Another Dem candidate wants to increase taxes

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: jahawkin

Originally posted by: rjain

Originally posted by: jahawkin

Those numbers are incredibly misleading. Take all taxes people pay into account and the rich aren't getting shafted after all
Link
Lookie here, the richest 20% pay 19% of their income to taxes, the poorest pay 18% of their income to taxes, while the middle 20% pay 16% of their income to taxes.
Pretty unfair to those rich people, huh?

That's quite misleading. You're trying to claim that the poor and middle class pay more taxes than the rich outside of income taxes? Let's see what they could be paying those taxes from. Property taxes? Nope, the rich are more likely to own instead of rent. Sales taxes? No, the rich spend more. Estate taxes? Hah.

No, you're just comparing apples to oranges. What is 19% of 80% compared to 18% of 20%? That is what we are comparing. The amount of money the rich pay to subsidize the wealth of this country's "poor", who would be considered well-off in any other country. Stop whining.

Read the graph. It states that this includes state and federal income tax, Social security, property taxes, utility taxes, sales tax etc. The rich and poor pay roughly the same percentage of their income to taxes. This isn't comparing apple to oranges, this is comparing how much someone (rich or poor) pays in taxes as a percentage of thier income.

Yes it is apples to oranges. Sales tax, estate tax, etc that aren't "income" based so to include them in a comparison of income groups is silly.
No- I think it is you who should stop whining. The "rich" pay their fair share(if not much much more) so for you, LIEberman, and the other Dems to Increase their taxes so it is "fair" - is just plain assinine.

What we really need to do is CUT SPENDING - PERIOD. Too bad none of the 9 dwarves want to do that - they only want to increase the budget by ushering in UHC which would add hundreds of billions of dollars to the budget EVERY YEAR. Sure Bush's record isn't the best on spending - I don' like his push for a prescription drug entitlement(which the Dems think is too small), but If I had to pick between his spending and the spending the Dems are proposing - I'd pick Bush every time. This gov't needs to stop wasting my money - PERIOD.

CkG

There is no such thing as your money Caddy. You live in a country where the provilage to be rich through effort is given to you. Taxes belong to the government which is you.

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: rjain

Originally posted by: jahawkin

So what are you advocating? Everyone pay $XXXX regardless of income. Bill Gates and some homeless dude pay the same dollar amount of taxes?? Not even Grover Norquist would go for such a policy.

No... I'm advocating that you lazy bastards stop pretending like the whole world is possible because of the taxes you pay. The taxes from the rich are what keep this country's government going, as they are greater than the taxes from the poor and middle-class combined.

Yet they have the unfortunate burden of beingh able to live in a style that those who are not rich could only dream about. Poor little Rich People, I feel so sorry for them..NOT! Granted many of them have achieved their status through hard work and in some cases who their parents are. I don't begrudge them that. But you are not going to garner any sympathy from me and most who have to toil just to make ends meet for the rich. I would glady pay exuberhant amounts of money to taxes to become rich via a Lotto Number or by making a wise investment and I bet the Rich would rather pay the amount they do to be rich than paying less to be Middle Class or "Shudder" Poor.

 

[Moonbeam]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Originally posted by: jahawkin

Originally posted by: rjain

Originally posted by: jahawkin

Those numbers are incredibly misleading. Take all taxes people pay into account and the rich aren't getting shafted after all
Link
Lookie here, the richest 20% pay 19% of their income to taxes, the poorest pay 18% of their income to taxes, while the middle 20% pay 16% of their income to taxes.
Pretty unfair to those rich people, huh?

That's quite misleading. You're trying to claim that the poor and middle class pay more taxes than the rich outside of income taxes? Let's see what they could be paying those taxes from. Property taxes? Nope, the rich are more likely to own instead of rent. Sales taxes? No, the rich spend more. Estate taxes? Hah.

No, you're just comparing apples to oranges. What is 19% of 80% compared to 18% of 20%? That is what we are comparing. The amount of money the rich pay to subsidize the wealth of this country's "poor", who would be considered well-off in any other country. Stop whining.

Read the graph. It states that this includes state and federal income tax, Social security, property taxes, utility taxes, sales tax etc. The rich and poor pay roughly the same percentage of their income to taxes. This isn't comparing apple to oranges, this is comparing how much someone (rich or poor) pays in taxes as a percentage of thier income.

Yes it is apples to oranges. Sales tax, estate tax, etc that aren't "income" based so to include them in a comparison of income groups is silly.
No- I think it is you who should stop whining. The "rich" pay their fair share(if not much much more) so for you, LIEberman, and the other Dems to Increase their taxes so it is "fair" - is just plain assinine.

What we really need to do is CUT SPENDING - PERIOD. Too bad none of the 9 dwarves want to do that - they only want to increase the budget by ushering in UHC which would add hundreds of billions of dollars to the budget EVERY YEAR. Sure Bush's record isn't the best on spending - I don' like his push for a prescription drug entitlement(which the Dems think is too small), but If I had to pick between his spending and the spending the Dems are proposing - I'd pick Bush every time. This gov't needs to stop wasting my money - PERIOD.

CkG

There is no such thing as your money Caddy. You live in a country where the privilege to be rich through effort is given to you. Taxes belong to the government which is you.

 

[Moonbeam]

Damn

 

[Orsorum]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
Damn

Indeed.

 

[rjain]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Yet they have the unfortunate burden of beingh able to live in a style that those who are not rich could only dream about. Poor little Rich People, I feel so sorry for them..NOT! Granted many of them have achieved their status through hard work and in some cases who their parents are. I don't begrudge them that. But you are not going to garner any sympathy from me and most who have to toil just to make ends meet for the rich.

You make ends meet for the rich? That's a silly move on your part.

I would glady pay exuberhant amounts of money to taxes to become rich via a Lotto Number or by making a wise investment and I bet the Rich would rather pay the amount they do to be rich than paying less to be Middle Class or "Shudder" Poor.

The "poor" of this country are hardly poor. If they think they're too poor, they should move to a highly-socialist country like some of those in Europe. The rich are as rich as they are in this country because we appreciate their efforts at creating a stable, strong economy, unlike socialist and communist systems. If the rich had no impetus to create money, they wouldn't be buying your credit card debt and mortgates and government budget deficits (which provide jobs for your beloved poor).

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: rjain

Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Yet they have the unfortunate burden of beingh able to live in a style that those who are not rich could only dream about. Poor little Rich People, I feel so sorry for them..NOT! Granted many of them have achieved their status through hard work and in some cases who their parents are. I don't begrudge them that. But you are not going to garner any sympathy from me and most who have to toil just to make ends meet for the rich.

You make ends meet for the rich? That's a silly move on your part.

I would glady pay exuberhant amounts of money to taxes to become rich via a Lotto Number or by making a wise investment and I bet the Rich would rather pay the amount they do to be rich than paying less to be Middle Class or "Shudder" Poor.

The "poor" of this country are hardly poor. If they think they're too poor, they should move to a highly-socialist country like some of those in Europe. The rich are as rich as they are in this country because we appreciate their efforts at creating a stable, strong economy, unlike socialist and communist systems. If the rich had no impetus to create money, they wouldn't be buying your credit card debt and mortgates and government budget deficits (which provide jobs for your beloved poor).

Yeah it could be worse for the poor, they could live in sh!tholes like Romania and India. Funny thing is, I never said that the Rich should be taxed a higher percentage that the Middle Class or Poor. According to that graph it is apperant that they are taxed a fair rate just like the Poor and the Middle Class. I definately can't see where they are being taxed unfairly!

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: CADkindaGUY

Yes it is apples to oranges. Sales tax, estate tax, etc that aren't "income" based so to include them in a comparison of income groups is silly.

CkG

since the taxes are paid out of their income it really isn't.

 

[Vic]

Why do idiots always think they are sticking it to the rich with tax increases? It's the middle class who always get screwed with every tax increase. The rich can pay a little more and it barely hurts them. The middle class has to pay more and bankruptcy and foreclosure rates go up. Unless some of you people think a family of 4 making $60k/yr. is rich...

 

[heartsurgeon]

There is no such thing as your money

this is the real essence of this thread...
apparently several of the posters are communists (or at least hard-core socialists)

all wealth belongs to the state, and should be distributed (or in this case re-distributed) by the
goverment according to need, not ability...this is the marxist, pie-in-the-sky fuzzy logic idealism
of the left.

the unfortunate reality is that this model of goverment has been tried before, and failed (in case you haven't kept up with recent history).

we live in a country that is the envy of the world...people may claim they "hate" america, but the funny thing is they all want to move here..if you think i'm making this up, then you must not travel abroad at all.

our standard of living is extraordinary. you need to see how people live in third world countries to really understand what it means to be "poor"

capitalism, while godless and souless (this attribute does bother me), appears to be the most efficient means for raising EVERYONE"S standard of living.