Any engineers in here do poorly with undergrad grades...
- Thread starter oiprocs
- Start date
The real question is: did those with poor grades in undergrad even get a job?
I'm midway through my last term and you really have to give up or not give a shit to do "poorly" (i.e. sub 70%-ish). If that's true, then you probably wouldn't be that good a worker to begin with. However, from what I've heard, most of the crap you learn in college is basic/useless. Once you actually get hired, the company will teach you and train you in a specific area so that you do stuff THEIR way. You'll still need the basics though.
I'm midway through my last term and you really have to give up or not give a shit to do "poorly" (i.e. sub 70%-ish). If that's true, then you probably wouldn't be that good a worker to begin with. However, from what I've heard, most of the crap you learn in college is basic/useless. Once you actually get hired, the company will teach you and train you in a specific area so that you do stuff THEIR way. You'll still need the basics though.
most companies want to see a 3.0+
and any company will train you. they just see your grades as a reflection of your ability to think critically and work efficiently.
and any company will train you. they just see your grades as a reflection of your ability to think critically and work efficiently.
SacrosanctFiend
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- Oct 2, 2004
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It's hard to get the interview with a low GPA (I received a resume where the person had a 2.3 GPA and tried to explain that by saying he worked 20 hours a week...immediately scrapped). Personally, if I see in the interview that you have excellent problem solving skills and are dependable, I don't care what your GPA is. I'll take an excellent problem solver with a 2.0 GPA over someone with shitty problem solving skills and a 4.0GPA.
IAteYourMother
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SacrosanctFiend
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Not necessarily. I said that because we hired a PE recently who had a 2.7GPA over one who had a 3.8 GPA because the guy with the 2.7 was a much better problem solver than the guy with the 3.8.
Just because you can get the grades doesn't mean you are an effective problem solver on the job.
IAteYourMother
Lifer
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SacrosanctFiend
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Well, you can say that it's likely, but I don't believe that it is likely. I used to be a strong proponent of GPA being a great classifier of ability (as Deeko can attest to), but I've shifted far away from that opinion when I got into the recruiting of engineers.
Despite the fact that an engineer with a poor GPA can still get a good job it still helps a TON to have a good GPA, it means not having to explain yourself. Also, alot of the top tier companies have pretty high GPA requirements. For exmaple NVIDIA was looking for people at my school and they had a minimum GPA of 3.5 which would be like the top 20% of the class, so if you want to be one of those people desinging the next generation GPU or CPU then you better be getting an incredible GPA and/or be going to a top 5 engineering school.
That being said though I had a GPA less than 3.0 and got a job and actually have the problem that too MANY people are calling me asking for interviews and stuff even though I though I took all my resumes down and stuff they are tracking people down aparently.
That being said though I had a GPA less than 3.0 and got a job and actually have the problem that too MANY people are calling me asking for interviews and stuff even though I though I took all my resumes down and stuff they are tracking people down aparently.
Eh other then top end companies thats not really true...The demand for engineers are pretty high and they are willing to take what they get for the most part...
not engineering specific, but grades are independent of intelligence... and , subsequently , proficiency when applied in workplace
Thats not entirely true, intellegence is ONE of several things that grades depend on, but they deffinitely DO depend on your intellegence. GPA and workplace profeciency are very much related, alot more so than something like SAT scores or an IQ test or anything like that. Many of the fractors that go into a GPA are pretty similar to what makes someone a good professional, obviously there is no guarentee there.
obviously there is almost no statistical measure that would guarantee professional success.
however, between gpa, sat, and iq, i would place GPA and SAT in the same category. theyre both a product of studying hard, having the right connections (tests, friends, whatever). iq is more independent of the "system".
anecdotally, but also practically speaking, i know far too many people with high grades who are plain morons, and really smart, quick friends with the opposite. my first 2 years of schools i had absolute shit grades, and the last 2 i had great grades. my brain mass didnt increase overnight. i couldve finished school with grades on either end of the measuring pole and it would have not meant much.
the only correlation i see is that because studying --> grades, those with higher grades are likely to have better traits/habits in terms of self-discipline...but thats only VERY slight.
if i were hiring (and i actually perform lots of recruiting and prelim interview for my company), i would not care at all about grades. this is evident by the fact that the working world has interviews. a 30 minute conversion is a helluva lot more telling than a number on paper.
TBH I don't think GPA should matter. 90% of the time the 4.0 students got tests/homework/etc from friends/greek house/previous students and don't actually know the material, they just manage to memorize.
OTOH though, most companies look at the GPA as a reflection of your work ethic so I would say if you are worried about having poor grades you might want to look into another degree. Not even a non-eng field, just go from say Electrical>Mechanical may be more of what you understand and comprehend easier (making it easier to do the work and get good grades)
OTOH though, most companies look at the GPA as a reflection of your work ethic so I would say if you are worried about having poor grades you might want to look into another degree. Not even a non-eng field, just go from say Electrical>Mechanical may be more of what you understand and comprehend easier (making it easier to do the work and get good grades)
- Oct 30, 2000
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I came out of engineering with under a 3.0
USAF did not complain.
I am not aware that any other company that I worked for or any of my clients even cared after that point.
It is only an impact when first out of school and do not have any qualifications under your belt.
USAF did not complain.
I am not aware that any other company that I worked for or any of my clients even cared after that point.
It is only an impact when first out of school and do not have any qualifications under your belt.
- Jun 20, 2001
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Well, I'm Structural Engineering, which if you ask all the other engineers, is the easiest of the majors. Hand in hand with Civil I suppose.
It's not just that I'm worried about my engineering grades, but rather what came before it. My first three years resulted in a GPA of <2.0, mainly because I didn't care about what I studied so I just kept switching majors every time classes got difficult.
I'm concerned that I'll have to maintain an A- average to show employers that I can be a productive worker, that once I found a major that interested me, my grades were a lot better. I was born with soft skills, the ability to talk, communicate easily, write well, etc., so I'm worried that technically I won't be up to snuff.
It's not just that I'm worried about my engineering grades, but rather what came before it. My first three years resulted in a GPA of <2.0, mainly because I didn't care about what I studied so I just kept switching majors every time classes got difficult.
I'm concerned that I'll have to maintain an A- average to show employers that I can be a productive worker, that once I found a major that interested me, my grades were a lot better. I was born with soft skills, the ability to talk, communicate easily, write well, etc., so I'm worried that technically I won't be up to snuff.
these skills are essential! you'll need to be able to talk yourself out of blame when your bridge fails and kill 80 people!!!!
LOL, but seriously, those are the skills that 80% of engineers DON'T have, so on one hand that will be very desireable, on the other hand if you are good at those and not at engineering classes then maybe you should go into buisness instead of engineering? Although if you do become an engineer and have those skills it won't really matter how good your engineering is because in a few years you'll be a manager and not have to worry about designing things. Or you could just go be an engineering salesperson, that way you don't design stuff you just pitch your companies designs to customers and stuff.
- Jun 20, 2001
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Yeah see I was thinking along those lines as well. I do like marketing, I do like sales, I like giving presentations, so I figure I can always go into engineering sales.
My brother and my dad (along with student loans
) helped me see that I should major in something challenging, something that I couldn't do on my own, something that interested me. With the soft skills in hand, studying something technical would open a lot more doors than just being a one dimensional candidate.
postmortemIA
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- Jul 11, 2006
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From my interviewing experience, good GPA will give you more exposure such as interest from employers. and there are few/several companies that care about it as a screening method. After that, once you and other candidates get the interview, means almost nothing, no advantage over other candidates.
In other words, do no rely on GPA once you have interview.
In other words, do no rely on GPA once you have interview.
Well, my marks were always just ok (low 70s - 2.7ish GPA) but I think I've done well job-wise.
- I worked part time during 2nd and 3rd years doing basic websites, databases and web apps.
- The part time job helped me land a very nice 16 month internship between 3rd and 4th years. I worked for RIM (blackberry maker), learnt a lot, got to do some pretty cool stuff etc.
- After graduation, I found a job really quickly (like 2 weeks after starting to look). I stayed there 3 months, but I found different job and quit the first one since it really wasn't my cup of tea.
- I'm at my second post graduation job now. I like it and the company's pretty cool, so I'll likely stay here a while.
Should I wanna switch jobs, I highly doubt I'll have any problems finding another one.
I should note that I'm in computer engineering, and its a bit different from other engineering disciplines. The schooling is more theoretical, more broad and far less applicable to real life. At the same time, CompEng's (and comp scis) have an incredible opportunity to learn practically by joining open source projects, starting their own and generally learning on their own. From what I've seen, this kind of stuff is very impressive when getting jobs early in your career, be it a coop, internship or new grad. I guess my suggestion would be to try your hardest to get this practical experience, IMO, a 3.0 with practical experience is far better than a 4.0 with nothing to back it up.
- I worked part time during 2nd and 3rd years doing basic websites, databases and web apps.
- The part time job helped me land a very nice 16 month internship between 3rd and 4th years. I worked for RIM (blackberry maker), learnt a lot, got to do some pretty cool stuff etc.
- After graduation, I found a job really quickly (like 2 weeks after starting to look). I stayed there 3 months, but I found different job and quit the first one since it really wasn't my cup of tea.
- I'm at my second post graduation job now. I like it and the company's pretty cool, so I'll likely stay here a while.
Should I wanna switch jobs, I highly doubt I'll have any problems finding another one.
I should note that I'm in computer engineering, and its a bit different from other engineering disciplines. The schooling is more theoretical, more broad and far less applicable to real life. At the same time, CompEng's (and comp scis) have an incredible opportunity to learn practically by joining open source projects, starting their own and generally learning on their own. From what I've seen, this kind of stuff is very impressive when getting jobs early in your career, be it a coop, internship or new grad. I guess my suggestion would be to try your hardest to get this practical experience, IMO, a 3.0 with practical experience is far better than a 4.0 with nothing to back it up.
WhoBeDaPlaya
Diamond Member
- Sep 15, 2000
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I actually kinda resent this line of thinking. There are those of us who genuinely work hard and DON'T game the system you know
Hell, I took classes under the harder profs whenever possible just to convince myself I'm not a fraud It definitely is important when they're sifting through dozens of resumes. GPA is a very good estimate of how one will perform in the workplace - it takes into account how smart you are, how hard you work, and how well you do on the tasks assigned to you.
Once you get the interview, though, GPA is only a very small piece of the overall picture.
I also completely disagree with DisgruntledVirus, unless he went to a crappy easy school. In my classes, our coursework and exams were difficult and required us to think, no matter how much memorization there was. People got the grades they deserved.
Once you get the interview, though, GPA is only a very small piece of the overall picture.
I also completely disagree with DisgruntledVirus, unless he went to a crappy easy school. In my classes, our coursework and exams were difficult and required us to think, no matter how much memorization there was. People got the grades they deserved.
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