Anti-Obesity Ad

[Kaido]

One of my favorite motivational posters:

http://www.mattbrandenburg.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/dr-phil-youre-fat.jpg

Print that out & keep it on the fridge

 

[irishScott]

I think the point of of this thread is that we shouldn't be consuming 10 000 calories per day of anything. Fatty.

Unless you're Michael Phelps.

 

[Kaido]

I never understood the "Big Is Beautiful" movement.

Sure, lets avoid shaming and hurt the feelings of the obese,.. but, do you really have to announce you look great? Because, you don't. Furthermore, your body is being harmed by being big - there is nothing beautiful about being in pain, because you can't stop eating.

Feel good about yourself, but there is no need to force others to view you in a better light by announcing it,.. when you clearly are not.

I think it needs to break down into 2 parts:

1. You SHOULD accept yourself & love yourself, no matter what you look like. It is important for your self-esteem to do so, otherwise you are going to be constantly critiquing yourself.

2. You should NOT accept being overweight or obese, because it is bad for your health & has so many negative long-term repercussions.

I think where people are getting confused is in the "big is beautiful" movement - unless you have a medical condition where you can't control your weight at all (rare, but it happens), you should not be celebrating a state of living that is going to wreck your life & kill you sooner. Arthritis, heart problems, diabetes, and a host of other serious issues live down that road. Obviously everyone is free to follow whatever movement they want, but your body becomes a prison when you're overweight (I know because I've been there) & that's just no fun :thumbsdown:

 

[BoberFett]

Hayabusa

Normally we can count on your for quality opinions, but you're simply wrong here.

Our obesity rate didn't just start going up because there was a magical genetic change in the US population. This is a lifestyle problem.

 

[Kaido]

People are eating themselves to death.


I'd consider that to be something of a problem.

Some people consider it to be a matter of personal pride.

Well...to be fair, if you take it out of context...people do the same thing with smoking & alcohol. We know what smoking does to your lung, how it can cause cancer, the annual cost of smoking, etc., and yet a ton of us fragile humans still smoke every day. Or the effects of drinking on your liver, drunk-driving, etc. - people celebrate that lifestyle with drunk selfies at parties & clubs, so (playing devil's advocate here, not endorsing it) why not allow people be proud of their eating habits?

Also, there's an enormous amount of psychology that plays into food: food addiction, comfort food, emotional eating, availability & budget, dietary education, etc. I became overweight after high school because I didn't know squat about the realities of nutrition & truthfully didn't much care - I ate whatever I wanted, whenever I wanted, even if that meant a pair of double bacon cheeseburgers at midnight. I was fortunate to have a fast metabolism so that I never got much beyond 50 or 60 pounds overweight, which didn't look too terrible on me because I'm tall, so I never had to deal with getting made fun of or anything, but it still wasn't a super-healthy route for me to pursue.

Back then, to me, eating healthy meant bland salads or Jenny Craig programs, or having to go slave away at a gym, all of which were unappealing. It was eye-opening to learn that I could eat all of the delicious food I wanted and actually lose weight by eating lean proteins like chicken, complex carbs like brown rice, good fats like avocado, etc. - which may sound bland, but with a little effort, you can whip up some mighty tasty meals. That doesn't mean that I eat perfectly all the time, but I've gotten a handle on my weight, my energy, and my blood tests, all of which has made a huge impact for the better on my quality of life.

I don't quite know how to describe it, but it's like your body is either a prison or a spaceship...you're either locked in & homebound & confined to doing low-energy activities, or you're free to pursue anything you want to, which includes sports activities, visiting new places, etc. & actually feeling good enough to enjoy them properly.

 

[justoh]

I think it needs to break down into 2 parts:

1. You SHOULD accept yourself & love yourself, no matter what you look like. It is important for your self-esteem to do so, otherwise you are going to be constantly critiquing yourself.

2. You should NOT accept being overweight or obese, because it is bad for your health & has so many negative long-term repercussions.

I think where people are getting confused is in the "big is beautiful" movement - unless you have a medical condition where you can't control your weight at all (rare, but it happens), you should not be celebrating a state of living that is going to wreck your life & kill you sooner. Arthritis, heart problems, diabetes, and a host of other serious issues live down that road. Obviously everyone is free to follow whatever movement they want, but your body becomes a prison when you're overweight (I know because I've been there) & that's just no fun :thumbsdown:

Being fat or overweight usually indicates a lack of self-control/discipline/restraint. It has moral dimensions, as it relates to temperance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperance_(virtue)

So it's not merely a health concern, unless you don't care about being a good person. Exercise that restraint. Or at least exercise. pizza, beer, chips, sour candy. four random words to get you inspired.

 

[darkewaffle]

Unless you're Michael Phelps.

Yeah, elite athletes go through insane caloric counts during extended periods of activity. If you do enough work and burn enough calories, you can kind of eat whatever the fuck you want lol.

 

[Gooberlx2]

Hayabusa

Normally we can count on your for quality opinions, but you're simply wrong here.

Our obesity rate didn't just start going up because there was a magical genetic change in the US population. This is a lifestyle problem.

To be fair, I don't think he's really been addressing the "general population" in his posts, other than the couple occasions where he agreed with what we all already know (discipline, diet and lifestyle). He's been discussing those who're 500lbs+ which are pretty fringe cases, and indeed probably have a higher incidence of some underlying contributing condition.

 

[Kaido]

Being fat or overweight usually indicates a lack of self-control/discipline/restraint. It has moral dimensions, as it relates to temperance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperance_(virtue)

So it's not merely a health concern, unless you don't care about being a good person. Exercise that restraint. Or at least exercise. pizza, beer, chips, sour candy. four random words to get you inspired.

Eh, I don't really agree with that - I know plenty of extremely overweight people who are very nice, so that doesn't necessarily equate with being a good person. Plus, what if you're genetically stuck with being overweight? Does that mean you're not a good person? But I see your point in relation to the traditional concept of temperance as a virtue.

I wonder if they have a TV show about being overweight, like the Hoarders one - in every single instance of the hoarders show, people became hoarders due to a negative event in their life - they got robbed, a family member died, or something terrible happened to them & they started hoarding as an unconscious way of dealing with it. So there was always a root cause.

For me, it mostly boiled down to not really caring. I was never into sports or anything, so it wasn't a big loss to be 220 instead of 170. I also didn't have what I would call a "proper" nutritional education because, in my mind, eating healthy meant boring or nasty health food & being limited to how much you could eat. I prefer to be able to eat an entire can of Pringles myself, thank you very much :biggrin:

 

[Kaido]

Yeah, elite athletes go through insane caloric counts during extended periods of activity. If you do enough work and burn enough calories, you can kind of eat whatever you want lol.

My friend follows this ideology - she calls it the "workout for 2 hours a day and eat whatever I want" diet. She does a 2 hour workout in the morning & then (literally) cooks Paula Deen recipes the rest of the day. It's amazing if you have the willpower to keep it up :biggrin:

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Hayabusa

Normally we can count on your for quality opinions, but you're simply wrong here.

Our obesity rate didn't just start going up because there was a magical genetic change in the US population. This is a lifestyle problem.

If you look at where I jumped in it was about a family which had someone who weighed in at a quarter ton and when we see someone of that weight there's something which goes beyond forgetting to put down the bag of chips. Here's one of the first studies which pops up under a simple search.

If it were simply a matter of lifestyle then twin studies would rule out a genetic component yet that's not the case. Of course it's more complex than that and the abstract goes into some of that. Note I haven't said anything like "Well it's just genetics and nothing can be done and people have no control or ability to affect their health." I am saying that in extreme cases there is a pathology involved and the appeal to "thermodynamics" is woefully simplistic. Metabolism adapts to caloric restriction and in some rare cases it's extreme and people can pretend that doesn't happen but it's much like saying the world is flat.

I wish things were simple and as easy to understand as some insist upon, but it's not. What people here aren't asking is "why is this happening now"? If it's lifestyle (and it is in part) why is it happening to this degree? Other first world countries do not have this problem like we do- it seems to be a chiefly American problem, but a problem it is. One thing that might be useful to understand is that when people like myself talk about genetics we aren't saying that there is an increase in mutations which are causing a sudden increase in obesity. That's not how these things work. Instead there are environmental triggers which work with genetics and this seems to play into the whole phenomenon. Anyone can say "well fat people are just stupid and lazy". I can say that blacks are stupid and lazy and for that matter criminal. I can even "prove" it using AT logic. Graduation rates, violent crime statistics, poverty etc. Of course if I did I would be called a bigot who didn't bother to even try to understand why those figures are as they are. Well that sword cuts both ways, and while I understand that people aren't as well informed on this issue as race concerns, the basic desire to place blame based on some inherent moral failing is much the same. That cannot be universally true and the science (incomplete as it is) does not back that up. Sometimes people do foolish things with bad result and that will be the case with overeating but doesn't come close to explaining the magnitude of the problem.

 

[justoh]

Eh, I don't really agree with that - I know plenty of extremely overweight people who are very nice, so that doesn't necessarily equate with being a good person. Plus, what if you're genetically stuck with being overweight? Does that mean you're not a good person? But I see your point in relation to the traditional concept of temperance as a virtue.

I wonder if they have a TV show about being overweight, like the Hoarders one - in every single instance of the hoarders show, people became hoarders due to a negative event in their life - they got robbed, a family member died, or something terrible happened to them & they started hoarding as an unconscious way of dealing with it. So there was always a root cause.

For me, it mostly boiled down to not really caring. I was never into sports or anything, so it wasn't a big loss to be 220 instead of 170. I also didn't have what I would call a "proper" nutritional education because, in my mind, eating healthy meant boring or nasty health food & being limited to how much you could eat. I prefer to be able to eat an entire can of Pringles myself, thank you very much :biggrin:

Some people like to think that being a good person means being a virtuous person in the greek or christian tradition (minus the overrated virtue of faith), and a virtuous person finds the mean between excess and deficiency in everything. It's not simply being "nice."

I'm not saying i'm a good person. I struggle with all the cardinal virtues, but especially temperance. I've been anywhere from 170-240lbs in my adult life, most often around 190-200, at 6'1, which is clear evidence of overindulgence (since it's mostly fat from chips and pizza, certainly not muscle). The bad foods are so comforting. They literally make you feel better.

They say fat people are happy people, but when i'm only fat when i'm unhappy.

 

[irishScott]

Eh, I don't really agree with that - I know plenty of extremely overweight people who are very nice, so that doesn't necessarily equate with being a good person. Plus, what if you're genetically stuck with being overweight? Does that mean you're not a good person? But I see your point in relation to the traditional concept of temperance as a virtue.

I wonder if they have a TV show about being overweight, like the Hoarders one - in every single instance of the hoarders show, people became hoarders due to a negative event in their life - they got robbed, a family member died, or something terrible happened to them & they started hoarding as an unconscious way of dealing with it. So there was always a root cause.

For me, it mostly boiled down to not really caring. I was never into sports or anything, so it wasn't a big loss to be 220 instead of 170. I also didn't have what I would call a "proper" nutritional education because, in my mind, eating healthy meant boring or nasty health food & being limited to how much you could eat. I prefer to be able to eat an entire can of Pringles myself, thank you very much :biggrin:

Sure fat people can be "nice", but they've usually got some serious baggage in my experience, and oftentimes just aren't that fun to be around, which can be said of any insecure person. Fat women in particular will often be insanely jealous and bitchy towards skinny women. No one wants to hang out with weak people, it's just asking for trouble or to be a babysitter.

I used to think the same way about eating healthy, but I blame the 80s and 90s for that. Turns out you can eat plenty healthy without eating bland-ass "health food". I just pan-fried some Cajun-spiced catfish with some heavily spiced (garlic, onion power, red pepper, oregano, basil, parsley, salt, pepper) baked potato. Nice and tasty, healthy, and took less than an hour to cook. Best part is it's the same thing you'd get in a restaurant serving that dish, there's nothing artificially "healthy" about it, it just is.

Lots of stuff like that, the key for me is avoiding any processed carbs. I don't avoid them completely (I'll go to 5 Guys every 1.5 weeks or so and eat the occasional handful of cookies), but they're no longer a staple of my diet like they used to be. I actually don't have any bread in the house as a result, it would go bad before I could finish it. I'm also known for telling my friends "Sorry I'm out of ice cream" until they discover the 2 week old barely touched ice cream can in my freezer.

 

[Gooberlx2]

Metabolism adapts to caloric restriction and in some rare cases it's extreme and people can pretend that doesn't happen but it's much like saying the world is flat.

Yup. Let's say you've been consuming 5,000 calories a day for years, and you're suddenly restricted to 75% at 3,750 calories per day. Your body is going to freak out and go into a "famine mode" sooner and more severely from missing out on 1,250 calories than it would if you'd only cut down to 1,500 from the "normal" 2,000.

 

[GoPackGo]

People also eat as a way to cope with mental illness. There is too much crap in our food. Healthy food is expensive. People spend too much time inside. Too much TV. Most jobs in the US are sedentary.

 

[purbeast0]

People also eat as a way to cope with mental illness. There is too much crap in our food. Healthy food is expensive. People spend too much time inside. Too much TV. Most jobs in the US are sedentary.

healthy food is not expensive at all. you can buy pounds upon pounds of chicken for dirt cheap. then get a bag of brown rice that will last you weeks. toss in some lettuce or other greens that are also cheap, and you have a very cheap healthy meal. people are just too damn lazy to prepare their own food.

 

[justoh]

healthy food is not expensive at all. you can buy pounds upon pounds of chicken for dirt cheap. then get a bag of brown rice that will last you weeks. toss in some lettuce or other greens that are also cheap, and you have a very cheap healthy meal. people are just too damn lazy to prepare their own food.

Yeah, you don't have to shop at whole foods to eat for nutrition. But it's much more fun to drink beer and eat chips. Why are chips so expensive anyway? Ridiculous.

 

[thestrangebrew1]

At one point I was diagnosed as morbid obese. Since then I've lost about 60-70lbs and just in the obese range. I got about another 15-20 lbs to go and I'm struggling. I don't find this PSA to be offensive or shameful. It's pretty much fact that your eating habits have a profound effect on your overall health, and that being healthy has only positive benefits. It's a shame it took so long for myself to figure it out, but even more shameful that there are so many people out there who don't realize this or wait until it's too late to do something about it.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Yeah, you don't have to shop at whole foods to eat for nutrition. But it's much more fun to drink beer and eat chips. Why are chips so expensive anyway? Ridiculous.

Chip prices? Supply and demand and marketing. Something to note- people who are depressed selectively choose some foods others independent of effort to obtain.

It's interesting that now not only are the obese lazy but that people who suffer depression are too

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

At one point I was diagnosed as morbid obese. Since then I've lost about 60-70lbs and just in the obese range. I got about another 15-20 lbs to go and I'm struggling. I don't find this PSA to be offensive or shameful. It's pretty much fact that your eating habits have a profound effect on your overall health, and that being healthy has only positive benefits. It's a shame it took so long for myself to figure it out, but even more shameful that there are so many people out there who don't realize this or wait until it's too late to do something about it.

Good for you! Best wishes on reaching and maintaining your goal.

 

[BoberFett]

If you look at where I jumped in it was about a family which had someone who weighed in at a quarter ton and when we see someone of that weight there's something which goes beyond forgetting to put down the bag of chips. Here's one of the first studies which pops up under a simple search.

If it were simply a matter of lifestyle then twin studies would rule out a genetic component yet that's not the case. Of course it's more complex than that and the abstract goes into some of that. Note I haven't said anything like "Well it's just genetics and nothing can be done and people have no control or ability to affect their health." I am saying that in extreme cases there is a pathology involved and the appeal to "thermodynamics" is woefully simplistic. Metabolism adapts to caloric restriction and in some rare cases it's extreme and people can pretend that doesn't happen but it's much like saying the world is flat.

I wish things were simple and as easy to understand as some insist upon, but it's not. What people here aren't asking is "why is this happening now"? If it's lifestyle (and it is in part) why is it happening to this degree? Other first world countries do not have this problem like we do- it seems to be a chiefly American problem, but a problem it is. One thing that might be useful to understand is that when people like myself talk about genetics we aren't saying that there is an increase in mutations which are causing a sudden increase in obesity. That's not how these things work. Instead there are environmental triggers which work with genetics and this seems to play into the whole phenomenon. Anyone can say "well fat people are just stupid and lazy". I can say that blacks are stupid and lazy and for that matter criminal. I can even "prove" it using AT logic. Graduation rates, violent crime statistics, poverty etc. Of course if I did I would be called a bigot who didn't bother to even try to understand why those figures are as they are. Well that sword cuts both ways, and while I understand that people aren't as well informed on this issue as race concerns, the basic desire to place blame based on some inherent moral failing is much the same. That cannot be universally true and the science (incomplete as it is) does not back that up. Sometimes people do foolish things with bad result and that will be the case with overeating but doesn't come close to explaining the magnitude of the problem.

Of course there are genetic triggers. But people used to work physically demanding job and eat sensible portions. Now lots of us are lazy gluttons, so those genes are working with a lot more calories and a lot less exercise than they used to. People can't control their genes, but they can control their habits. Focus on improving and don't make excuses for those things you can control.

 

[lord_emperor]

Overweight people don't necessarily eat "10,000 Calories" per day or gobble down Big Gulps of soda and fast food constantly. I traded in a moderately active lifestyle for a desk job and I gained 74lbs over the course of 11 years, napkin math works this out to 64 too many Calories per day. Sixty four, that's nothing.

Thanks to a warning from my doctor I'm reversing the process, rapidly. Lost 68lbs in 6 months. Thanks to this I'm keenly aware of the energy density of things and knowing that I was gaining from eating (on average) 1/8th of a sandwich or 1tbsp of sugar too much each day is a little disconcerting.

 

[thestrangebrew1]

Good for you! Best wishes on reaching and maintaining your goal.

Thanks! Still working on it but it's getting pretty tough to lose those pesky last few pounds!

 

[BoberFett]

Overweight people don't necessarily eat "10,000 Calories" per day or gobble down Big Gulps of soda and fast food constantly. I traded in a moderately active lifestyle for a desk job and I gained 74lbs over the course of 11 years, napkin math works this out to 64 too many Calories per day. Sixty four, that's nothing.

Thanks to a warning from my doctor I'm reversing the process, rapidly. Lost 68lbs in 6 months. Thanks to this I'm keenly aware of the energy density of things and knowing that I was gaining from eating (on average) 1/8th of a sandwich or 1tbsp of sugar too much each day is a little disconcerting.

But it was still lifestyle, and not some genetic trait which can't be overcome.

And congrats on the weight loss.

 

[AznAnarchy99]

I am saying it is physically impossible to consume 10,000 calories of alcohol per day.

I don't know. I probably had somewhere close to that in Vegas with mixed drinks. Damn sugar content in mixers.