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Question 'Ampere'/Next-gen gaming uarch speculation thread

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CP5670

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2004
4,919
254
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I keep thinking about the 3090 and "why now".
  • Is it that there are trying to move the whole product stack up a price bracket?
  • Or is it that they know where RDNA2 is landing and they needed to do this to ensure that they still have the halo card?
It just doesn't feel right for them to release such a huge power sucking card without another motive.
I probably won't buy a 3090, but there is definitely a market for a $1500+ halo card that is clearly much faster than anything else (unlike the Titans). I expect them to sell out quickly even at marked up prices. Lots of people are stuck at home these days with nowhere else to spend their money, and there is high demand for anything related to PC gaming. Even if AMD has a real competitor, they will charge high prices for it too.
 
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CakeMonster

Golden Member
Nov 22, 2012
1,046
111
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Agreed, if it delivers on performance (2 jumps, 60ish %), it will definitely sell even for that price (the leaked price might be a misdirect, hopefully).

We went 2 years without a new top card, that hasn't happened in 10years+, if there is even a slight risk of that repeating itself, people will also use that to justify buying the 3090. Nobody knew at the time that the 2080Ti would reign for 2 years and not 1, but that has probably made the people who bought it at launch appreciate it more in hindsight completely forgetting the price tag.
 

n0x1ous

Platinum Member
Sep 9, 2010
2,524
181
106
Agreed, if it delivers on performance (2 jumps, 60ish %), it will definitely sell even for that price (the leaked price might be a misdirect, hopefully).

We went 2 years without a new top card, that hasn't happened in 10years+, if there is even a slight risk of that repeating itself, people will also use that to justify buying the 3090. Nobody knew at the time that the 2080Ti would reign for 2 years and not 1, but that has probably made the people who bought it at launch appreciate it more in hindsight completely forgetting the price tag.
Correct . Owning 2080ti since launch and having it be on top the whole time has lessened the sting of the price
 
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kurosaki

Senior member
Feb 7, 2019
257
247
86
Agreed, if it delivers on performance (2 jumps, 60ish %), it will definitely sell even for that price (the leaked price might be a misdirect, hopefully).

We went 2 years without a new top card, that hasn't happened in 10years+, if there is even a slight risk of that repeating itself, people will also use that to justify buying the 3090. Nobody knew at the time that the 2080Ti would reign for 2 years and not 1, but that has probably made the people who bought it at launch appreciate it more in hindsight completely forgetting the price tag.
For me it's so unreal to have theese discussions. I'm stuck in the old days when a switch meant 300% more performance per three years för 300 usd. It's so heavily imprinted in my scull it's a principle of mine: not to buy a new GPU until you at least have double the horsepower. I'm so far away buying something that gives you 60% more for 1400 usd that I don't know where to start. Nowadays I have the money, but this is ridiculous, I'm not paying these kind of sums anyways. "Back in my day" a top tier costed like 300 usd, what, the, hell, happened?! I'm not buying this shit. even if the shit performs 20% better than the competition. And i'm surely not buying low tier aka xx60-stuff for ~300usd either. what the hell happened.
 

CP5670

Diamond Member
Jun 24, 2004
4,919
254
126
For me it's so unreal to have theese discussions. I'm stuck in the old days when a switch meant 300% more performance per three years för 300 usd. It's so heavily imprinted in my scull it's a principle of mine: not to buy a new GPU until you at least have double the horsepower. I'm so far away buying something that gives you 60% more for 1400 usd that I don't know where to start. Nowadays I have the money, but this is ridiculous, I'm not paying these kind of sums anyways. "Back in my day" a top tier costed like 300 usd, what, the, hell, happened?! I'm not buying this shit. even if the shit performs 20% better than the competition. And i'm surely not buying low tier aka xx60-stuff for ~300usd either. what the hell happened.
I remember the Nvidia CEO saying many years ago that he wants people to think of high end video cards like luxury status symbols, like luxury cars. I think this is really happening now, with all types of PC hardware. Most people don't "need" this card and there are much cheaper cards that run most games very well, but there will still be a high demand for it. The same thing is happening with motherboards and other items that used to be much cheaper in the past. The whole desktop PC itself is becoming niche these days and is used mainly by gamers and content creators, and only the former tend to build their own PCs.
 

sontin

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2011
3,273
149
106
nVidia is putting out GPUs which are much faster than console at the same price point. So everything above is really "luxury". That is one of the biggest problem with Microsoft and Sony. Using the same supplier limits every invention and performance difference. Microsoft pushed really hard with the first Xbox and 360. Best and fastest hardware at their time. Now you can buy a two years old RTX2070 with the same performance like a PS5...
 
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wanderica

Senior member
Oct 2, 2005
218
42
91
For me it's so unreal to have theese discussions. I'm stuck in the old days when a switch meant 300% more performance per three years för 300 usd. It's so heavily imprinted in my scull it's a principle of mine: not to buy a new GPU until you at least have double the horsepower. I'm so far away buying something that gives you 60% more for 1400 usd that I don't know where to start. Nowadays I have the money, but this is ridiculous, I'm not paying these kind of sums anyways. "Back in my day" a top tier costed like 300 usd, what, the, hell, happened?! I'm not buying this shit. even if the shit performs 20% better than the competition. And i'm surely not buying low tier aka xx60-stuff for ~300usd either. what the hell happened.
I have to look back and wonder the same thing at times. Even with a lot more disposable income at 40+ years old, $1500 for the top performer just seems ludicrous. It's not inflation either when my, at launch, 1080 Ti was MUCH less. Used 2080 Tis are going for over $1000 in my area. It's enough to boggle the mind! It's extremely telling that I'm looking forward to (hoping for) an AMD card slotting in between the 3080 and 3090 for under $1000. From the information we have, I think that might be a likely scenario too. People talk about Radeon's "Zen moment," but gloss over the fact that Zen 1 was not exactly the industry leader that Zen 2 is. I think it far more likely that AMD will simply compete at the high end, and not rule the roost in a single genereation. However, that alone will sell tons of cards if they can do it for less than $1000. Nvidia's offerings this generation most certainly don't give me the "warm and fuzzy" that they have in the past.I'm sure that the 3090 will be the best you can buy, but I'm not so sure that it will be anything more than a halo product. This is the most interesting GPU year in decades, and if AMD can keep up their stated yearly cadence, then the next few years should be even better.
 

raghu78

Diamond Member
Aug 23, 2012
4,093
1,474
136
nVidia is putting out GPUs which are much faster than console at the same price point. So everything above is really "luxury". That is one of the biggest problem with Microsoft and Sony. Using the same supplier limits every invention and performance difference. Microsoft pushed really hard with the first Xbox and 360. Best and fastest hardware at their time. Now you can buy a two years old RTX2070 with the same performance like a PS5...
Which Nvidia GPU at $500 is faster than the 12.15 TF Xbox Series X GPU. It surely is not the RTX 2070 Super. Not even the RTX 2080 Super at $700 is faster. RDNA2 has higher perf/clock vs RDNA. That Series X GPU in a console with close to the metal optimizations and a hyper efficient game console OS and driver is going to compete with a RTX 2080 Ti in raw GPU performance (definitely on achievable performance) . Even the so called RTX 3070 Ti rumoured to be a 12 TF GPU on Samsung 8nm is going to be roughly on par at $500 for the GPU alone, while the entire Series X system is likely to sell at $500. Funnily enough the Series X system will draw around 200w while the 3070 Ti is rumoured to draw 250w for GPU alone. Nvidia is not going to get away from the laws of physics. Transistor performance matters. Nvidia bet wrongly and the results are not going to look good for power efficiency.
 
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Stuka87

Diamond Member
Dec 10, 2010
5,488
1,277
136
nVidia is putting out GPUs which are much faster than console at the same price point. So everything above is really "luxury". That is one of the biggest problem with Microsoft and Sony. Using the same supplier limits every invention and performance difference. Microsoft pushed really hard with the first Xbox and 360. Best and fastest hardware at their time. Now you can buy a two years old RTX2070 with the same performance like a PS5...
You do know that a console is an entire machine right? A $500 GPU is useless without the $1200 PC for it to go into.
 

badb0y

Diamond Member
Feb 22, 2010
4,012
27
91
nVidia is putting out GPUs which are much faster than console at the same price point. So everything above is really "luxury". That is one of the biggest problem with Microsoft and Sony. Using the same supplier limits every invention and performance difference. Microsoft pushed really hard with the first Xbox and 360. Best and fastest hardware at their time. Now you can buy a two years old RTX2070 with the same performance like a PS5...
What? Is this a parody post?
 
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Konan

Senior member
Jul 28, 2017
360
291
106
I’m looking at the 3090 the same way I’d look at a threadripper. I could afford it and I'm sure it would be great to have but can’t justify the cost. The pricing just puts it in yet another higher tier.

The actual 080Ti is missing here likely to show up later maybe.

It’s probably going to come down to a 3080, the AMD part that will be similar, or even possibly an AMD part that might be higher but not so high as the 3090.

One thing is for sure, I don’t want it to be an easy decision. When I know it’s not easy... that will be a good reflection of competition, so I only hope.
 
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sontin

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2011
3,273
149
106
You mean the 350W? Why not.
Otherwise this katcorgi guy hints at 35b xtors. Only possible on TSMCs 7nm process.
 

Glo.

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2015
4,836
3,457
136

So it is 7 nm 350W TDP GPU.

7 nm process, with 350W TDP o_O

Still, its 50W less than Core i9-10900K :p
 

nnunn

Junior Member
Jan 22, 2009
6
0
66
With 350W TDP?
If default TDP is actually more like 250W (not 350W), then my guess is that NV designed their reference 3090 so that enthusiasts who edit their BIOS to remove power limits won't kill their board?

Also guessing that NV demo holodeck will require 3090.
And that NV will suggest boosting power.
Hence the funky cooler.
 

Glo.

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2015
4,836
3,457
136
IF RTX 3070 is 220W TDP, then... Kopite once again might be right, and RTX 3070 Ti also exists, and it will be 250W TDP.

Look at the specs.

Kopite nailed everything.
 

sontin

Diamond Member
Sep 12, 2011
3,273
149
106

So it is 7 nm 350W TDP GPU.

7 nm process, with 350W TDP o_O

Still, its 50W less than Core i9-10900K :p
And only 50W more than Vega7 with 3,5x more transistors.
Oh maybe we should talk again how AMD will beat nVidia.

And dont forget guys: That just the low end GPUs. High-end is coming next year!
 

Glo.

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2015
4,836
3,457
136
And only 50W more than Vega7 with 3,5x more transistors.
Oh maybe we should talk again how AMD will beat nVidia.

And dont forget guys: That just the low end GPUs. High-end is coming next year!
Stop making damage control for Nvidia.
 

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