Any experiences with ECS motherboards?

[Ken90630]

Do any of you out there have any experience using ECS (that's the brand name) motherboards? I'm considering building a spare, VERY INEXPENSIVE computer just for Web surfing & e-mail (and for experimenting on). Fry's Electronics here in So Cal has been advertising an ECS mobo with an Athlon XP 2200 for $59. That chip would be plenty fast enough for what I'd be doing (and I'd have 128 or 256 MB of RAM), so all I'm really concerned with is the reliability of this motherboard. If it'll work right out of the box and last, say, 3 or 4 years, I'll be happy.

Any comments or experiences, good or bad, on entry-level ECS motherboards, anyone? Thanks.

Ken

 

[mechBgon]

ECS gets mixed reviews. There are lots of them sold, so there are lots of them griped about when there's a problem. Compounding the problem, people use whatever scrapheap power supply and RAM they can get a cheap price on. What model of motherboard is it?

 

[Buz2b]

I've built several with the older K7S5A and a couple with the K7S5A pro. I've had no problem that I didn't create myself. You just have to keep a couple of things in mind. First, do not use a "cut-rate" power supply or RAM. Get a decent quality (that doesn't mean expensive though) power supply like this one (or the 350 watt model) and something like Crucial RAM (decent price, good quality). However, the more recent offerings from Fry's have had the ECS K7VTA3 MB and I don't have any experience with that particular board.
You will find some folks that will not speak well of ECS. However, the K7S5A was one of the most heavily sold retail boards in recent history. You're bound to get a bad one here and there when you sell that many. Personally, I would have no problems using one again. I built three systems for family members using the K7S5A and to this day they are still going strong (aprox. 3 years). I would hardly have done so if I didn't trust them. I say go for it.

 

[Bonesdad]

This sounds like the perfect use for the ECS board. It's probably a K7S5A Pro? It should serve you well, like mech sez, get a good power supply, but you should do that no matter what mobo you buy!

 

[Algere]

ECS 755-A is crap, I bought it when it was advertised as supporting DDR400 and later found out it doesn't work well with DDR400 and a week or so later ECS changed the specs on the 755-A board to support DDR333 & lower. Afterwards returned it back to NewEgg and got a Asus K8V Deluxe instead.

Although I read the new ECS 755-A2 revision fixes that memory problem. Unfortunately I haven't seen any in retail channels yet.

 

[ShinSa]

When my NF7S from newegg turned out to be a lemon, I had to use an ECS board that came with the XP2500+ at frys. TO my surprise, IT loaded up windows perfectly and ran various programs without a hitch.

I had the chance to mess around with the NF7S before I RMAed it back to newegg so I could compare the two boards side by side. The Abit had so many options and bells and whistles like a Upscale LEXUS. Onboard power LED indicators, metal plating around the CPU socket to protect the board, numberical LEDs for trouble shooting, IEEE 1394, Serial ATA, Dual channel memory bus.. The list goes on an on.
In comparison, the ECS felt like a stripped Civic LX. It had the most basic things on board, no fuss or frills.

Far as stability is concerned, I would never doubt ECS again. Abit and Asus are considered one of the top boards for enthusiasts and even they've had their fine share of problems.

ECS is a "BUDGET" board so don't go around looking for any luxury options. However, just becasuse something is cheap doesnt necessarily mean stability is compromised.


Now one thing I imediately noticed was that the on board sound quality was much worst than my Sound Blaster Live. I had to crank up the speaker knob much higher in order to obtain the same amount of volume. Even then the sound quality was noticeably bad.

 

[o1die]

I use that board with a duron 1.6. It took 5 different boards to come up with one that worked with this cpu. It should work better with the xp2200. If you have any problems, save all your packaging materials and receipt, and swap it. Some Fry's employees may give you a hard time, but most will exchange it without any hassles. As previously suggested, you'll have fewer problems with a name brand power supply (sparkle-fortron, enermax, antec, etc). I use mushkin memory, which is available at Fry's.

 

[Mem]

When my 4 year old MSI board died,I needed a cheap replacement for my backup PC,so I purchased an ECS K7S5A Pro and it installed without any problems,working great now for almost a year,I do use quality ram(Crucial) and Enermax PSU so no short cuts in any of my computers .

 

[SpaceWalker]

I've had 2 ECS boards running for the last 3 years. I just replace one of them when I upgraded the system. I'm running the P4ITA2 now in my main system and it's still going well. I'm about to upgrade the CPU on it and I'll probably keep running it fo another year.

ECS, Elitegroup, they make good motherboards they usually keep the prices down by not adding a lot of features on the board. Usually the most you'll find is onboard audio. They mostly run very stable.

 

[Peter]

ECS is about no-nonsense boards at rock bottom prices. I use them by the dozen, never found any inherent problems. General rules apply - use recognizable brand RAM, don't be cheap on the power supply, get the cooling right.

What you don't get is funny features and overclocker's toys. What you do get is good stability and performance at stock speeds.

My current favorite is L7S7A2 - at 26 euros (approx. $30), including a CardReader unit, it's hard to beat.

 

[LouPoir]

ECS = budget board. I have had a least half of dozen die on me within 6 months to a year. I invest a bit more and get an Albatron, Biostar or some other inexpensive board.

IMHO

Lou

 

[psyconius]

I have an ECS K7S5A and that is enough to make me not buy budget boards for as long as I live. I have so many strange problems randomly that are almost assuredly caused by it. As I built my friend's box and my own at the same time, using the same parts. His machine wouldn't even start until I got a new board for him. An MSI, which has no problems other than the MSI bug that doesn't allow rebooting(have to power off all the way). Mine on the other hand, has many problems. Not even getting to a BIOS screen sometimes when turning it on(and it will randomly start to work any time from the next turn on, to the next day). System reboots randomly. It also has a nice glitch that windows starts in like 640x480 4bit color(Yes, 4bit)

So they are great and cheap if you just need a spare pc sittin around, but for a main pc, stay away

 

[Peter]

... or use a power supply that is up to the job. What you describe is the classic symptoms of weak power - board not firing up at first try, dysfunctional graphics card, random reboots.
I've been using enough K7S5A boards to say that this is not an inherent problem of this board model, but rather with the fact that people who attempt to build a cheap system tend to go WAY too cheap on their choice of case and PSU. Misleading PSU advertising, particular for those that come in cheap cases, is part of that - there's a reason why the $9 "300W" PSU in that $29 case doesn't work, while a proper, really ATX 2.0 compliant, actual 300W PSU is more than $29.

I'm also willing to bet that your generic PC2100 RAM gets you tons of errors when you run www.memtest.org software ...

 

[psyconius]

Oh I don't doubt that there are other things giving me problems with the ECS board, however other boards with the same setup seem to work a little better. I did get a few warnings about PSU's when using AMD chips period.

I just also think that it isn't coincedence that a board that retails for less than $50 has problems

But I also thank you for reminding me to get a new PSU for the new machine I am building =P

 

[Peter]

Sure, the cheapest boards are less forgiving about weak PSUs. What do you like better - instant problems with a chance to do it right before something blows up, or an expensive board that irons out the power wrinkles with its excess capacitors and overengineered voltage regulators - only to be zapped, usually along with most of your peripherals, by the dying PSU that doesn't survive being overstressed all the time?

I've seen both things happen. Just NEVER push your luck when it comes to power supplies.

 

[psyconius]

Indeed

I am looking for a good case, but most come with PSU's.. And I don't want a PSU that is thrown in with a case.. I want to buy them seperate(also because I am building two of the same machines other than vid card and case, and want to keep it the same.. so need 2 PSU's from same place )

 

[mechBgon]

I only had one K7S5A, one of the very first ones, but I used it in about four different systems with everything from Durons to a 1.4GHz Tbird-C to an AthlonXP. I used nothing lower than an Antec PP-303XP power supply (300W unit from 1 generation back) and it was used 24/7 for SETI@Home or other DC projects for a lot of its lifespan. It finally stopped working a few months ago, but I think I got my money's worth out of it over the ~3 years that it ran.

 

[Peter]

Originally posted by: psyconius
Indeed

I am looking for a good case, but most come with PSU's.. And I don't want a PSU that is thrown in with a case.. I want to buy them seperate(also because I am building two of the same machines other than vid card and case, and want to keep it the same.. so need 2 PSU's from same place )

I agree, with one exception: The 400W supply that is found in a few Foxconn/Topphone cases is a really good one. Strong, exactly regulated, stable voltages, very quiet fan, plenty of connectors. Model names are TC5020 for full size ATX midi tower, and TC3020 for the microATX case. The latter happens to be about the only microATX case I know to come with a PSU that's worth more than a laugh.

ATX
microATX

Their 300W PSU found in other models is weak though.

The one brand of PSUs I learnt to stay away from is Codegen. I saw nothing but short-lived stuff with overinflated wattage numbers from them.

 

[Peter]

Well duh, newegg has exactly those cases, but with 350W and 250W power supplies, respectively. What's going on?
here and there

I guess they're fitting different PSUs for the European market ...

 

[Bonesdad]

Originally posted by: mechBgon
I only had one K7S5A, one of the very first ones, but I used it in about four different systems with everything from Durons to a 1.4GHz Tbird-C to an AthlonXP. I used nothing lower than an Antec PP-303XP power supply (300W unit from 1 generation back) and it was used 24/7 for SETI@Home or other DC projects for a lot of its lifespan. It finally stopped working a few months ago, but I think I got my money's worth out of it over the ~3 years that it ran.

Ditto here...my PSU died after 3.5 years and took out my K7S5A, My Duron CPU and my video card. The PSU? An Antec. Go figure.

Since about 80 Gazillion K7S5A have been sold, I would find it unusual NOT to see more problems than in other boards. I have built around 10 systems with this board. Mine is the first to die. Never had a problem.

Having said that, I haven't used one in about a year. There are other great budget boards out there now. Shuttle's AN35N comes to mind. But heck, a $60 CPU and K7S5A combo to be used for email and internet surfing. You'd be a fool not to get it.

 

[mechBgon]

Originally posted by: Bonesdad

Originally posted by: mechBgon
I only had one K7S5A, one of the very first ones, but I used it in about four different systems with everything from Durons to a 1.4GHz Tbird-C to an AthlonXP. I used nothing lower than an Antec PP-303XP power supply (300W unit from 1 generation back) and it was used 24/7 for SETI@Home or other DC projects for a lot of its lifespan. It finally stopped working a few months ago, but I think I got my money's worth out of it over the ~3 years that it ran.

Ditto here...my PSU died after 3.5 years and took out my K7S5A, My Duron CPU and my video card. The PSU? An Antec. Go figure.

Since about 80 Gazillion K7S5A have been sold, I would find it unusual NOT to see more problems than in other boards. I have built around 10 systems with this board. Mine is the first to die. Never had a problem.

Having said that, I haven't used one in about a year. There are other great budget boards out there now. Shuttle's AN35N comes to mind. But heck, a $60 CPU and K7S5A combo to be used for email and internet surfing. You'd be a fool not to get it.

And of course the other nice thing is that K7S5A takes SDR SDRAM as well as DDR, so people who have a lonesome stick of PC100 or PC133... yeah. In fact, my K7S5A ran my 1GHz Duron @ 1.33GHz at stock voltage with a stick of Crucial PC133 for a long time.

 

[Ken90630]

Wow. First let me say thanks to you all for the great info. I'm a new susbcriber to Anandtech.com, and I'm a bit blown away by the helpful advice & knowledge level available here. (And no, I'm not being a kiss-butt -- I sincerely mean it.)

On to the topic at hand ... I suppose I should begin with an apology for not putting the model number of the mobo in my original post. The board I'm considering is the K7VTA3. Probably would have helped to have put that in there, huh? Sorry.

I fully intend to use a decent power supply, but thanks to you all anyway for driving that point home as a reminder. I agree with you all about the importance of a good PSU (particularly in the area of STABLE output vs. peak ouput 'capability' specs that can be misleading). I didn't know about the Sparkle -- thanks, Buz2B. I'll take a look at it.

And I'm figuring on using some brand-name RAM like Kingston Value RAM, Crucial or Mushkin. I'll probably watch the ads & pick up whichever one of those that's on sale in the next week or two. On that subject: So I don't have to look it up, do any of you know what level of RAM the K7VTA3 uses optimally?

Too many interesting and good comments from you all to address individually here, so I'll just summarily say thanks again. I read them all and found every one helpful. I may also look at the Albatron, Biostar & Elitegroup boards some of you mention. The thing with this project is that I'm particularly busy with other things these days and don't really have time to research every component, price, and consideration like I would for my "main" computer that I use for the really important stuff. This is just an extra PC for undemanding applications and experimenting on, so I just wanna put someting together quickly that's no frills & reasonably cheap. I want reliability more than speed or fancy features. I just saw the Fry's ad for the K7VTA3 and was surprised to find ANY mobo & Athlon 2200+ combo for $59.99, hence my original posting.

Oh, one other thing: The ad describes it as a "Bare CPU with QuantiSpeed Architecture." I know what the QuantiSpeed is, but what does "Bare CPU" mean? Does that mean no heat sink/fan for the Athlon?

Ken

PS: One more "one other thing." Do any of you know about the quality of the onboard audio on the K7VTA3? I would like to have passably decent audio to listen to online radio stations at times (no MP3 or CD playing planned with this computer though).

 

[Peter]

Internet radio is pretty low quality to begin with - don't worry about the quality of the integrated audio.

Bare CPU very possibly means w/o fan/heatsink. Add an Arctic Cooling "Copper Silent 2", the plain version w/o the fan speed regulator. It's cheap, whisper quiet, and nonetheless very good in its thermal properties.

 

[Buz2b]

As to the Sparkle Power supply, I use the 350 watt model with an XP2100+ at XP2400+ (overclocked), w/2 optical drives, 2 HDD's,FDD, 4 fans and 2 Cold Cathode 12" lights with nary a burp. I had the 300 watt model on an earlier system with a 1.33 @ 1.45 GHz cpu and same drive setups (no lights and only three fans though). The point is, they're solid power supplies and not horribly expensive at the same time. You could do a lot worse. Good luck in your build. I think you are definately on the right track.

 

[CraigRT]

you get what you pay for.. a $50 mobo (or even less for some) is a piece of crap... I've only done one system build on an ECS board, and it didn't make it to a year (died in about 8 months).. not only did it die, but it was a pain in the ass to set-up too.

I'd never recommend anyone buy one, to be honest.. as some others have said, better off to get a slightly more expensive (yet still inexpensive) board like Albatron, etc.