another guy gets "Dave'd" , or at least fired for running DC

FoBoT

No Lifer
Apr 30, 2001
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don't run SETI on employer computers without permission :\

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hQEEZ1hg7uNolSi46p83k1GIVXJQD9CBAQ901

http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/147847

MESA, Ariz. — A former Arizona school district employee is accused of using school computers in an experiment to find space aliens, costing the worker his job and the district more than $1 million.
Schools officials say Brad Niesluchowski, who was Higley Unified School District's information technology director, downloaded free software on district computers in 2000.
The program, known as SETI(at)home, uses Internet-connected computers worldwide to analyze radio telescope data in an experiment to find extraterrestrial intelligence.
But Superintendent Denise Birdwell told the East Valley Tribune that the program also bogged down the district's system and interfered with technology use in classrooms.
Birdwell said it will take more than $1 million to fix the problem, including removal of the SETI software. She says police are conducting a broader investigation.
Niesluchowski, who went by NEZ in the program, was considered a "world grid runner" for the SETI competition because of the many computers he was able to install the program on. He was seen as a "God" because of his status, Birdwell said.

Members on a message board discussing the SETI program often wondered who NEZ was because of his "high credit." One user, who went by the name Captain Avatar, even surmised that NEZ was not using all of his own computers, "probably some university or corporate system."
 
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FoBoT

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Apr 30, 2001
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I'm sure the downloading of porn didn't help either

yes, reading the whole thing, this was a drawn out affair over the course of several years. looks like he was warned many times and they finally decided to throw the kitchen sink at him including involving the police
 

FoBoT

No Lifer
Apr 30, 2001
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$1 million to uninstall seti? I'd love to get that contract.

if you read it all, they are blaming SETI on reducing the life of the computers, so part of the $1 million is electricity and the cost to replace systems that are a few/several years old because the school believes that by running SETI, the life span of the computers was reduced
 

Markfw

Moderator Emeritus, Elite Member
May 16, 2002
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While that is BS (the cost and wear and deinstall), the point is well taken that using computers that you don't personally own for DC should not be done, as just the extra electric bill can be quite a burden. I know since mine is $200-300 just for the electric to run my farm. So I wouldn't want my tax dollars to go for someone looking for Aliens, and taking all the credit himself.

Now for F@H, at least it trying to cure Diseases.
 

ksherman

Senior member
Jul 9, 2000
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It is especially hard to sell the upside to anyone when they hear you are searching for aliens...

But yeah, not such a good idea... Even though I'm doing this a little. When I got my 5850, I took the 9600GT to my machine at work and let it run over night. Power increase for one machine will be negligible (esp since I only run the GPU client) and its actually my old desktop that I sold off to them when I got my MacBook Pro back in 2007 :D. Its funny, initially it wasn't my computer it was my boss's, then he quite and I took over the department and got right back on my desktop. Ha!

Anywhoose, not a good idea on a large scale like that... Anyone know what his PPD was like? ;)
 

petrusbroder

Elite Member
Nov 28, 2004
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He still should not have installed Seti(at)Home without permission ... and that was what he did wrong. Now he has to take the consequences.
 

dmcowen674

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Oct 13, 1999
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www.alienbabeltech.com

Wiz

Diamond Member
Feb 5, 2000
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Yes, in the words of George Carlin: "It's all bullshit and it's bad for ya"

CPU's become obsolete before they can wear out, even running 100% LOAD 24/7/365.

Was he the head of IT? If so he made the policies, he didn't have anyone to ask for permission. However if he was told by his boss to shut it down then he has no excuse.
 

ksherman

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Jul 9, 2000
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Yes, in the words of George Carlin: "It's all bullshit and it's bad for ya"

CPU's become obsolete before they can wear out, even running 100% LOAD 24/7/365.

I bet the school brought in some outside 'consultant' who saw the opportunity to supply a school was a lot of new machines, probably even rolling in IT support so the District wouldn't have to have their own 'in-house' guy etc... They are getting played, that's for sure.

Its one thing if they derived this number from the fact that machines WERE actually failing due to excessive stress on the hardware. They are just coming to the conclusion that they out-right need to be replaced without any legit evidence.
 

GlacierFreeze

Golden Member
May 23, 2005
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Yes, in the words of George Carlin: "It's all bullshit and it's bad for ya"

CPU's become obsolete before they can wear out, even running 100% LOAD 24/7/365.

Was he the head of IT? If so he made the policies, he didn't have anyone to ask for permission. However if he was told by his boss to shut it down then he has no excuse.

You really think installing a program to run (and eat up power bill) and search for aliens was part of the policy, even if he made it? I doubt it, especially since it's not inline with the scope of what a school district's technology use is about. If so, it would have needed to be approved by the Superintendent of the District anyway. It wasn't in there.
 

Ken g6

Programming Moderator, Elite Member
Moderator
Dec 11, 1999
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CPU's become obsolete before they can wear out, even running 100% LOAD 24/7/365.
That may be true, but school districts generally don't have the money to use anything other than obsolete computers. :p

My Mom works at a school where practically all they have is old, donated Dell P4 desktops and minitowers. The desktops in particular tend to overheat and die without SETI on them. With SETI, I could easily imagine increased hardware replacement costs.
 

FoBoT

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Apr 30, 2001
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I bet the school brought in some outside 'consultant' who saw the opportunity to supply a school was a lot of new machines, probably even rolling in IT support so the District wouldn't have to have their own 'in-house' guy etc... They are getting played, that's for sure.

yes, the article says they paid someone $15,000 to tell them how all the bad things were the fault of NEZ running SETI
 

PCTC2

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2007
3,892
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At least I got the OK at work to run F@H as long as I script it to run between 9 PM and 7 AM...
 

Assimilator1

Elite Member
Nov 4, 1999
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if you read it all, they are blaming SETI on reducing the life of the computers, so part of the $1 million is electricity and the cost to replace systems that are a few/several years old because the school believes that by running SETI, the life span of the computers was reduced

Lol, what BS they come out with, would make hardly any difference to lifespan, unless they weren't normally on 24/7 & he put them on 24/7.....
And 1 million is totally excessive, yes he was wrong & dumb to run DC without permission & after being warned several times, but that doesn't mean they should trump up charges.

He should get charged for extra leccy costs (shouldn't be too hard to get a close figure), if they have a net connection with bandwidth limits then maybe that should be factored in, charged for dis-obeying policies/etc & ignoring warnings & made to un-install it for free (using a script which could be looked over by another IT guy), & that's it.

ksherman
SETI wouldn't cause excessive stress on any desktop unless it was faulty to begin with.

Keng6
Presumeably those old P4s must be dust clogged or have failing fans?
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
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Lol, what BS they come out with, would make hardly any difference to lifespan, unless they weren't normally on 24/7 & he put them on 24/7.....
And 1 million is totally excessive, yes he was wrong & dumb to run DC without permission & after being warned several times, but that doesn't mean they should trump up charges.

He should get charged for extra leccy costs (shouldn't be too hard to get a close figure), if they have a net connection with bandwidth limits then maybe that should be factored in, charged for dis-obeying policies/etc & ignoring warnings & made to un-install it for free (using a script which could be looked over by another IT guy), & that's it.

ksherman
SETI wouldn't cause excessive stress on any desktop unless it was faulty to begin with.

Keng6
Presumeably those old P4s must be dust clogged or have failing fans?

SETI has responded to the insane crap the school administrator said about the SETI program:

http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=56450&sort=6

FAQ and comments about the Higley School District controversy



Eric Korpela

I've been getting a lot of questions and comments about the forced resignation of an IT administrator in the Higley School District in Arizona. There's a lot of misinformation flying around, mostly due to poor reporting. First lets start with the facts we know: NEZ (Brad Niesluchowski) was an IT administrator at Higley school district. He allegedly installed and ran BOINC and attached to the SETI@home project. The district alleges damages of $1.2M to $1.6M because of the use of SETI@home both due to wear and tear on the processors and electricity usage. Niesluchowski claims that the district administrator has a personal vendetta against him.

Category: Questions about SETI@home

Q. Do I need permission from my employer to run SETI@home on computers at work?

A. Yes! Of course! We've been saying that for 10 years, and despite what some bloggers have said, Niesluchowski wasn't the first person to lose his job over this. The first time was many years ago.

Q. Does SETI@home really cost that much to run?

A. The cost of running SETI@home is not zero. When a computer performs calculations, it draws more power than it does when it is idle. A typical desktop machine might draw about 60 watts more when active than when idle which is about the same as an incandescent light bulb. If run 24/7, that machine will consume an additional 525 kilowatt hours (kW*h) in a year. At an average cost of $0.12 per kW*h, that's $63.11 per year. That's pretty small compared to the cost of your computer, and maybe about the same as your monthly cable bill, but it's pretty big compared to the cost of can of soup. At that rate, you could spend $1.6M on power by running 25,000 computers for a year, or 5000 computers for 5 years. This is in addition to the power usage of an idle machine, which can also exceed 60 watts. If a school district really wants to save power and money it should implement a policy to turn off computers at night. If SETI@home cost them $1.6M as they state, they would have saved $3.2M if such a policy had been implemented.

Q. Does SETI@home damage your processor?

A. I am not aware of any study that indicates that fully utilizing a CPU's processing power for a long period of time will cause it to fail sooner than it normally would, provided that the CPU is kept in the normal temperature range for operation. A CPU's temperature us usually controlled by a heat-sink and fan. If the heat sink or fan fails a CPU can be damaged whether SETI@home is running or not. Most desktop computers emit an alarm sound if the CPU fan fails. Most laptops and some desktops have a thermal protection system that slows down the processor if it overheats. If your machine is running slowly, check the fan.

Q. Does BOINC or SETI@home interfere with electronic whiteboards or their software.

A. Nobody has reported such a problem. In the past several days I have had many teachers inform me that SETI@home works quite when on machines that also control electronic whiteboards. I think this could fall into the next category of "Bad Reporting." Many articles said that SETI@home was discovered on these computers while looking for the reason that electronic whiteboards were shutting down after periods of inactivity. I didn't see any that indicated that SETI@home was the cause of those shutdowns. Most likely the whiteboard device drivers or their control software were configured in a way that allowed the computer to shut off their power after a period of inactivity. It is my understanding that there are also a lot of inferior electronic whiteboards that have been sold to school districts that are required to accept the lowest bid when purchasing equipment. That is also a possibility.

Q. Did SETI@home slow down other software as was reported?

A. Probably not. If BOINC is configured not to run applications while the computer is in use, it should not cause a slowdown of other software. If there's one thing IT personnel like, it's blaming slow computers on viruses, spyware, or "too much stuff on the hard disk." That might be the case, but those are just a case of poor computer maintenance by the IT personnel which is the most common cause of slow school or work computers.

Q. Does BOINC and SETI@home prevent you from installing a firewall?

A. No. BOINC and SETI@home do not require that a computer not have a firewall, nor does it require holes in your firewall settings. BOINC and SETI@home use the same IP port used by web browsers. If your firewall allows you to use a web browser, you can run SETI@home. Remote access to BOINC (which allows you to control the BOINC client running on one computer from another) does require a single IP port to be opened, but this feature is disabled by default. The district administrator, Dr. Birdwell, is mistaken if she believes that BOINC is incompatible with firewalls.

Q. Dr. Birdwell says "You can't just press a button" to uninstall BOINC and SETI@home. Is that true?

A. It depends. Do you mean literally true? Then yes, most computers ship without an physical button labeled "Uninstall BOINC." To uninstall BOINC, you do the same thing you would do to to uninstall any program. On windows that means click the "Control Panel" icon in the Start Menu. Then double click on "Add or Remove Programs." Then select "BOINC" and click the "Remove" button. That's five mouse clicks, but the entire process takes less than a minute to accomplish. Not exactly a button push, but I wouldn't place it in the "difficult" category.

Q. Does running BOINC or SETI@home make your computer susceptible to viruses?

A. If you download official BOINC binaries through boinc.berkeley.edu and attach only to reputable projects there is very little danger of getting a virus from BOINC or the project. In fact we are not aware of any cases of a computer getting a virus through BOINC or SETI@home in our 10 year history. You are far safer running BOINC than you are reading your email.

Category: Just Plain Bad Reporting

Q. I saw an article that said that SETI@home caused $1.6M in damage to computers a school district. Is that true?

No. In that article the reporter either mistook the legal concept of "damages" with actual physical damage, or was such a poor writer that they couldn't explain the difference.

Category: Questions We Couldn't Possibly Answer

Q. Did Niesluchowski have permission from a prior administrator to run SETI@home or to take computers home from work?

A. I don't know. How could I know that?

Q. Did the school district confiscate NEZ's family computers along with the district computers?

A. Beats me. Since I don't see it in the articles, but in comments to the articles posted by readers, I doubt that you can lend it much credence.

Category: My Personal Opinions (not those of my employer, of the SETI@home project, or of its participants.)

Q. What do you think about the district administrator, Dr. Denise Birdwell's comment that "We support educational research and we would have supported cancer research but we however as an educational institutional do not support the search for E.T."?

A. I think that Dr. Birdwell's comment is insulting to me, to the University of California, and to the millions of people who have run SETI@home in the past 10 years. Dr. Birdwell is ill informed about SETI, SETI@home and volunteer computing. I think its likely the cancer research she claims to support would probably not be happening if SETI@home had not popularized volunteer computing.

I would point out to Dr. Birdwell that the University of California is a world renowned educational institution, and that regardless of her opinions, SETI@home is still the largest volunteer computing project on the planet. I will also gladly point out that the NASA Exobiology program and the National Science Foundation Astronomy division apparently do not agree with her assessment.

That said, I'm not at all upset about the bad press she is sending our way. There are a lot of school districts in the world, and she only runs one. However, I do wonder whether the Higley School Board agrees with the opinions she espouses so loudly.
 

Wuzup101

Platinum Member
Feb 20, 2002
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I can see them wanting to recover "damages" for the extra electricity used by the computers. I can also see them terminating him for running the program without permission (and after being told to remove it several times). I can also see them wanting to recover "damages" for the removal of the software (which um... really is going to be next to nothing... but not "$0").

Bottom line is this:

Regardless of what "research" the DC client was being used to forward, the guy set it up without permission. He was told to remove the program, and did not listen. He used tax payer resources to pay for the electric bill, and, unless he came in to set it up on his own time, likely used tax payer resources to set it up (if he was doing said set up while on the clock). Running the program 24/7 didn't hurt the machines.... and he shouldn't be responsible for replacing them.

As a tax payer, I would be pissed if this happened in our district and the district didn't sue for damages based on extra power consumption; however, I feel that replacing the processors is a bit much. As others have said, by the time a processor (running at stock speed and voltage) kicks the bucket... that thing is way beyond obsolete. They are citing 2300 computers are affected... and this has been going on since the year 2000... that is going to be a but load of money in power alone if these things were running 24/7/365