get something Android instead. It takes longer and longer for each jailbreak to be released these days and it's always a PITA to update. There are tons of great JB apps out there but the hassle just seems silly when there is another option that works out of the box.

I totally disagree, there is no all in 1 iTunes like program for Android. I have a Nexus 4, which has 2.1 gigs free, I don't have anywhere close to enough room to do a Nandbackup. I have found a few XDA made applications. They range from a PITA to use, to nearly impossible. For managing music? Well, I could use Doubletwist, which whichever company made it did everything they could to copy iTunes. 'Cept the program is buggy, and overall sucks. And as difficult as it was to backup my Nexus with ADB Backup, it was infinitely harder when I actually had to restore my backup.

I could accomplish mostly everything iTunes can do, but to do so I'll need multiple programs. And at best some of them aren't very good. With my iPhone I can use iExplorer and drag and drop until my hearts content, but if I want to use iTunes I still can. With my Nexus, I can use ADB backup, or Halo Backup or whatever they call it, oh and a host of other programs.

IMHO being able to completely back up my phone is necessary, but apparently Google doesn't seem to agree with me. And maybe it's just me, but a large, but still incomplete cloud backup that would take me hours to restore isn't really an acceptable solution *shrug*

 

[MrX8503]

Really? No hardware decoder sounds like it sucks. No DTS sucks too for the other option (a TON of my movie mkvs have DTS tracks).

What blows my mind is that the XBMC on my wife's iPad 2 can play almost everything in my huge library. DTS, Dolby, high bitrates, odd encodes. Its terrible anything in the walled garden is so much worse on the same hardware.

Honestly if I wasn't going to Jailbreak an iPad, I would just use Air Video for everything and let a computer convert to Apple's level of approval on the fly.

A normal person isn't going to fiddle with xbmc or air video.

I use air video btw to transcode from a server. Most people don't have this setup though.

 

[poofyhairguy]

I totally disagree, there is nfull o all in 1 iTunes like program for Android. I have a Nexus 4, which has 2.1 gigs free, I don't have anywhere close to enough room to do a Nandbackup. I have found a few XDA made applications. They range from a PITA to use, to nearly impossible. For managing music? Well, I could use Doubletwist, which whichever company made it did everything they could to copy iTunes. 'Cept the program is buggy, and overall sucks. And as difficult as it was to backup my Nexus with ADB Backup, it was infinitely harder when I actually had to restore my backup.

I could accomplish mostly everything iTunes can do, but to do so I'll need multiple programs. And at best some of them aren't very good. With my iPhone I can use iExplorer and drag and drop until my hearts content, but if I want to use iTunes I still can. With my Nexus, I can use ADB backup, or Halo Backup or whatever they call it, oh and a host of other programs.

IMHO being able to completely back up my phone is necessary, but apparently Google doesn't seem to agree with me. And maybe it's just me, but a large, but still incomplete cloud backup that would take me hours to restore isn't really an acceptable solution *shrug*

Um so basically your complaint is your phone is too full so you can't do a nandroid backup?

Delete some stuff.

 

[QueBert]

Um so basically your complaint is your phone is too full so you can't do a nandroid backup?

Delete some stuff.

That was one of my complaints, yes. I shouldn't have to delete anything, I don't have this problem with my "ZOMG walled in can't do shit!" iOS device. I plug my iPhone into my PC and as soon as iTunes opens it creates a full backup, without me having to delete shit. It also auto syncs my smart playlists. iTunes makes everything simple, with Android you have to fend for yourself and use multiple programs. None of which Google provides. Why do I have to do all this to accomplish simple shit that could be done every time I plug my phone into my computer? Apple got this part right, Google I guess wants people to go on XDA and find an assortment of hacker made apps to get from point a to b.

 

[poofyhairguy]

That was one of my complaints, yes. I shouldn't have to delete anything

Agreed. I think they shouldn't even sell 16GB phones nowadays.

 

[MrX8503]

iPhone users don't have to connect to iTunes much anymore with the use of iCloud. I don't remember the last time I connected.

 

[thunng8]

Really? No hardware decoder sounds like it sucks. No DTS sucks too for the other option (a TON of my movie mkvs have DTS tracks).

Its not good that they had to drop DTS. I've kept the previous version that has it and not updating it. Best media player I've ever tried on iOS (jailbreak or non-jailbreak) - Even a lot better than XBMC.