Any other Democrats here who can't stand Nancy Pelosi?
- Thread starter RaistlinZ
- Start date
BoomerD
No Lifer
- Feb 26, 2006
- 66,559
- 14,960
- 146
I'm a life-long Democrat AND a Kahleeforneeyan...and I'm not crazy about the lady. She's far too liberal for my tastes...
As for the clout, keep in mind that while the Dems hold a majority in the House, it's still a slim majority...not nearly enough to force any legislation.
As for the clout, keep in mind that while the Dems hold a majority in the House, it's still a slim majority...not nearly enough to force any legislation.
AstroManLuca
Lifer
- Jun 24, 2004
- 15,628
- 5
- 81
She's a good part of the reason Congress only has a 9% approval rating despite there being more Democrats than Republicans in this country.
I like her. She's one of the only actual liberals we have in Congress. Most Democrats are center-right, and that's not really to my liking. As far as her being an ineffective Speaker, in what way do you mean? I can think of only one piece of major legislation that had trouble in the House, that being the bailout bill...which eventually passed. Every other significant thing she's wanted to get passed, she's done. I think she's been a fine speaker, one of the most powerful in my memory.
The only thing she didn't do that I wish she had done was impeach Bush; not because I think it would have removed him from office, but as a message to future presidents (Obama included) that executive power isn't this out of control anymore.
I am not a Democrat (or a Republican for that matter), but I do think she has done a pretty poor job as Speaker.
All I've seen in this thread is a bunch of generalities. What has she done poorly as speaker? Be specific.
First
Lifer
- Jun 3, 2002
- 10,518
- 271
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1) Failed to rally the House to get the bailout passed initially, getting only 60% of Dems to go along with her the first time around. She also angered Republicans with a totally unnecessary partisan speech just before that first vote.
2) Besides minimum wage and recently drilling (both solid accomplishments), hasn't actually done much of anything in the House nor has she shown any real leadership in terms of getting Republicans to play nice. She's as left as they come so she's naturally not a good fit for Speaker, yet there she is.
3) Most importantly, didn't actually get the U.S. out of the war in Iraq. As pathetic as George Bush is, she is partially culpable.
1.) So your first ding against her is that she got the bailout bill passed a bit less than a week after she first brought it up. Really? If you're buying the idea that people voted against the bill because she made a speech that made them sad... I don't know what to tell you. That's ridiculous.
2.) The roadblock for most of this legislation has absolutely nothing to do with the House, it is the Senate. If the Democrats bring up a whole load of bills, all of which go down to defeat due to Republican filibusters (and rest assured they will), it accomplishes nothing and makes the Democratic leadership look bad. Remember, bills need to pass both chambers. The chamber that's a problem is the Senate, not the House.
If you can point me to some legislation that the Senate was on track to pass but was unable to do so due to Pelosi's inability to rally the House, please list them.
3.) I view this as a virtue instead of a vice. I want us out of Iraq as much as anyone, but due to the childish behavior of Bush and the Congressional Republicans the only way to get the US out of Iraq was to refuse to issue any more spending bills. That would lead to chaos. Someone had to act like an adult in that situation, and I'm glad that the Democrats did.
I feel like most of your objections are coming from not really looking closely at what has been going on in Congress, and assigning blame that should be placed on the Senate and Harry Reid/Senate Republicans to Nancy Pelosi.
I have mixed feelings aoub her. I like her getting ethics reforms started and getting the minimum wage passed, long blocked by Republicans, and some other things. I don't like that I don't think she's done that well selling the American people on the Democrats' policies, leaving Democrats in the weak 'not those screwup Republicans' position, and her compromises on things from impeachment to amnesty to not pursuing alternatives to the bailout.
However, she has had the House pass a variety of legislation blocked by the more conservative Senate - and give up on some because of that - she gets credit for.
For the record, after the amnesty situation, I asked my Congressman to push for a new speaker.
To respond to the post above:
1. You are not holding the Republicans adequately responsible, and the story on the bailout bill shows the problems with the members - to get it passed, the $110B in added pork got many members of both parties to pass it. Blame them. I don't take it as a ding on her not to get it passed - you seem to have reasons both self-interested and your views why you are strongly in favor of that Wall Street bailout, but I think you are wrong to condemn those who voteed against it, and her for not focing them - members who opposed it with and without the pork, like Stark and Kucinich. I don't *want* a dictatorship in the House where the speaker can push anything through - the people are supposed to be represented, not ignored while the Speaker runs the nation.
2. I think you *again* as in every time you comment on anything relevant do not assign the proper blame to the Republicans. Having lost Congress *they adopted a political strategy to 'burn the house down'* by trying to be obstructionist to deny the Democrats much to say they got done and run on in 2008 - and then to blame the Democrats for not passing things. I also disagree with you about her being 'too liberal'. IMO she is not liberal enough, but we could do a lot worse. There are progressive and corporatist factions in the Democratic party. We need to ensure that the corporatists don't take over the party and that's going to get a lot harder now as they gain power and the corporatists increase the lobbying and money.
3. From what I've seen, between the veto and the Senate, she has passed some things towards endig the war that got shot down, and there wasn't much point to repeating that.
The criticism seems partly fair, but I'd put her after the president and the Senate on the issue.
Budmantom
Lifer
- Aug 17, 2002
- 13,103
- 1
- 81
Didn't she pledge to get the price of gas down?
Didn't she claim that they would have a longer work week, most ethical congress. She (they) have the lowest approval rating, she made sure congress couldn't vote on an energy bill and promptly went on a vacation plus the economy just took a dump right after they took office.
Is that specific enough?
Lieberman isn't in the House.
In the House, a simple majority is the main thing; in the Senate, a filibuster proof majority is a lot more helpful.
However, the democratic majority in the House is limited from the 'blue dogs'. We need to elect progressive democrats.
No, not at all. That's mostly false attribution. They have had a longer work week than the previous Congress, they've had less pork than the previous Congress, and they enacted ethics reform. While I don't think that all exactly measures up to the 'most ethical Congress ever', it's certainly an improvement.
As for the economy taking a dump immediately after the new Congress sat, not even the most stupid and rabid partisans would blame the state of the economy on people who have been sitting in office for a month or two. (with you being the lone exception apparently)
So basically you have her refusing to pass an energy bill you liked. WHOA! That's big time bad stuff right there!
Guys, as I said before, Congress has 2 chambers and an actively hostile executive branch. What is Pelosi going to 'get done' in the House that won't be immediately vetoed/filibustered?
I know it sounds all well and good to say she should 'get things done', but what does that even mean? Pass meaningless bills to be filibustered and vetoed, thus draining her political capital and embarrassing her? Why would she do that?
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